Scrappy Alan's new Mooney

[Hank]

Eric, do you know anyone with an A or G36 you could use? Those big barn doors behind the wing give great access.

Steingar, my C is a great traveling machine, but sometimes the closest field to where I want to go is not paved. My Mooney handles them well.

P.S.--just noticed if you look closely you can see my [electric] gear is about half-retracted. The runway is 3500' long at 40 msl [a 10-minute drive to the beach in NC; no facilities, FBO or shelter].

Edited December 1, 2015 by Hank

[steingar]

39 minutes ago, Hank said:

Steingar, my C is a great traveling machine, but sometimes the closest field to where I want to go is not paved. My Mooney handles them well.

Keep it in mind.  The M20C strands short, and it wouldn't take much more than a gopher hole to cause a prop strike.  The rule is simple, the airplane handles it well until it doen't, and at that point you likely have the mother of all repairs.  I've seen it happen.  If you're going into turf that Skylane is a much better choice.

[Andy95W]

17 hours ago, 201er said:

All's I know is that I never thought plaid could be that fashionable.  

[Marauder]

17 hours ago, 201er said:

All's I know is that I never thought plaid could be that fashionable.  

Knowing Alan, he probably got a deal on the plaid stuff.

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[aviatoreb]

2 hours ago, Hank said:

Eric, do you know anyone with an A or G36 you could use? Those big barn doors behind the wing give great access.

No - I'm telling you - I live in noWheresville, USA. (And I like that).  But at my sleepy little airport, there is nothing to rent or borrow.  There is not much there.  There is a 172 that scares me a bit but otherwise it would be fine on a one time basis.  There is a guy with a SR20 but I am not proficient in it.  There is a guy with a piper comanche, but again...not Im not multi.  And that is the complete list of airplanes that are not too sketchy.  Oh there is a King Air and a Cessna Citation - those are both nice - but not for loan.  Anyway, most of the airplanes at my little rural airport are the sort of put-around poorly kept airplanes you find at a small airport.  My Mooney is the nicest one there!  This mission to get my uncle is the first time I am feeling like my airplane is the wrong one.

[Marauder]

2 hours ago, Hank said: Eric, do you know anyone with an A or G36 you could use? Those big barn doors behind the wing give great access.

No - I'm telling you - I live in noWheresville, USA. (And I like that).  But at my sleepy little airport, there is nothing to rent or borrow.  There is not much there.  There is a 172 that scares me a bit but otherwise it would be fine on a one time basis.  There is a guy with a SR20 but I am not proficient in it.  There is a guy with a piper comanche, but again...not Im not multi.  And that is the complete list of airplanes that are not too sketchy.  Oh there is a King Air and a Cessna Citation - those are both nice - but not for loan.  Anyway, most of the airplanes at my little rural airport are the sort of put-around poorly kept airplanes you find at a small airport.  My Mooney is the nicest one there!  This mission to get my uncle is the first time I am feeling like my airplane is the wrong one.

I ran into the same thing when my aging father-in-law who loved to fly with me was just not able to do the contorting required to get in my Mooney. I rented 172s for those flights. I also worry as I get older, if I will have problems getting in and out.

Heck, I need a PVC pipe today to reach the fuel selector.

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[Shadrach]

2 hours ago, steingar said:

Keep it in mind.  The M20C strands short, and it wouldn't take much more than a gopher hole to cause a prop strike.  The rule is simple, the airplane handles it well until it doen't, and at that point you likely have the mother of all repairs.  I've seen it happen.  If you're going into turf that Skylane is a much better choice.

How much prop clearance on the skylane? A properly set up Mooney has ~10" of prop clearance, certainly not huge, but adequate for all of the grass I've been into.  182s have a heavy front end. Our local short field drome (2W2 Clearview) has destroyed the firewalls of numerous Cessnas over the years. I saw a Mooney that had been towed out of the weeds with the gear intact. The funny thing is Mooney's have this reputation, but I've seen far more 182s (both FG and RG) in our local shop with buckled firewalls, collapsed gear and "shortened" props than any other make and model..by a large margin.  Anecdotal I know, but food for thought none the less.

Below was the most recent. I wish I had kept the all of the pics. The nose strut actually penetrated the footwell.  From the looks of the prop, I think he tried to taxi back to the hangar...

http://www.ntsb.gov/_layouts/ntsb.aviation/brief.aspx?ev_id=20150709X34206&key=1&queryId=80183703-3cbc-4891-aa13-1bef872bf13c&pgno=1&pgsize=20

 

[Shadrach]

55 minutes ago, Marauder said:

I ran into the same thing when my aging father-in-law who loved to fly with me was just not able to do the contorting required to get in my Mooney. I rented 172s for those flights. I also worry as I get older, if I will have problems getting in and out.

Heck, I need a PVC pipe today to reach the fuel selector.

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My 78yr old father can still reach the fuel selector and has no problems with ingress and egress...his problem is that he lacks the desire to maintain currency.

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Marauder said:

I ran into the same thing when my aging father-in-law who loved to fly with me was just not able to do the contorting required to get in my Mooney. I rented 172s for those flights. I also worry as I get older, if I will have problems getting in and out.

Heck, I need a PVC pipe today to reach the fuel selector.

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Shrinking arms with aging, very strange!

Clarence

[Alan Fox]

6 hours ago, Shadrach said:

Alan,

What's the useful load on that bird?

1290 lbs , 92 gals 88 useable , 138 knots indicated at 2300 rpm and 20 inches , I cant believe I flew 20 years without flying one of these , I always scoffed at them because the 172 was such a mushwagon , I have to tell you its a HOOT !!!!   ,   It will actually fly straight and level at about 45 Knots.... I haven't calculated the fuel burn , and I don't want to , The RGs have a 540 Lycoming , Even stinkypants had to admit he loved it......Climb of about 1500 FPM at 120 Knots..... 

[Alan Fox]

54 minutes ago, Shadrach said:

How much prop clearance on the skylane? A properly set up Mooney has ~10" of prop clearance, certainly not huge, but adequate for all of the grass I've been into.  182s have a heavy front end. Our local short field drome (2W2 Clearview) has destroyed the firewalls of numerous Cessnas over the years. I saw a Mooney that had been towed out of the weeds with the gear intact. The funny thing is Mooney's have this reputation, but I've seen far more 182s (both FG and RG) in our local shop with buckled firewalls, collapsed gear and "shortened" props than any other make and model..by a large margin.  Anecdotal I know, but food for thought none the less.

Below was the most recent. I wish I had kept the all of the pics. The nose strut actually penetrated the footwell.  From the looks of the prop, I think he tried to taxi back to the hangar...

http://www.ntsb.gov/_layouts/ntsb.aviation/brief.aspx?ev_id=20150709X34206&key=1&queryId=80183703-3cbc-4891-aa13-1bef872bf13c&pgno=1&pgsize=20

 

Actually the clearance is similar to the Mooney , The prop is HUGE , the firewalls are from people landing on the nose , trying to fly it like a 172......I had a tough time in the transition from the Beech , as the Beech you can basically stop flying once you hit ground effect , (almost lands itself at any speed) , The Cessna will keep flying until it is stopped , and the wing is super high lift , If you hit the brakes before you raise the flaps , you flat spot the tires......  I enter the flare at about 50 knots , and hold it a few inches off the runway reducing the power......A lot more technique than the Beech or Mooney ,   I have to flip a Mooney next ,  I should have bought the TLS that Hose' listed , but Lance got it , a smoking deal....

[Shadrach]

4 hours ago, n74795 said:

1290 lbs , 92 gals 88 useable , 138 knots indicated at 2300 rpm and 20 inches , I cant believe I flew 20 years without flying one of these , I always scoffed at them because the 172 was such a mushwagon , I have to tell you its a HOOT !!!!   ,   It will actually fly straight and level at about 45 Knots.... I haven't calculated the fuel burn , and I don't want to , The RGs have a 540 Lycoming , Even stinkypants had to admit he loved it......Climb of about 1500 FPM at 120 Knots..... 

I'm glad you're having fun with it! That nose strut looks like it needs a shot!

[jetdriven]

8 hours ago, N1395W said:

All's I know is that I never thought plaid could be that fashionable.  

It's a new thing.  Alan is a lumbersexual. 

[Alan Fox]

8 hours ago, Shadrach said:

I'm glad you're having fun with it! That nose strut looks like it needs a shot!

No , you have to collapse it with the brakes , or it will only steer a few degrees... 

[MyNameIsNobody]

11 hours ago, jetdriven said:

It's a new thing.  Alan is a lumbersexual. 

That's classic.  Thank you for the chuckle.  How about Lumbrasexual?  Sounds sexier as it has bra in it?

Definition:  Lumbrasexual-The wearing of multiple layers of flannel and wool in plural colors and designs to create functional warm sporty apparel for men that do...vs watch others doing.

[steingar]

17 hours ago, Shadrach said:

How much prop clearance on the skylane? A properly set up Mooney has ~10" of prop clearance, certainly not huge, but adequate for all of the grass I've been into.  182s have a heavy front end. Our local short field drome (2W2 Clearview) has destroyed the firewalls of numerous Cessnas over the years. I saw a Mooney that had been towed out of the weeds with the gear intact. The funny thing is Mooney's have this reputation, but I've seen far more 182s (both FG and RG) in our local shop with buckled firewalls, collapsed gear and "shortened" props than any other make and model..by a large margin.  Anecdotal I know, but food for thought none the less.

Do keep in mind that Skylanes are back country aircraft, that's part of their mission.  Mooneys are travel machines.  I wouldn't hesitate to take a Skylane into a turf strip where i would with a Mooney.  I doubt I'm alone in that perception.  Hence the Skylanes see that sort of action more often.  Sampling error 101.

[jrwilson]

41 minutes ago, steingar said:

Do keep in mind that Skylanes are back country aircraft, that's part of their mission.  Mooneys are travel machines.  I wouldn't hesitate to take a Skylane into a turf strip where i would with a Mooney.  I doubt I'm alone in that perception.  Hence the Skylanes see that sort of action more often.  Sampling error 101.

ahhh....reasonable statistical results interpretation....I love it.

[DAVIDWH]

I am a little confused that moving a tiny gear lever up and down and occasionally moving a prop lever forward and back would constitute another rating.

Maybe a ( hope and change ) FAA moment??

Now moving from a HP to a chop chop, I would definitely understand.

[Shadrach]

1 hour ago, steingar said:

Do keep in mind that Skylanes are back country aircraft, that's part of their mission.  Mooneys are travel machines.  I wouldn't hesitate to take a Skylane into a turf strip where i would with a Mooney.  I doubt I'm alone in that perception.  Hence the Skylanes see that sort of action more often.  Sampling error 101.

We can agree that skylanes are perceived by tricycle gear only pilots as backcountry airplanes. I will keep in mind your opinion of what a skylane is.

The fact is the 182 has ~ 1 inch more +/-  a half inch  in prop clearance than a a short or medium bodied Mooney and the nose is significantly heavier.  Most bush pilots would call a skylane a traveling machine. A C180 or C185 is a back country plane.  I'm sure you're not alone in your perception, but it's interesting that as a new(ish) Mooney owner you feel that you must educate folks that have been successfully flying these birds for decades in and out of turf strips.  Perhaps you should view a few of Piper painter's videos.  He perceives his C model to be a back country plane and has a huge portfolio of proof that he is successful using it as one. It's not for everyone, but it puts all the hyperbole over farm strips and mowed turf in perspective.  Ground hazards will always be a risk to anything that's not on tundra tires or floats. Most planes are fine on grass if you're considerate of the situation.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vF7lnB3pYUQ

[Shadrach]

24 minutes ago, DAVIDWH said:

I am a little confused that moving a tiny gear lever up and down and occasionally moving a prop lever forward and back would constitute another rating.

Maybe a ( hope and change ) FAA moment??

Now moving from a HP to a chop chop, I would definitely understand.

It's been that way since I started flying back in '97.

[201er]

34 minutes ago, DAVIDWH said:

I am a little confused that moving a tiny gear lever up and down and occasionally moving a prop lever forward and back would constitute another rating.

I think the insurance companies would disagree...

[Shadrach]

57 minutes ago, DAVIDWH said:

I am a little confused that moving a tiny gear lever up and down and occasionally moving a prop lever forward and back would constitute another rating.

Maybe a ( hope and change ) FAA moment??

Now moving from a HP to a chop chop, I would definitely understand.

It's not a rating, it's an endorsement (just a sign off, like the tailwheel endorsement). A rating (like say a multi-engine rating) requires a check-ride with a DPE.

[steingar]

21 hours ago, Shadrach said:

We can agree that skylanes are perceived by tricycle gear only pilots as backcountry airplanes. I will keep in mind your opinion of what a skylane is.

The fact is the 182 has ~ 1 inch more +/-  a half inch  in prop clearance than a a short or medium bodied Mooney and the nose is significantly heavier.  Most bush pilots would call a skylane a traveling machine. A C180 or C185 is a back country plane.  I'm sure you're not alone in your perception, but it's interesting that as a new(ish) Mooney owner you feel that you must educate folks that have been successfully flying these birds for decades in and out of turf strips.  Perhaps you should view a few of Piper painter's videos.  He perceives his C model to be a back country plane and has a huge portfolio of proof that he is successful using it as one. It's not for everyone, but it puts all the hyperbole over farm strips and mowed turf in perspective.  Ground hazards will always be a risk to anything that's not on tundra tires or floats. Most planes are fine on grass if you're considerate of the situation.

You make a good point.  I will consider myself educated.  

[Seth]

Alan-

Congrats on the 182!!!  I've always been a big fan of the 182.  Much nicer in so many ways from a 172.

Did you sell the Bo? Are you still in the market for an E or F to fix up and sell?

Looking forward to meeting your new bird soon.

-Seth

 

 

 

[KSMooniac]

I flew one of those for ~50 hours in a flying club long ago and really liked it for travel. Fast enough, comfy, and carried a lot. Easy for IFR work too. Only down side was fuel burn and Cessna gear that I wouldn't want as a long term owner.

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