Loving my new 201

[teethdoc]

Finally got most of the bugs worked out. With Lopreti cowl, power flow, all the gap seals, we had a TAS of 167kts in cruise on 10.5gph and very little wind at 6500'. We were on flight following, but for some reason did not show up on flight aware.

[FAST FLIGHT OPTIONS LLC]

167 KTS TAS @ 6500? Humm.

[ottorecker]

To show up on flightaware.com have had good luck filing an IFR flight plan....but not picking up the clearance... My filed routing shows up along with my actual VFR track.  I almost always do this on longer flights and it is nice to have the IFR on file in case I need it.  I think it it might be a little easier for the controllers as well.

[M016576]

To show up on flightaware.com have had good luck filing an IFR flight plan....but not picking up the clearance... My filed routing shows up along with my actual VFR track. I almost always do this on longer flights and it is nice to have the IFR on file in case I need it. I think it it might be a little easier for the controllers as well.

I do the exact same thing. Just make sure the void time doesn't expire while en route. That way if you need it, the flight plan is there and ready to be activated, instead of having to file a "DRAFT" real time.

[Jeff_S]

Finally got most of the bugs worked out. With Lopreti cowl, power flow, all the gap seals, we had a TAS of 167kts in cruise on 10.5gph and very little wind at 6500'. We were on flight following, but for some reason did not show up on flight aware.

 

Yeah, I'd be curious to know a few more components of this. What RPM? I assume you were WOT. At 6500' 10.5 gph puts you right about best power setting. Also, how did you calculate TAS? Using the temperature adjustment on the ASI or do you have a digital air computer?

[fantom]

....and did you verify your TAS with a controlled 3 or 4 point test?

what you're reporting just seems highly unlikely given numerous other reports. Pilots have been known to exaggerate the speed of their planes and the size of their watches

[carusoam]

Teeth,

Post some photos and some data. Fans want to know!!!

Best regards,

-a-

[Bennett]

You are reporting TASs greater than mine for a J with the LoPresti cowl, one piece belly pan, PowerFlow exhaust system, two bladed Top Prop, just about all the speed mods available, and highly polished paint. You may be lighter than my typical flight, but I wish I could achieve those TASs. I've had LASAR check and "tune" my ailerons, flaps, etc, and the aircraft will fly hands off in trim, with the ball centered. Also I keep a fair amount of "stuff" in the baggage compartment to move the CG aft. It would be great to have some additional data for us to try and emulate your TASs. Thank you.

[teethdoc]

Don't crucify me yet.  All I have to go on for now is the TAS indicator built into the ASI.  What's going to be my most accurate way to test my numbers reported on the guage?  She is loaded with just about every speed mod you can think of (it was that way when I purchased.)  I can verify GS with the Garmin 430.  I'm hoping to go up for an hour or 2 tomorrow morning and I'll see what we can do.

[fantom]

Remember, we're talking TAS, not GS. To keep it simple:

 

Configure the airplane for the most efficient cruise power setting and looked at GPS derived ground speeds with that power setting flying four cardinal headings (N, S, E, W). That's the way you find out what your airplane will really do in level cruise. Forget the information off the airspeed indicator, just too much error in them. To find out how fast (or slow) your airplane really is, for a specific altitude set the power setting you want to test, hold altitude and heading very precisely and note GPS stabilized ground speeds while flying N, S, E and W, for several minutes to let everything settle down. Don't correct for any wind, just fly stabilized headings and altitude. Write the stabilized ground speed from the GPS for each stabilized heading. Add those four ground speeds up and divide by 4 to find the average. The result is your aircraft's true airspeed for the altitude and power setting you are flying. And it's very accurate.

 

Record the temp, IAS, altitude, RPM and MP, fuel flow, approximate weight, and number of coats of wax. Doing it a few times at differing altitudes will also be enlightening, and it should be a fun flight!

[FloridaMan]

My 67F with LoPresti cowl, powerflow exhaust, 201 glass, other speed mods and GAMI injectors is supposedly 158kts true at 10GPH. I haven't done the cardinal heading test, but it seems like I'm usually between 150 and 165kts GPS ground speed.  

 

http://mooneyspace.com/gallery/image/33968-img-2111/

[FAST FLIGHT OPTIONS LLC]

165 KTS ? Hummm

[teethdoc]

 

Remember, we're talking TAS, not GS. To keep it simple:

 

Configure the airplane for the most efficient cruise power setting and looked at GPS derived ground speeds with that power setting flying four cardinal headings (N, S, E, W). That's the way you find out what your airplane will really do in level cruise. Forget the information off the airspeed indicator, just too much error in them. To find out how fast (or slow) your airplane really is, for a specific altitude set the power setting you want to test, hold altitude and heading very precisely and note GPS stabilized ground speeds while flying N, S, E and W, for several minutes to let everything settle down. Don't correct for any wind, just fly stabilized headings and altitude. Write the stabilized ground speed from the GPS for each stabilized heading. Add those four ground speeds up and divide by 4 to find the average. The result is your aircraft's true airspeed for the altitude and power setting you are flying. And it's very accurate.

 

Record the temp, IAS, altitude, RPM and MP, fuel flow, approximate weight, and number of coats of wax. Doing it a few times at differing altitudes will also be enlightening, and it should be a fun flight!

 

Isn't this going to give me a true GS eliminating wind, but not TAS.  I thought the formula for TAS accounted for temp and altitude?  I'm learning here.

[rbridges]

IMO, I would expect low 160s.  My plane is spec'd out similarly but with the wimpier O-360, and I seem to get around 152-155 avg speeds.

[carusoam]

Byron, are you there?

I think this is one of his favorite topics, including the quicker, lower cost three point method with associated triginometry.

Best regards,

-a-

[fantom]

FWIW, my stock '78 J is good for about 159 KTAS at 2500 RPM and max power at 8000 feet.

 

If it was Air Force blue, you'd pick up about 5 knots

[Super Dave]

Isn't this going to give me a true GS eliminating wind, but not TAS.  I thought the formula for TAS accounted for temp and altitude?  I'm learning here.

Level flight TAS is equal to GS in a no wind condition. By flying the four headings and averaging the GS, you are attempting to remove wind from the equation.

[bumper]

My plane's faster than your plane, my plane's faster than yours , , , 

 

bumper

[TWinter]

As long as there is a safe take-off, efficient flight, everyone is fairly comfortable along the way, nobody needs the blue-bag and a safe landing.  Does not matter to me if it's 135,145,155,165..it's still faster than driving and so much more fun , plus sounds cool that you flew instead of driving . Obviously I like speed, just in large increments.

[Bennett]

Didn't mean to sound as though I thought you were exaggerating. I was hoping you had some sort of secret you could pass along to us fellow J owners . I was once a speed freak with my former Mooney, but now with my current airplane I prefer to fly at less than oxygen altitudes. Yet, I want to fly as efficiently, and quickly as possible, with a nod towards faster is better, even if I have to burn a bit more fuel. On longer flights such as San Carlos, CA to Scottsdale, AZ, I am willing to go well LOP, and give away a few knots to avoid an interim fuel stop. On short Hamburger Runs, I sometimes will run ROP, simply because I want to to go a bit faster, and I enjoy the relative speed increase. No one pays me to fly, and increasingly I use commercial air for business, so I am left with (Yea!) pure pleasure flying, and so my Mooney is a "toy" to enjoy, and I would rather spend more money on her than anything else I can think of. (Old age does that to you).  Anyway, have fun and enjoy life no matter what speed you fly at.  And, if you can really do 167 Kts TAS, please let us know how you do it.

[Skybrd]

 My 201 will do 160 knots with full power, 2500 rpms and using ram air. I use the GPS to determine TAS by slowly circling and noticing peak and low ground speeds. Using this method, I subtract the low from the peak and divide it by 2. That gives me the wind speed. Then I add this to the lower ground speed and that is the TAS. This method will also tell the wind direction. I used to figure this using a trigonometry method but this is easier. The Trig method would figure wind speed and direction and needed two ground speed inputs with directions for each.

[teethdoc]

I still have no idea what my TAS is other than the guage on the panel, but I am LOVING this plane.  It handles like a dream.  The complex requirement of 25h for my insurance is coming along great.  Flew up to KAVL and grabbed dinner and back last night.

[Parker_Woodruff]

Nothing out of the question about 167 KTAS.  My 1990 M20J-AT was pretty light and had a very clean airframe with minimal antennas and did not have the LoPresti cowl.  It did see 168 KTAS on one occasion (as calculated by the G-500).  I'm a LOP flyer, but I tried ROP a couple times to see what it'd do.

 

162-163 was not out of the question ROP.  Typically would fly a nice 150-155 KTAS while LOP.  I found 6000' and 10 degrees Celsius to be the best performance.

 

...I miss that plane almost as much as I miss the M20K.

[Steve Dawson]

I just retried a few scenarios again to checkout my TAS on my stock 201. I just completed having the annual and installing a new interior however the plane was still dirty from sitting in the shop for a few weeks.

4 direction GPS at 6000 ft showed 157 KTAS (dirty) (2500 rpm, wot)

4 direction GPS at 6500 ft showed 158.5 KTAS just waxed (2500 rpm, wot)

4 direction GPS at 6500 ft 161 KTAS (2600 rpm, wot, ram open)

4 direction GPS at 6500 ft 163 KTAS (2700 rpm, wot ram open)

The last three fights were during the same evening with air temp at 14c.

Weight wise, only myself and approximately 30 gallons of fuel. I believe I maybe able to get another knot or two with both installing weight in the baggage compartment and possibly twigging the rigging.

[aaronk25]

Did someone get ahold of the timing adjustment . And turn her up a bit???? Takes some hp to go that fast.