Vision Jet under chute

[A64Pilot]

7 hours ago, Will.iam said:

And so if that’s the case why pull the chute? Press the autolevel that even a gfc-500 has and let the autopilot save both you and the plane. Only time i could see using the chute would be for uncontrolled flight which that autopilot will not work either or maybe fuel starvation but even then might want autopilot flying to control what typeof terrain you hit as opposed to random drop somewhere. 

I don’t have an answer for you. Whole airplane chutes are 100 years old, literally. First used a spring instead of a rocket. It worked but never caught on, except for Ultralights back 40 or more years ago, they were very popular there.

Only or maybe best use of the chute that I can figure is IMC engine failure or maybe over serious terrain especially at night.

I agree with what I think your asking, only answer I can give you is sometimes people get in over their heads, get scared and just want the experience to end and the chute is that end. Now I’ve never attended Cirrus training but I’ve been told that in training the use of the chute is strongly encouraged, partially I assume as that decision often has to be made early, before you exceed the envelope.

I can’t say that’s what happened here, I have zero facts, just suppositions, but one is that there wasn’t anything wrong with that airplane. But again no facts.

I concur with the random drop, I know how my luck runs, I’d find a large set of power lines or maybe a wild animal farm with lions or something.

 

[Guest]

You can say what you want about CAPS/BRS.  The market has spoken loud and clear.  When I was at Cirrus for for maintenance training, they told us they have a backlog of 1000 recips and 4-500 jets.

[Shadrach]

5 minutes ago, M20Doc said:

You can say what you want about CAPS/BRS.  The market has spoken loud and clear.  When I was at Cirrus for for maintenance training, they told us they have a backlog of 1000 recips and 4-500 jets.

Who is saying anything other than positive things about CAPS/BRS? No question it has been a game changer.

[ilovecornfields]

35 minutes ago, Shadrach said:

Who is saying anything other than positive things about CAPS/BRS? No question it has been a game changer.

Absolutely. No matter how you feel about it, the fact is that pulling the “I’m done flying the plane” handle gives you an excellent chance of waking away. Probably  shouldn’t be Plan A or Plan B but it seems to accomplish what it was designed to do and perform well within the operating limitations. Won’t help you when you auger in on your base to final turn or smash into something solid but it seems like a nice option to have when the stuff hits the fan. 

[A64Pilot]

Well I don’t think it’s a game changer and don’t think it’s nearly as useful as it’s sold to be.

I assume I’m not alone either because Cirrus has been doing the chute thing for what over 20 years now and how many other manufacturers have followed suit?

But then I don’t have the kind of bucks it takes to buy one and having that chute repacked would not please me either, cause I bet it’s an Airworthiness item and must be done, just like the airframe life limit.

The higher probability things that will kill you the chute doesn’t help, like CFIT, spatial disorientation etc.

[Guest]

8 hours ago, A64Pilot said:

Well I don’t think it’s a game changer and don’t think it’s nearly as useful as it’s sold to be.

I assume I’m not alone either because Cirrus has been doing the chute thing for what over 20 years now and how many other manufacturers have followed suit?

But then I don’t have the kind of bucks it takes to buy one and having that chute repacked would not please me either, cause I bet it’s an Airworthiness item and must be done, just like the airframe life limit.

The higher probability things that will kill you the chute doesn’t help, like CFIT, spatial disorientation etc.

No other manufacturers are installing them because few are building and selling airplanes.

[EricJ]

5 hours ago, M20Doc said:

No other manufacturers are installing them because few are building and selling airplanes.

There are a lot of RVs and Diamonds and other things being made, too, and a fair chunk of them don't have chutes.

[Hank]

1 hour ago, EricJ said:

There are a lot of RVs and Diamonds and other things being made, too, and a fair chunk of them don't have chutes.

I think it is far less "the market has spoken" and much more "the marketing has spoken," and are using the chute to sell planes to less experienced people and to persuade nervous spouses that the airplane is safe. And Cirrus markets a "lifestyle" rather than an airplane, which is only part of the "joyous, adventurous life" that they push so hard.

[Guest]

5 hours ago, EricJ said:

There are a lot of RVs and Diamonds and other things being made, too, and a fair chunk of them don't have chutes.

OK, let me rephrase it.  

There are few other high performance piston singles in the same class as the SR22 being produced.  There are no no new Cessna TTX, few if any Beechcraft Bonanza’s and no new Mooney’s being produced.  The Piper PA46 series are in a different class than the SR22.

Newer Piper Cherokee, Cessna 172, Diamond DA 40 are generally trainers not bought and owned by private individuals for personal transportation.

[A64Pilot]

5 hours ago, Hank said:

I think it is far less "the market has spoken" and much more "the marketing has spoken," and are using the chute to sell planes to less experienced people and to persuade nervous spouses that the airplane is safe. And Cirrus markets a "lifestyle" rather than an airplane, which is only part of the "joyous, adventurous life" that they push so hard.

Yes, Everybody else made the mistake of marketing to pilots, back 20 years ago I heard that Cirrus was hiring Recreational Vehicle Sales people, stupidly at the time I thought that won’t work because pilots will want to talk specifics about construction technique and other technical subjects.

Of course I was wrong, and Cirrus was right. Like Harley Davidson, they don’t sell the bike, but it’s supposed lifestyle. I think they make more money on clothing and jewelry etc than bikes.

I’ve heard many times the Wife won’t fly in anything without a parachute, it worked.

 

[carusoam]

There are two ways to sell machinery…

1) Discuss the quality of all the bits and pieces… engine, prop, instruments, and rivets… how about some coatings… DLC, aluminum, chrome, the list goes on…. of which even some pilots don’t know about their IO360… what version do they really have?

2) Discuss the machines abilities… speeds, altitudes, stability in IMC… add in the chute for the financial administrator’s discussion… for its ROI.

 

The old style of selling was really fun for engineers…

You never know what the buyer is going to want…

My favorite Plane sales guy… used to fly F18s off the deck of a carrier in Japan…when he wasn’t flying his M20F…   Last seen flying heavy iron for UPS…

 

Fortunately… not everyone has to be a pro-pilot, military pilot, or Boeing 747 pilot, to want to fly a Mooney…

In that case… as a sales guy, I would want to bring along a highly technical pilot to match the experience of the buyer… for that special one day or two…

For the most part… there are Mooney buyers that want to know…. Can I buy this… or do I need to be a pro-pilot?

I have C152 experience… do I need F18 experience…?

Many MSers have been set free in a Mooney with 100hrs or so…

No jet experience required…

No parachute required…

If cost wasn’t an object…

I would like both the Jet and the parachute in my Mooney…  

Make sure the prop can slide into beta mode…

Best regards,

-a-

[carusoam]

Vision Jet, Chutes, swims!

T/O power issue…

-a-

[bmcconnaha]

On 9/12/2022 at 10:38 AM, Ragsf15e said:

You can have a million posts debating the usefulness of the chute, but looking at the one hanging in the maintenance hangar where I get my annual brings a sense of the reality.  It saved the two people flying the airplane over rugged mountains in idaho when they lost the entire left bank of cylinders as the case came apart.  I love my Mooney, but wouldn’t hesitate to trade her for an airplane with a chute if one was in my price range.

Must be the one hanging in NW flight services? I saw that on the wall the other day when I was there doing some transition training back into an sr22.