Just in a day's work for a 252

[BlueSky247]

What he said! Great pics.

 

I recently saw this approach in a hondajet marketing video. I like your version better. 

[Thomas 252]

Hi folks,

paul contacted me and told me about this thread. I was the pilot and it’s my 252. Happy to answer your questions:

- it’s a 252 with Monroy tanks, 105 gallons total 

- I usually fly 2.300RPM, 30“, 10.3gph LOP. However up high the MAP was between 27“ and 29“, FF on average during cruise was 9.5gph or 62%
- I have a stock steam gauge sixpack with the original airspeed indicator with TAS calculator. TAS was roughly 175kt. 
- average ground speed was 214kt, maximum 269kt but we took a picture showing 252kt :-)

- we used 73 gallons of fuel and still had 32 gallons in our tanks after landing, so more than 3 hours reserve (the king air crew we met was jealous)

- we didn’t use Gatorade bottles or travel John. Would be a mess in those life suits anyway. Actually we did not drink anything until 30 minutes before landing and it was no problem at all!

It was my longest flight so far and it was an experience, for sure. The whole trip was spectacular. 
BTW, on our way west we wanted to stay in Ilulissat, Greenland for two nights. We didn’t even think about not stopping in Greenland as we wanted to see the glacier. 
 

If you are interested, the whole story is on instagram: @flyawaywith_jz

Hope to see some of you somewhere in the world! 
 

Best,

Thomas

[Pinecone]

OK, those numbers look like how I cruise.

FYI, they do make systems for dry suit diving.  Pretty simple for males. Basically a condom with a hose that goes outside the suit.  Women are more complicated and involved a razor and glue.

 

[Will.iam]

4 hours ago, Thomas 252 said:

 However up high the MAP was between 27“ and 29“, FF on average during cruise was 9.5gph or 62%

-

Thomas

Was 27 and 29” by choice or was that the most you could get out of the turbo without having to go ROP at 25,000ft?

[exM20K]

6 hours ago, Thomas 252 said:

- we didn’t use Gatorade bottles or travel John. Would be a mess in those life suits anyway. Actually we did not drink anything until 30 minutes before landing and it was no problem at all!

Great stuff, and what an adventure.  Welcome to MooneySpace.  
I totally agree with the impracticality of Gatorade bottle, travel John etc when wearing a Gumby suit. The Diamond ferry pilots bring the planes over from Austria would wear adult diapers. Like having a potty in the plane, wearing Depends eliminates the bio-anxiety. And as with the potty, absent “gotta go” anxiety, it is rarely necessary.  Further, willing away 20-50 years of conditioning and letting go into a diaper would be really, really difficult.

 

-dan

[Thomas 252]

8 hours ago, Will.iam said:

Was 27 and 29” by choice or was that the most you could get out of the turbo without having to go ROP at 25,000ft?

It was the most we could get LOP. 

[Thomas 252]

9 hours ago, exM20K said:

Great stuff, and what an adventure.  Welcome to MooneySpace.  
I totally agree with the impracticality of Gatorade bottle, travel John etc when wearing a Gumby suit. The Diamond ferry pilots bring the planes over from Austria would wear adult diapers. Like having a potty in the plane, wearing Depends eliminates the bio-anxiety. And as with the potty, absent “gotta go” anxiety, it is rarely necessary.  Further, willing away 20-50 years of conditioning and letting go into a diaper would be really, really difficult.

 

-dan

Thx! The whole trip was an adventure!
I still get more and more impressed of the 252´s capabilities! After flying westbound over the North Atlantic up high we landed on a grass strip at 7.000ft density altitude in the Rockies (23S). There´s not too many airplanes out there that can do both...

The bladder management was no issue at all. We had roughly 10-12 legs of more than 4 hours and didn't have to use a bottle. We even weren`t thirsty at all. You just have to take it easy in the morning: just 1 coffee and half a glass of water. And we used every possibility to drain ourselves... ;-)

[Thomas 252]

12 hours ago, Pinecone said:

OK, those numbers look like how I cruise.

FYI, they do make systems for dry suit diving.  Pretty simple for males. Basically a condom with a hose that goes outside the suit.  Women are more complicated and involved a razor and glue.

 

Wouldn´t be fair for my girlfriend... ;-)

But as I said earlier - drinking and bladder management was no issue at all. At least on the long legs. We had one 2-hour-leg that bothered us... ;-)

 

[Pinecone]

George Braly wrote a piece for AVWEB back a long time ago about bladder and drinking management.  It had to do with salty snacks and sipping water at intervals.

The problem is, even though you do not feel thirsty, you are somewhat dehydrated.  By the time you feel thirsty, you are something like 20% down on needed fluid replenishment.  In fighters, we carried a couple of squeeze bottles or baby bottle to drink often to not reduce performance.

I saw a You Tube on a system for the 5th gen fighters that uses a vacuum system to remove the fluids when you pee so that it is comfortable and psychologically easier to go.

[Marc_B]

@Thomas 252 Thanks for posting!  I love hearing of awesome Mooney adventures that push the boundaries of what many pilots feel are possible and practical.  Hopefully paving the way for more of us to join in!  The Mooney, especially with Monroy tanks, is truly a traveling machine.  It's great to hear how it's done, what works and what doesn't!

[Stephan Kablitz]

I can offer some advice from my long years of flying sailplanes. On long cross-country flights I tend to drink very little and try to take on water through food: tomatoes, cucumber, watermelon etc. There is a physiological reason to this. When you drink, the water will take a „shortcut“ from your stomach to the kidneys and end up in the bladder much faster. The food will (at least partially) take the „long“ route. That way you can stay hydrated and keep the pressure from the bladder longer. I never found the above mentioned practices very attractive…

[Thomas 252]

55 minutes ago, Stephan Kablitz said:

I can offer some advice from my long years of flying sailplanes. On long cross-country flights I tend to drink very little and try to take on water through food: tomatoes, cucumber, watermelon etc. There is a physiological reason to this. When you drink, the water will take a „shortcut“ from your stomach to the kidneys and end up in the bladder much faster. The food will (at least partially) take the „long“ route. That way you can stay hydrated and keep the pressure from the bladder longer. I never found the above mentioned practices very attractive…

Good point. I didn’t know about the food point but we both had a good portion of grapes. I liked the juice in my mouth and the sugar prevented fatigue…

[Pinecone]

5 hours ago, Stephan Kablitz said:

I can offer some advice from my long years of flying sailplanes. On long cross-country flights I tend to drink very little and try to take on water through food: tomatoes, cucumber, watermelon etc. There is a physiological reason to this. When you drink, the water will take a „shortcut“ from your stomach to the kidneys and end up in the bladder much faster. The food will (at least partially) take the „long“ route. That way you can stay hydrated and keep the pressure from the bladder longer. I never found the above mentioned practices very attractive…

The other way to not shortcut the water is to only drink a sip or two, then wait.   The body can only deal with it at a certain rate.  Exceed that, it just passes through.

[exM20K]

How about 14.3hrs and 1866NM in a 231?

https://www.flightaware.com/live/flight/N5810T/history/20240805/1800Z/PADK/RJCC

Alaska to Japan.  Impressive.  Heck, getting it from NJ to Alaska is itself ambitious.

He's got a blog here: https://www.pieternel.net/rtw/

-dan

[Pinecone]

I am sure an aux tank was part of that flight.

[exM20K]

16 minutes ago, Pinecone said:

I am sure an aux tank was part of that flight.

In his blog, he shows a 100G turtle pack bladder. Undisclosed is the number of travel pee bags or little john's onboard.

-dan

[Pinecone]

Put 100 gallon aux in my plane and you would end up with 19 hours.  At 175 KTAS that is over 3000 miles no wind.

[Will.iam]

1 hour ago, Pinecone said:

Put 100 gallon aux in my plane and you would end up with 19 hours.  At 175 KTAS that is over 3000 miles no wind.

Except 204 gals at 5.8 puts your weight at 1182 not including you or anything else get out that overweight ferry permit and a 2 mile long runway 

[Will.iam]

3 hours ago, exM20K said:

How about 14.3hrs and 1866NM in a 231?

https://www.flightaware.com/live/flight/N5810T/history/20240805/1800Z/PADK/RJCC

Alaska to Japan.  Impressive.  Heck, getting it from NJ to Alaska is itself ambitious.

He's got a blog here: https://www.pieternel.net/rtw/

-dan

Wow he planned for 175mph and 13ish hours flight time but he is currently only getting 120mph and if he doesn’t find less headwinds it will be over 18hours. Hope he has the extra reserves!

[exM20K]

Looks like an improvement once he turns the corner

Average 8kt headwind for the whole trip.

-dan

[Fly Boomer]

3 hours ago, Pinecone said:

I am sure an aux tank was part of that flight.

Just looked and it says it's making 121 MPH while planned speed was 173 MPH.  Even with an aux tank, he may have to make a stop.

EDIT:  I see @Will.iam beat me to it.

[Will.iam]

23 minutes ago, exM20K said:

Looks like an improvement once he turns the corner

Average 8kt headwind for the whole trip.

-dan

Your data is overly optimistic as none of your data shows 120 gs at cruise in fact your worse speed is still 20 above what he is actually getting if the ads-b data is correct. 

[Will.iam]

I would be changing altitude to try and find better winds. 4000ft gets a 2 knot tailwind for a while. Much better than a headwind and not like there is mountains where he is flying. 

[Marc_B]

https://www.pieternel.net/rtw/
One of my friends follows Pieter and sent me this link. Interesting to see what led to a west circumnavigation and how he’s set up. No aux tanks in wings but a 100gal ferry tank so 170 gal useable.  Pretty cool!  A rare club for a rare breed of pilot. 

[exM20K]

3 hours ago, Will.iam said:

Your data is overly optimistic as none of your data shows 120 gs at cruise in fact your worse speed is still 20 above what he is actually getting if the ads-b data is correct. 

His InReach feed is here. https://share.garmin.com/pwnel
 

doing a lot better than flight aware estimates!