M20E Valuation

[Ragsf15e]

5 hours ago, DCarlton said:

I've never tallied the J numbers; only looked at peak production periods in the mid to late 60's.  For the J's, what were the significant configuration changes that occurred between 77 to 98 other than interior components, wingtips, the throttle quadrant, that would impact parts availability.  I've never seen a parts compatibility list.  Other than tribal knowledge, gotta wonder if LASAR or Mooney has a detailed cross reference listing.  I'm particularly curious about the Mooney's built in the 90s and whether there have any "special" or very limited production parts.  Other than a Predator :>, a perfect late 90's J would probably be my dream Mooney choice.  

I think you’re going to find some type of very unique part on just about any model/year.  I sold my F for various reasons, but they included availability (lack of) landing gear actuator gears, and intake boots.  When I got my 252, I realized the intake boot was serviceable but not great, so I tried to order a new one.  6 month lead time and expensive, but I feel lucky mooney is still ordering parts from 3rd party vendors (this boot isn’t the same vendor Lasar is using for the vintage ones).  Some of these parts just don’t work well from salvage.  I think we will have to get more and more creative to keep them safely (and legally) flying.

[TheAv8r]

https://www.trade-a-plane.com/search?category_level1=Single+Engine+Piston&make=MOONEY&model=M20J+201&listing_id=2446769&s-type=aircraft

Just to share another example of why an E in the mid-$100k range isn't unreasonable, here is a $215K M20J with a low-time engine, nice interior, nice panel. An E at $160k with all the J-mods equipped comparably is a $55k savings, and if you never needed space in the rear seats, you win.

[Greg_D]

7 hours ago, TheAv8r said:

https://www.trade-a-plane.com/search?category_level1=Single+Engine+Piston&make=MOONEY&model=M20J+201&listing_id=2446769&s-type=aircraft

Just to share another example of why an E in the mid-$100k range isn't unreasonable, here is a $215K M20J with a low-time engine, nice interior, nice panel. An E at $160k with all the J-mods equipped comparably is a $55k savings, and if you never needed space in the rear seats, you win.

That is a VERY nice 201.  The E that I'm looking at is better equipped avionics wise with similar engine time, but does not have new paint.  And the E is $65K cheaper.

[ArtVandelay]

https://www.trade-a-plane.com/search?category_level1=Single+Engine+Piston&make=MOONEY&model=M20J+201&listing_id=2446769&s-type=aircraft
Just to share another example of why an E in the mid-$100k range isn't unreasonable, here is a $215K M20J with a low-time engine, nice interior, nice panel. An E at $160k with all the J-mods equipped comparably is a $55k savings, and if you never needed space in the rear seats, you win.

Interesting that they got rid of the headrests, I would have thought that wasn’t allowed.
The question is will either sell even close to their asking price.

[DCarlton]

8 hours ago, ArtVandelay said:

Interesting that they got rid of the headrests, I would have thought that wasn’t allowed.
The question is will either sell even close to their asking price.

My headrests are in a closet in the garage.  They just make reaching over into the back seat more difficult in flight.  I doubt they add anything to safety.  

[MikeOH]

Mine has the rear headrests, but someone removed the front ones long ago (seat upholstery covers the mounting holes).

Seems to me the chances of a rear-end collision causing whiplash are pretty slim

[Hank]

11 hours ago, ArtVandelay said:

Interesting that they got rid of the headrests

 

2 hours ago, DCarlton said:

My headrests are in a closet in the garage.  They just make reaching over into the back seat more difficult in flight.  I doubt they add anything to safety.  

 

45 minutes ago, MikeOH said:

Mine has the rear headrests, but someone removed the front ones long ago (seat upholstery covers the mounting holes).

Seems to me the chances of a rear-end collision causing whiplash are pretty slim

So many people go to the trouble of sourcing and installing headrests that it's strange to hear of people who remove them. They're in my C, no idea if they were factory or a previous owner.

Headrests in our planes aren't to protect from rear-end collisions, just to minimize the amount of head motion in the event you run into the ground. Stall spin crashes aren't what they're designed for, or they would be yoke-mounted airbags, but if they plane spins horizontally from clipping a wing on a tree or signpost, they may be helpful.

Either way, you pays your money and takes your chances. Fly safe out there!

[highflyer77]

I´m wondering that you all are only talking about money. My ´64 M20E with a lot of mod´s is a speedy bird. I see 150 KTAS in any circumstance in FL120. Cruising WOT in the 8.000 to 10.000 ft range, I am somewhere between 157 and 160 KTAS. I am quite sure, that in daily flying there´s no difference that you can feel, compared to a J´s performance. 

But now to where a M20E shines:  

I really like the J-bar gear, as it is very simple (and cheap!) to maintain, and operating it is a piece of cake. But what I consider as best improvement compared to a J: a M20E is way less heavy: I have much shorter T/O distances than a J, and also an improved climb performance. You in the U.S. seldom have runways below 3.000 ft. But, for exampe, I frequently fly into Zell am See (LOWZ) with my M20E - elevation is 2.470 ft., LDA 660 m, TODA is about 100 m longer. I see it as an absolute safety advantage, that a M20E climbs at 1.000 ft./min. at gross weight on a standard day. Here in the mountains things can go different on a hot and humid day... Even a M20K only does about 850 ft./min. real world climb performance due to it´s higher weight... 

The only reason/advantage for a J would be, if I frequently would need more leg room for my rear passengers. But as Mooneys are fast, the passengers don´t stay there a long time anyway ;-))) ! 

The bigger thing is, that here in Europe there are not a lot of well equipped M20E´s around. I bought mine 2 years ago well IFR equipped (GTN650, ASPEN, etc.) at about $ 95.000,--. Disadvantage: I have an antique Century II, 1-axis autopilot only. But it flies GPSS-tracks and LOC-approaches perfectly, and trimming my bird for a steady attitude is easy. Now I´m grading her up to my personal plane. At the end, it does not matter if you spent 10.000,-- more or less - the plane has to match your requirements - and this also includes yearly maintenance costs etc. ...

Just my 2c ... 

[highflyer77]

Additional: I painted her this spring. When my panel upgrade (GFC 500, second GTN650xi etc.) will be finished, I will be close to or maybe even north of $ 170.000,--. But then it will be a bird you won´t be able to buy easily - either here or in the U.S. ...

[Greg_D]

1 hour ago, highflyer77 said:

Additional: I painted her this spring. When my panel upgrade (GFC 500, second GTN650xi etc.) will be finished, I will be close to or maybe even north of $ 170.000,--. But then it will be a bird you won´t be able to buy easily - either here or in the U.S. ...

Do you have pictures of your plane that you can share?

[highflyer77]

Pleased to show my bird to you ;-)