BK KI300 &KA310 Question

[flysamo]

just saw an ad in AOPA mag that both units are now available, hard to believe, question is does the gyro KG102 package remain or can it be removed, vacuum system, would like to dump KI 265 -255 flight director and go glass in my ovation, how much work is required to install.

[LANCECASPER]

16 minutes ago, flysamo said:

just saw an ad in AOPA mag that both units are now available, hard to believe, question is does the gyro KG102 package remain or can it be removed, vacuum system, would like to dump KI 265 -255 flight director and go glass in my ovation, how much work is required to install.

The KG102 runs the HSI, so it has to stay if you keep the King HSI. If you go the KI300 and the KA310 route then you could dump the King HSI and put in a G5 HSI. By the time you do all of that though you might be close to what it costs to put in an Aspen (and an Aspen EA-100) to replace the KI-256 and the King HSI. 

[FoxMike]

I talked to King salesman and some avionics shops at OSH.  Apparently the KI 300 and 310 are approved for installation in an aircraft but are not approved to eb hooked up to the autopilot.  those approves will be coming along in the future.  It is probably to soon to jump on the King Bandwagon.

 

[Mark89114]

16 minutes ago, FoxMike said:

I talked to King salesman and some avionics shops at OSH.  Apparently the KI 300 and 310 are approved for installation in an aircraft but are not approved to eb hooked up to the autopilot.  those approves will be coming along in the future.  It is probably to soon to jump on the King Bandwagon.

 

Too soon?????  Over statement of the century.....it has only been 4+ years?  I think the price point is too high for what we are getting.

 

[flysamo]

typical bk delays, if unit will work, it would nice if it was plug and play, or is that to much to hope for

[MIm20c]

20 minutes ago, flysamo said:

typical bk delays, if unit will work, it would nice if it was plug and play, or is that to much to hope for

The plug and play aspect died three years ago when the ki300 became the sandia 340. I would expect the install cost to be very similar to the aspen.

[jaylw314]

Just now, MIm20c said:

The plug and play aspect died three years ago when the ki300 became the sandia 340. I would expect the install cost to be very similar to the aspen.

What is the "plug and play" thing you guys are talking about?

[MIm20c]

Just now, jaylw314 said:

What is the "plug and play" thing you guys are talking about?

The first unit was supposed to slide in and plug into the existing wiring harness.  Then the unit could be programmed by computer and away you go. Now you have to mount the Aspen ki310 et al. 

[jaylw314]

Just now, MIm20c said:

The first unit was supposed to slide in and plug into the existing wiring harness.  Then the unit could be programmed by computer and away you go. Now you have to mount the Aspen ki310 et al. 

 

Got it, thanks

[FoxMike]

On the subject of wiring.  I do not know this for certain but have been told that the wiring should be straight forward.  Calibration is done directly on the KI 300 and should not be a big deal..  The KI 256 was a pain to setup.  Mounting the 310 may or may not be a project.  I have a Sandia 340 it is easy to remove and reinstall.  You do have to tap the static and pitot lines which might be a problem in some cases.  The concern I have is that my 340 does not always show wings level when the wings are level.  It may be off one or two degrees.  Hand flying is no problem but the autopilot may start a correction that will be annoying.  Also when flying in a lot of turbulence the instrument can react slowly getting back to wings level. Again hand flying is ok but the autopilot may not work as well as you are used to.  

[Austintatious]

My aircraft has a G5 HSI and a 256 ADI//FD.... I have been watching this KI300/310 for a while now and I am so annoyed.  I fail to see how in this modern age of electronics that a true plug and play replacement cannot be made for the 256.   I am wearing a WATCH that can tell me barometric pressure, is a standalone Cell phone, has GPS, a battery that last for days, contains accelerometers, can check my heart rate ,  is waterproof to 150m and cost $400.00

It is sounding like to get a K300/310 going is going to be 5k+ in parts and probably another 2k in installation.  So probably 7k...  Wont cost much more to just go with a Garmin AP and G5 for the ADI.  Then at least you get a lot more features (alt pre-select, passive flight envelope protection) and have matching G5's.

Who on earth is going to buy one of these KI300/310s?  I am the Ideal target buyer and I have all but written it off.

 

[Steve W]

6 hours ago, Austintatious said:

 

Who on earth is going to buy one of these KI300/310s?  I am the Ideal target buyer and I have all but written it off.

 

All the purchasers of the new King AeroCruze 230

Hahahahahaahahaaha

Sorry.

 

 

[jaylw314]

8 hours ago, Austintatious said:

My aircraft has a G5 HSI and a 256 ADI//FD.... I have been watching this KI300/310 for a while now and I am so annoyed.  I fail to see how in this modern age of electronics that a true plug and play replacement cannot be made for the 256.   I am wearing a WATCH that can tell me barometric pressure, is a standalone Cell phone, has GPS, a battery that last for days, contains accelerometers, can check my heart rate ,  is waterproof to 150m and cost $400.00

$400 for a watch?  That's it, you're no longer in the CB club! 

My $25 Timex broke after eight years, so I bought a $40 Timex... 

[Austintatious]

2 hours ago, jaylw314 said:

$400 for a watch?  That's it, you're no longer in the CB club! 

My $25 Timex broke after eight years, so I bought a $40 Timex... 

well, watches are a true marvel when it comes to what they can cost...  You can buy them at a dollar store or spend millions on one.  

At least with my 400.00 watch, It can make a phone call!

[globalpolygraph]

I too am waiting for the approval on this pair of units to replace my 256 to go vacuum free.  I have $7K in my budget but not $12K+ for the other options (Aspen with drivers or new AP).  Have been waiting for two years so can probably wait a little longer.  After all they did say 3rd quarter 2019 didn't they? 

[BarkerBK]

On 9/4/2019 at 5:18 PM, globalpolygraph said:

I too am waiting for the approval on this pair of units to replace my 256 to go vacuum free.  I have $7K in my budget but not $12K+ for the other options (Aspen with drivers or new AP).  Have been waiting for two years so can probably wait a little longer.  After all they did say 3rd quarter 2019 didn't they? 

You can be done waiting! 

Cheers, 

89800004-098 AeroFlight AML Rev 1.pdf

[Niko182]

32 minutes ago, PearceBK said:

You can be done waiting! 

Cheers, 

89800004-098 AeroFlight AML Rev 1.pdf 2.18 MB · 1 download

If you don't mind me asking why did you do only the M20J, K, and S. the majority of the king autopilots are on the Bravos, Ovations, and M20K's. none were installed in the M20S since they used Stec's, and only the newer M20J's had them installed.

[MIm20c]

2 hours ago, Niko182 said:

If you don't mind me asking why did you do only the M20J, K, and S. the majority of the king autopilots are on the Bravos, Ovations, and M20K's. none were installed in the M20S since they used Stec's, and only the newer M20J's had them installed.

Probably a numbers game right now, ~500 long body aircraft vs ~2k mid body. I assume they will add the R and M eventually. 

[Airways]

7 hours ago, PearceBK said:

You can be done waiting! 

Cheers, 

89800004-098 AeroFlight AML Rev 1.pdf 2.18 MB · 12 downloads

Joy ! Now you’re at it, please file for STC with EASA as wel 

[PTK]

On 8/13/2019 at 11:23 AM, FoxMike said:

I talked to King salesman and some avionics shops at OSH.  Apparently the KI 300 and 310 are approved for installation in an aircraft but are not approved to eb hooked up to the autopilot.  those approves will be coming along in the future.  It is probably to soon to jump on the King Bandwagon.

This makes exactly “zero” sense.  It is also contradictory to BK info. Either the salesman was grossly misinformed or you misunderstood. Of what use is the KA310 autopilot adapter if not to be interfaced to the autopilot?!

Excerpt from BK publication:

 “When paired with the KA 310, the AeroFlight KI 300 replaces the KI 255, KI 256 and the KG 258 with no changes to your instrument panel. KAP 100, 150, 200 and KFC 150, 200, 225 autopilots are natively supported using the AeroFlight KA 310 autopilot interface. The autopilot can be aligned and the air data computer calibrated, both with AeroFlight in the panel, simplifying installation and maintenance.”

 

[PTK]

On 9/4/2019 at 7:18 PM, globalpolygraph said:

I too am waiting for the approval on this pair of units to replace my 256 to go vacuum free.  I have $7K in my budget but not $12K+ for the other options (Aspen with drivers or new AP).  Have been waiting for two years so can probably wait a little longer.  After all they did say 3rd quarter 2019 didn't they? 

KI300 with KA310 and a G5 HSI would be a sweet set up! And Garmin just added OAT, TAS and wind speed/direction to the G5! Personally though I’d like to see some data from a significant sample size of installed 300/310 units to put me at ease that they work well. Sandia has had some issues. I need to be convinced that they are not problematic like the Aspens with their ACU and 310. These also have been plagued with failure issues.

[FoxMike]

FYI for those who want to upgrade to the KI300.  I just spoke to Sarasota Avionics.  They have 10 KI300s and KI310 in stock which they would love to sell but right now you can only install then in PA46 aircraft.  Reason they can install in the Malibu is  that they did an STC on that aircraft.  King plans to use this STC to create an AML which will list all the Mooneys  and other airplanes that have King autopilots.  Who knows maybe be Sun-n-fun they get some of this done.

[Andy95W]

8 hours ago, FoxMike said:

Who knows maybe be Sun-n-fun they get some of this done.

 

Yes, without a doubt, Sun-n-Fun 2017 will bring a lot of big announcements from Bendix King!

 

 

[Austintatious]

19 hours ago, FoxMike said:

FYI for those who want to upgrade to the KI300.  I just spoke to Sarasota Avionics.  They have 10 KI300s and KI310 in stock which they would love to sell but right now you can only install then in PA46 aircraft.  Reason they can install in the Malibu is  that they did an STC on that aircraft.  King plans to use this STC to create an AML which will list all the Mooneys  and other airplanes that have King autopilots.  Who knows maybe be Sun-n-fun they get some of this done.

Huh?

 

The Approved model list posted above has a lot more than a PA46 on it.

[Hillard]

I’ve had a ki300/310 fitted but have only been able to use it for about 2 hours so far (too much bushfire smoke where I live).  The unit looks and feel pretty good and flew a coupled RNAV well.  However, I had a failure on my last flight when the ki300 failed with red bars across everything.  It was a 35 degree day and the aircraft had been in the sun all day so I suspect it had overheated as my ipad shut down as well.  The speed and altitude tapes came back after about 15 mins and the ah did briefly before staying off for the rest of the flight.  It first showed “heating” and then “aligning” but did not show anything other than red bars.  At that stage, I’d not known how to force it to shutdown and restart but I do now.  The following day I started the plane on the ground and everything worked.  I retained my vac system on my no 2 ah so it just meant that i needed to hand fly.
I’m travelling now and will be back later this month. Smoke permitting, I’ll then do some extended flying to better test everything.  I’ll try to fly it on a hot day to see whether the ki300 shutdown will happen again and whether a reset will fix it.
Btw the autopilot put the airplane into a steep bank before the ki300 failed presumably because it puts out garbage before it fails.