New Levels In Aeronautical Rudeness

[Pinecone]

13 hours ago, N201MKTurbo said:

Not to mention the cost! Sidewinders are $100,000. How much is a shotgun shell these days $0.75?

Multiply that by over 4x for the Sidewinder.  Almost $450,000 for a war shot.

The shotgun shell is about 3x.  00 Buck is about $2 per round these days.

[N201MKTurbo]

46 minutes ago, Pinecone said:

Multiply that by over 4x for the Sidewinder.  Almost $450,000 for a war shot.

The shotgun shell is about 3x.  00 Buck is about $2 per round these days.

Yea, should have looked it up. I worked on Javelin and it cost about $75000/round, the Sidewinder has more motor and needs more powerful steering, but the seeker is comparable. I figured about 30% more, but apparently not. 

[GeeBee]

1 hour ago, Pinecone said:

Use what you have.  A kill's a kill.

When I flew the A-10, when we landed to the NW, the disarm area had us pointing down the one parallel taxiway (see KMTN).    We would announce to tower when we checked in if we were disarming the guns, so they would keep that taxiway clear.  No real reason for civilian aircraft to be on that side, there is a parallel on the other side.

So we land and are in the disarming area.  A Piper lands and turns off the runway the wrong way.  Tower tells him to hold short of the parallel and he ignores and rolls out.  Tower calls us to stop disarm work due to the Piper.  A voice says, "We'll take them any way we can."  (We are on UHF, tower is on UHF and VHF, Piper is on VHF so only hears tower side.)  Tower asks, "Say Again."  Voice says, "A kill's a kill."  Tower SCREAMS, "Piper 1234 turn right IMMEDIATELY at the next taxiway.

 

You have to be pretty clueless to turn towards the ANG side of the field there.

[ilovecornfields]

7 hours ago, aviatoreb said:

tug his airplane someplace out of sight!  ...where did I park my airplane again?

 

[Fly Boomer]

4 hours ago, GeeBee said:

Yeah, I looked for keys thinking, "No one can be this stupid", but I was wrong. He took the keys with him. The thing is, there is a parking area 200' away which is where I park my vehicle, unless I am going to be gone overnight then I park it in my hangar. There was no excuse here other than being rude and inconsiderate. 

 

And lazy.

[ilovecornfields]

13 hours ago, GeeBee said:

Yeah, I looked for keys thinking, "No one can be this stupid", but I was wrong.

If I had a dollar for every time I’d thought that and been wrong I’d be burning Jet A. The other one I’m often wrong about is “there’s no way someone would try to stick that there.” I’m truly amazed by how many people apparently walk around their house naked and “fall on” things at regular intervals.

[Fly Boomer]

1 minute ago, ilovecornfields said:

If I had a dollar for every time I’d thought and been wrong I’d be burning Jet A. The other one I’m often wrong about is “there’s no way someone would try to stick that there.” I’m truly amazed by how many people apparently walk around their house naked and “fall on” things at regular intervals.

I don't even want to think about it.

[thinwing]

Last flight to Mcall Id from Ksac ,it is IFR the entire way with heavy smoke.Never saw the ground ...about 100 miles out I hear an inbound Citation  talking about approach request to Salt lake center.We also called right after and we advised we would set up for the Rnav and take the visual if conditions warrant.So that citation knew an IFR Mooney was behind him also inbound to the same airport.He lands and apparently drops his passenger off and immediately taxis back to opposite runway and takes off!Problem is I am mile out on final approach in poor visabilty and get a glimpse of him barreling down the runway right at me!Hey...you damned idiot didnt you hear my approach request while you were on center frequency?His answer was I was not correctly stating my position inbound!I go WTF ..as I have to sidestep the mooney to avoid a collision and go missed!I go back to center frequency and get climb in holding instructions for new approach...and guess what...that citation never called center for the 20 minutes Im climbing to MEA to either open his IFR or request clearance.He was scud running in less than mile vis in heavy smoke in mountainous terrain!

[ilovecornfields]

6 hours ago, thinwing said:

Last flight to Mcall Id from Ksac ,it is IFR the entire way with heavy smoke.Never saw the ground ...about 100 miles out I hear an inbound Citation  talking about approach request to Salt lake center.We also called right after and we advised we would set up for the Rnav and take the visual if conditions warrant.So that citation knew an IFR Mooney was behind him also inbound to the same airport.He lands and apparently drops his passenger off and immediately taxis back to opposite runway and takes off!Problem is I am mile out on final approach in poor visabilty and get a glimpse of him barreling down the runway right at me!Hey...you damned idiot didnt you hear my approach request while you were on center frequency?His answer was I was not correctly stating my position inbound!I go WTF ..as I have to sidestep the mooney to avoid a collision and go missed!I go back to center frequency and get climb in holding instructions for new approach...and guess what...that citation never called center for the 20 minutes Im climbing to MEA to either open his IFR or request clearance.He was scud running in less than mile vis in heavy smoke in mountainous terrain!

I told my son when he was little that if you see someone who’s obviously making a bad choice you should stay away from them because that’s probably not the only bad choice they’ll be making. It’s proven true so far and now I’ve even heard him say it to his friends. Plenty of examples in the last few years of people doing completely idiotic things in jets that few GA pilots would have attempted.

I had a near-miss at the same airport 30+ years ago when they cleared a Baron for an instrument approach to the opposite runway that I was landing at and he ended up missing me by about 100’ on the go-around. 

[Schllc]

25 minutes ago, thinwing said:

Last flight to Mcall Id from Ksac ,it is IFR the entire way with heavy smoke.Never saw the ground ...about 100 miles out I hear an inbound Citation  talking about approach request to Salt lake center.We also called right after and we advised we would set up for the Rnav and take the visual if conditions warrant.So that citation knew an IFR Mooney was behind him also inbound to the same airport.He lands and apparently drops his passenger off and immediately taxis back to opposite runway and takes off!Problem is I am mile out on final approach in poor visabilty and get a glimpse of him barreling down the runway right at me!Hey...you damned idiot didnt you hear my approach request while you were on center frequency?His answer was I was not correctly stating my position inbound!I go WTF ..as I have to sidestep the mooney to avoid a collision and go missed!I go back to center frequency and get climb in holding instructions for new approach...and guess what...that citation never called center for the 20 minutes Im climbing to MEA to either open his IFR or request clearance.He was scud running in less than mile vis in heavy smoke in mountainous terrain!

Uncontrolled fields really are the wild Wild West.  
It’s just like social media, people say things they would never say to your face. 
At uncontrolled fields people do things they can’t get away with where there is a tower. 
I know you guys say things happen at controlled fields but those are mostly mistakes, not people being jerks. 

[Andy95W]

On 4/12/2023 at 9:01 AM, GeeBee said:

 By this time I have no choice but to execute a go around. I move slightly to the right of the runway so I can see and avoid him as he lifts off. He then realizes what he did and says, "Oh sorry, my bad". I said, "I only called 6 times and you specifically two times". He says, "Hey buddy, we all make mistakes, OK?" I said, "I see you can transmit, but you don't listen".

I guess I’ll be the odd man out and question your behavior in this episode.  People do make mistakes.  In all of your hours, have you never keyed the mic and realized you had the volume down?  I bet you have.

The guy screwed up, admitted it, and said he was sorry.  Just do your go-around safely, knowing that the guy will (probably) try to do better the next time.

As for your other examples with parked cars etc.: yes, I agree, those guys were very rude and self centered.

[GeeBee]

13 minutes ago, Andy95W said:

I guess I’ll be the odd man out and question your behavior in this episode.  People do make mistakes.  In all of your hours, have you never keyed the mic and realized you had the volume down?  I bet you have.

The guy screwed up, admitted it, and said he was sorry.  Just do your go-around safely, knowing that the guy will (probably) try to do better the next time.

As for your other examples with parked cars etc.: yes, I agree, those guys were very rude and self centered.

Let's see, volume down but in the middle of his takeoff roll he discovers it and turns it up and he hears me...rigggghhhhhht. Tell me, how is it he heard the ASOS broadcast? (and the dog really did eat his homework)

[Andy95W]

Not my point.

The guy screwed up, admitted it, and said he was sorry.  Your transmissions did nothing to add to the situation other than make you feel better.  They certainly didn’t increase safety during the encounter.

[GeeBee]

21 minutes ago, Andy95W said:

Not my point.

The guy screwed up, admitted it, and said he was sorry.  Your transmissions did nothing to add to the situation other than make you feel better.  They certainly didn’t increase safety during the encounter.

What would have increased the safety? He got instant instruction i.e. "listen, not just transmit" although I doubt he took it to heart.

[ilovecornfields]

I actually don’t think @Andy95W was trying to be critical, just pointing out that we’re all human and we can all do better. Except for my AI bot.

[alextstone]

On 4/12/2023 at 12:27 PM, EricJ said:

If your alternator had failed and the battery was drooping your transmit power may have been low, so the others may not have been able to hear you as well.   It's not an excuse to not do a visual check for landing aircraft before entering a runway, though.

The blocked alley thing happens at a lot of airport hangar rows, and we do the dance in our alley all the time, because we have a fence at one end and only one way in and out.   Blocking somebody else's hangar door is a bit much, though.

One of my peeves is that the washrack is *always* empty *except* when I want to wash my airplane.   I don't know how people coordinate that, but they're consistent about it. 

All I can think about when I read your post is: "Ohhhh, wash-rack...fancy!  All we have is a five gallon bucket and a sun-damaged hose! (the brush went missing a while back)"

[Hank]

40 minutes ago, alextstone said:

All I can think about when I read your post is: "Ohhhh, wash-rack...fancy!  All we have is a five gallon bucket and a sun-damaged hose! (the brush went missing a while back)"

You're all spoiled city kids! I get by with a  squirter bottle of Wash n Wax and several terrycloth towels, which I even have to buy myself!

[Pinecone]

22 hours ago, N201MKTurbo said:

Yea, should have looked it up. I worked on Javelin and it cost about $75000/round, the Sidewinder has more motor and needs more powerful steering, but the seeker is comparable. I figured about 30% more, but apparently not. 

Inflation. 

An AIM-120 AMRAAM is over a million per shot.  AGM-88 AARM is $6 million each.

[N201MKTurbo]

20 hours ago, Fly Boomer said:

I don't even want to think about it.

Go to the Mutter Museum in Philly, they have a huge collection.

[Pinecone]

On 4/13/2023 at 9:43 PM, alextstone said:

All I can think about when I read your post is: "Ohhhh, wash-rack...fancy!  All we have is a five gallon bucket and a sun-damaged hose! (the brush went missing a while back)"

Our washrack is right outside my hangar.  No brush, no bucket, no hose.  Bring your own.  

I have ever seen anyone use it.  I don't, I use waterless product, Wash Wax All.

[N201MKTurbo]

Phoenix airports have wash racks, Mesa airports have wash racks. Chandler airports have a hose….

[glbtrottr]

KCPM is a pretty busy uncontrolled training field with 2 parallel runways. There is also a lot of helicopter traffic - I used to go there to do autorotations all the time before my Checkride.

Lately Robinson Helicopter has had 8LL have their pilots in training loiter on 25L chilling as if it was a helicopter pad with tons of traffic at the airport including other helicopters from other schools, effectively blocking airplane landing traffic…


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[A64Pilot]

You guys need to come down to Fl, where what I call the puppy mill flight schools are.

Went to Deland the other day where it seems the Embry Riddle guys go, well Deland is busy, jumpers all the time etc. Really no place for just Soloed students. I turn final and have two ER 172’s cut in front of me, I have a couple more aircraft behind me. When they cut in front of me I’m thinking this is going to be interesting as they are at my altitude, which means too high to make the runway as they are in close, so I figure they will go around.

Nope, when they figure they are too high, they do a 180 and head straight back up the approach path going the wrong way, so I get on the radio and ask what are your intentions, then request them to state their intentions, after awhile I guess they figure going the wrong way isn’t going to work and one turns 90 to the left for cross wind and the other goes 90 to the right I guess for downwind, but neither says anything.

Then add in the constant request for traffic and airport advisories from students 10 miles out, and the idiot ten miles out in the 80 kt airplane that thinks he has to announce everything every mile. I swear I’ve heard a long dissertation of I’m going to do a 270 followed by a 90 to the right then another 90 to the left and enter a mid field left downwind. 

Sometimes it so messed up that it’s just inconceivable, how is it that there aren’t mid airs every week?

But Society is breaking down, yes I know all old men come to believe that, but how else can you explain the rampant crime, school shootings, road rage, an incredible number of hit and runs where people and children on bicycles are run over and left for dead, how many supposed sexes there are now, the idea of being “assigned” a sex at birth, “trans” Men competing in Women’s sports and any number of things that ten years ago if you told me they would happen I would have laughed, no one could be that ridiculous, but it’s happening.

So with all that going on in Society, sure some of its going to spill over into aviation.

[MikeOH]

@A64Pilot

Dude, you need to chill out and have a Bud Light

[DCarlton]

8 minutes ago, MikeOH said:

@A64Pilot

Dude, you need to chill out and have a Bud Light

LOL.