How well does the PC Wing Leveler Work?

[Shadrach]

1 hour ago, Hank said:

Nobody, if the system leaks on one side, the plane will not maintain wings level. A continuous slight bank means a continuous slight turn.

It is very easy to overpower, such that I almost never use the thumb button, unless maybe I'm practicing turns around a point or something. 

That's his point Hank. Ryan stated that his plane goes into an uncommanded bank even with the button down.

[ryoder]

4 hours ago, MyNameIsNobody said:

How many replies does one need regarding "How well the P.C. works" and whether the Wing Leveler holds a course?  Good grief.  The question in and of itself is basic beyond belief.  Yes, If it is serviced and functioning it holds wings level.  NO, of course it doesn't hold a heading.  There is stuff like wind that will always be pushing you off course regardless of whether your wings are level.  It needs the pilot or the introduction of a heading bug GPS track to "follow a heading/hold a course".  The end.

Now, back to the solonoid/upgrade to the traditional wing-leveler push button disconnect.  The whole PC can be defeated with NOT a heavy amount of force, unless the plane is out of trim...There is no necessity to defeat the PC as the forces can be overcome.  I still don't understand how the PC can roll if the button is pushed or pulled/defeated.  If air is being dumped it CAN NOT WORK, RIGHT?...Right.

I agree.  This is a pretty crappy failure mode.  Shadrach had the same problem.  I wasn't able to get out to the plane today to mess around and see if there was anything loose or broken.

[Shadrach]

41 minutes ago, ryoder said:

I agree.  This is a pretty crappy failure mode.  Shadrach had the same problem.  I wasn't able to get out to the plane today to mess around and see if there was anything loose or broken.

All autopilots have issues. Your situation is unique in that I believe you stated that depressing the button does not stop the roll. In my case, I believe it did.

[Hank]

1 hour ago, Shadrach said:

That's his point Hank. Ryan stated that his plane goes into an uncommanded bank even with the button down.

That is exactly Ryan's problem. My comment was addressed to "MyNameIsNobody" at the end of the previous page. Sure wish we had post numbers again . . .

This is also exactly what my plane did when I had a torn boot on an aileron servo. Pressing the button may have affected it, or not, I don't remember from three or four years ago, I just remember the heading bug stopped holding any course at all. I don't use the yoke button very much, probably need to exercise it some periodically.

[MyNameIsNobody]

10 hours ago, Hank said:

That is exactly Ryan's problem. My comment was addressed to "MyNameIsNobody" at the end of the previous page. Sure wish we had post numbers again . . .

This is also exactly what my plane did when I had a torn boot on an aileron servo. Pressing the button may have affected it, or not, I don't remember from three or four years ago, I just remember the heading bug stopped holding any course at all. I don't use the yoke button very much, probably need to exercise it some periodically.

Hank,

There are two threads discussing wing levelers.  This thread was dead (It started in 2014) and was re-started.  The re-starter clearly stated that he had a wing dropping EVEN WITH THE CUT-OFF DEFEATED.  I told him to call Brittain and get some direction.  I maintained that it should be defeated entirely with an air-dump...Why is the wing still dropping?  That's it...and of course giving you %$#& for getting the Accu-Trak and Accu-Flite turned around on which is which.  That has become a hobby...

[Shadrach]

10 hours ago, Hank said:

That is exactly Ryan's problem. My comment was addressed to "MyNameIsNobody" at the end of the previous page. Sure wish we had post numbers again . . .

This is also exactly what my plane did when I had a torn boot on an aileron servo. Pressing the button may have affected it, or not, I don't remember from three or four years ago, I just remember the heading bug stopped holding any course at all. I don't use the yoke button very much, probably need to exercise it some periodically.

In my situation, the vacuum supply to one of the boots was completely disconnected. Even so, I believe the the button would still stop the roll, but I don't know. I the Brittain TC just diverts suction to one servo or the other to maintain wings level. The yoke button should dump the vacuum supply to the TC. Perhaps there's enough residual vac that a leak will cause it bank even with the button depressed. If that is the case, it's kind of a scary mode of failure.

[Hank]

4 hours ago, MyNameIsNobody said:

Hank,

There are two threads discussing wing levelers.  This thread was dead (It started in 2014) and was re-started.  The re-starter clearly stated that he had a wing dropping EVEN WITH THE CUT-OFF DEFEATED.  I told him to call Brittain and get some direction.  I maintained that it should be defeated entirely with an air-dump...Why is the wing still dropping?  That's it...and of course giving you %$#& for getting the Accu-Trak and Accu-Flite turned around on which is which.  That has become a hobby...

I know which one does what on the panel, it's just the names that give me a hard time . . .    The one with just an On-Off switch goes with the heading bug; the one with a 3-way switch [Nav 1-Off-Nav 2] and a rotary knob is the fancy one. Don't recall if my button did anything to stop the roll with an 1½" tear in an aileron boot.

[Guitarmaster]

22 hours ago, MyNameIsNobody said:

NOT LEGAL.  There is no drawing for this type of PC defeat.  UNLESS you have a log book entry documenting the work.  Brittain has no such defeat in any of their PC systems.

Umm.  I installed a "disengage" switch per Brittain.  I have the documentation.  If needed, I can scan and put it on here.

[Shadrach]

6 minutes ago, Guitarmaster said:

Umm.  I installed a "disengage" switch per Brittain.  I have the documentation.  If needed, I can scan and put it on here.

Please do!!!

[Guitarmaster]

25 minutes ago, Shadrach said:

Please do!!!

Here you go.

 

PC Cutoff switch.pdf

[MyNameIsNobody]

1 hour ago, Guitarmaster said:

Umm.  I installed a "disengage" switch per Brittain.  I have the documentation.  If needed, I can scan and put it on here.

You just made a lot of people happy.  This is my electric cut-out with an approval for panel mount switch.  Has the added requirement of an annunciator light, which is no big deal.  Did NOT know of this.  I know of many who just installed a t-dump without going through the paperwork process as described.  LOVE IT.  Seriously people GET THIS for your PC.  It iw superior to the pushbutton hold.  The price was not significant for the solenoid and install was straight forward.  I will retract my previous post.

[N601RX]

Check the fine print carefully.   It's only for newer serial numbers that come from the factory with the electric valve.  It doesn't cover any of the older ones, even then ones that legally had the electric valve installed as part of the yoke conversion.  Both the STC supplement and the Flight Manual supplement list a range of serial numbers.  

[MyNameIsNobody]

What does the 21- mean in the serial number?  This is part of the serial number?  

[Shadrach]

53 minutes ago, N601RX said:

Check the fine print carefully.   It's only for newer serial numbers that come from the factory with the electric valve.  It doesn't cover any of the older ones, even then ones that legally had the electric valve installed as part of the yoke conversion.  Both the STC supplement and the Flight Manual supplement list a range of serial numbers.  

Sure, but don't you think that would make a field approval pretty easy?

[Shadrach]

36 minutes ago, MyNameIsNobody said:

What does the 21- mean in the serial number?  This is part of the serial number?  

It means the birds aren't as ancient as ours.

[Guitarmaster]

2 hours ago, Shadrach said:

Sure, but don't you think that would make a field approval pretty easy?

It certainly should!

[MyNameIsNobody]

3 hours ago, Shadrach said:

It means the birds aren't as ancient as ours.

What does the 21- mean in the serial number?  This is part of the serial number?  

 

True.  From 1971 until end of E run in 1975 Mooney used "21" prefix at beginning of serial number.  Did not know that.  Learning from this thread.

[MooneyPTG]

On November 8, 2014 at 10:49:33 AM, TWinter said:

PC System, AccuTrak and Stec 30 Alt Hold is a winning combo for a Mooney guy on a budget (like me). Not as fancy and neat as a all in one auto-pilot system, but gets the job done well. My AccuTrak box fits nicely next to the cowl flap open/close rod on the bottom under the dash.

Can you tell me how much money we are talking about here for the accu trak and stec30

thanks

[Yetti]

5 hours ago, MyNameIsNobody said:

What does the 21- mean in the serial number?  This is part of the serial number?  

the 20- and 21- serial numbers are newer year models.  Older planes are just numbers.    While learning to sew, I have been thinking about how easy it would be to replicated Turn Left Turn right signals to the Accutrac II from the Android tablet using an Arunduo autopilot board or a Raspberry PI board.  http://diydrones.com/profiles/blogs/running-an-autopilot-on-android

[TWinter]

10 hours ago, MooneyPTG said:

Can you tell me how much money we are talking about here for the accu trak and stec30

thanks

I would need to look for my paperwork on the Stec 30 Alt Hold. I think it was about $3500. The Accu Trk I bought from a forum brother. The hard part would be finding a serviceable Accu Trk. They seem to be few and far between. I think I'm into all of it serviced, tagged and installed for under 7K. I'll see if I can find receipts and give you a better idea.

[MyNameIsNobody]

I hardly use my AccuTrak.  My Accu-Flite heading bug works so well I just don't bother with it.  On longer cross-country flites having the wing-leveler with Trak and Brittain Altitude Hold is very nice.  A good A&P can do all install, but perhpas the altitude hold on the Brittain.  Ours is NOT perfect (a little porpoise with hold in rough air), but is WAY worth the purchase price (Ebay) and install by Brittain.  Brittain serviced my step and all servos while "in the shop"...

[gsxrpilot]

1 hour ago, TWinter said:

I would need to look for my paperwork on the Stec 30 Alt Hold. I think it was about $3500. The Accu Trk I bought from a forum brother. The hard part would be finding a serviceable Accu Trk. They seem to be few and far between. I think I'm into all of it serviced, tagged and installed for under 7K. I'll see if I can find receipts and give you a better idea.

If you have an Stec 30 with Alt Hold, why would you need the PC or the AccuTrk? I'm pretty sure all I have is the Stec30 w/Alt Hold. It's tied into both my 530W and the heading bug on the HSI. Works GREAT.

[Marauder]

1 hour ago, TWinter said: I would need to look for my paperwork on the Stec 30 Alt Hold. I think it was about $3500. The Accu Trk I bought from a forum brother. The hard part would be finding a serviceable Accu Trk. They seem to be few and far between. I think I'm into all of it serviced, tagged and installed for under 7K. I'll see if I can find receipts and give you a better idea.

If you have an Stec 30 with Alt Hold, why would you need the PC or the AccuTrk? I'm pretty sure all I have is the Stec30 w/Alt Hold. It's tied into both my 530W and the heading bug on the HSI. Works GREAT.

I don't think he has an STEC 30 with altitude hold. What he has is the altitude hold module designed as an add-on for the STEC 30 or any other AP that doesn't have altitude hold.

https://www.gulfcoastavionics.com/products/2482-system-30-alt.aspx

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[TWinter]

2 hours ago, Marauder said:

I don't think he has an STEC 30 with altitude hold. What he has is the altitude hold module designed as an add-on for the STEC 30 or any other AP that doesn't have altitude hold.

https://www.gulfcoastavionics.com/products/2482-system-30-alt.aspx

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Yep..

From Gulf Coast Avionics the S-Tec System 30 Alt is a single axis Altitude Hold only autopilot which can be installed as a stand alone pitch system, or as a complement to any brand of autopilot. Since it installs and operates separately, no complex interfacing is required.

Works like a charm   Great thing about it is I can use it with or without the PC system. You can make banks and turns at will and this system will maintain altitude independent of the AccTrk.

[ryoder]

The stec is 15k?  http://www.chiefaircraft.com/st-sys-30.html