Re-install turbo normalizer at overhaul

[jasong]

I'm toying with the idea of picking up a Mooney that already has a turbo normalizer installed (Ray Jay).  The engine is mid-time but it crossed my mind what would happen at overhaul.

Has anyone been through an overhaul and re-installed an aftermarket turbo normalizer like this?  Is it a major undertaking, or is it more straight forward than the original install, which I understand is quite an undertaking?

[jetdriven]

I dont think it would be such a huge deal, and it does add a lot of utility to the aircraft.  You will probably have to overhaul the turbocharger when you do the engine, but thats 1000 hours from now.  A 201 muffler isnt too cheap either if you go back to the NA route. 

[bradf1975]

I bought a M20-E with a low mid time engine turbo normalized. The turbo worked fine when I bought the plane. I bougt it in TN and the previous owner never used the turbo below 9000'. Afew months later I was departing KGUC, (7700msl) eguaged the turbo and nothing happened for 5 minutes. I was light, and it was cold that day so I had enough power to maintain a decent climb. After 5 min the turbo came alive and the manifold pressure went through the roof. Upon my return to KAPA I had the shop check it out. Apparently the former lack of use caused a carbon buildup in the bearings that slowed the initial spoolup of the turbo. The overhaul and labor cost about $5k. I love the turbo and it is worth every penny to me flying in the mountains most of the time. If I had it to do over I would have had checked at least the inlet side of the turbo and the freedom of the bearings before purchase.

[jetdriven]

?

[Steve Dawson]

We used to use Rayjay turbos similar to whats used in the turbo normalized system. We would get over 45psi (~95in mp) and after 4 or 5 runs rebuild them in about 40 minutes. The cost was about $150.00. Of course if they malfunctioned you would just slow down and pull over. I believe they were only designed for 5-15 psi and as long as you kept a constant clean supply of oil to them they'd last quite awhile. We started using Garret style turbos and would install dual ceramic bearings in them and wouldn't have any problems getting 50psi and having them last a season. There was such a decrease in friction with this style that after the run with the engine shut off the turbo would continue to spool for over a minute.

Although after the run when it was cooled down we would check the condition by removing the exhaust pipe on the turbine side and spin the wheel by hand. It's unfortunate that there's so much to get an approval on something that's vastly more reliable and easier to use than the 1950's technology. 

[bradf1975]

[Shadrach]

Quote: jetdriven

i think the turbo spins albeit slowly even when not used.  Coking and binding of the bearing most likely occurred because of high oil temps and not letting it idle for 5 minutes before shutting down. 

[jelswick]

Quote: Shadrach

 I have no dog in this hunt, as my turbo experience consists of about 5 hrs in a C421. 

However, the dudes at APS challenge the utility of this and do not reccomend it; nor do the TAT folks (TN systems for BOs, C177, SR22 etc). APS says they have analyzed the tempature of turbos in all phases of operations. They're claiming that the traditional "5 Min idle" is a bad idea as it serves no purpose and actually increases the temp of the turbo from its coolest point which is short final/flare. YMMV...

[KLRDMD]

This buggy software logged me in as someone else. I posted the above.

[M20F-1968]

I was looking through old posts and found this one.  If you are still looking for RayJay turbonormalized planes, you should be aware that you should be overhauling the turbo at time of engine overhaul.  Also, RayJay used a faily thin stainless steel for the exhause pipes and the same material foir the wastegate.  This was a mistake since they do degrade and need replacement sooner than might be expected. 

The utility of the system is excellent. 

FYI: I have a newly rebuilt system, built with thicker stainelss stell in the pipes and a beefier wastegate.  I also have a good second set of pipes if you find a plane with a system that needs them.  You can e-mail me at johnabreda@yahoo.com or call me at (617) 877-0025.

Thanks,

John Breda

[Chessieretriever]

I have a '63 Ranger with the Rayjay kit and would not trade it for anything. You can use it if you want to cruise at higher elevations or just go NA down low with minimal penalty. I did not realize how attractive this set up was until I flew with a friend in his M20E and could only get above the weather with a tremendous amount of effort due to the lower engine output. My recomendation is to keep it and use it from time to time to make sure everything works.

 

 

[M20F-1968]

These are spare parts for me and they need a good home with someone with an E or F model. 

There is a complete RayJay normalier system and a second set of exhaust pipes available.

John Breda

[knute]

Prices?

[TonyPynes]

would be interesting to know what the turbo normalizer costs and how much effort to install.

[Ned Gravel]

Quote: AustinPynes

would be interesting to know what the turbo normalizer costs and how much effort to install.

[hobbit64]

Sorry, but what is an 'AMU'?

[1964-M20E]

I'm guessing but 1 (aviation monetary unit) AMU = $1,000

[hobbit64]

Ok, thanks.