Maintenance recommendations

[John Pleisse]

Quote: jetdriven

See that's 2 or is it 3 owners who have gotten substandard service at Cole.  Let's here more.  Cole can get on here and defend himself just as Jimmy Garrison did for AAA, but I have a feeling that won't happen.

[jetdriven]

Perhaps i will. I love spirited debates on issues.  Oherwise we would all be climbing at 25 square still. Oh, and book values plus one gallon per hour.

Until then, why don't you attempt to attack Mike Busch again and see how far that goes?  http://www.mooneyspace.com/index.cfm?page=6&mainaction=posts&forumid=3&threadid=3722

[pjsny78]

My original post was deleted because of this e-mail I received from the administrator of the site. I thought this site was intended to get feedback from others and learn a thing or 2 in the process. Apparently some people did not like it and ultimately it was removed. I would not be surprised if this post gets deleted. Maybe like the previous person claimed the title was a bit harsh. Ok maybe, I could have cleaned it up a bit but I wanted to get the point across.

 

I had a couple emails from some users that did not think we should have posts like that on Mooneyspace since there is no way to verify the event in question.  I just did it to try and be fair.  I don’t really have time to police the thing – from my end it was easier to delete it. 

 

[jetdriven]

It appears the money only goes one way. I never read of an owner cheating a shop.

[tony]

Quote: pjsny78

My original post was deleted because of this e-mail I received from the administrator of the site. I thought this site was intended to get feedback from others and learn a thing or 2 in the process. Apparently some people did not like it and ultimately it was removed. I would not be surprised if this post gets deleted. Maybe like the previous person claimed the title was a bit harsh. Ok maybe, I could have cleaned it up a bit but I wanted to get the point across.

[jasong]

Quote: GeorgePerry

Some great east coast Mooney maintenance shops.  I've done business with each of these companies and was extremely pleased with the results.

Aerodyne: (Jim and JR) KPGV just west of Norfolk VA

http://www.aerodynecorporation.com/contactus.html

AirMods and Repair:  (Dave) Trenton-Robbinsville Airport (N87)

http://www.airmodsandrepair.com/home

Chris's Aircraft: (KUUU)  Newport RI

http://chrisaircraftinc.com/location.html

 

[GeorgePerry]

Quote: tony

 

I don’t understand your point for posting this other than you have an axe to grind.  I guess it doesn’t matter with whom.  Craig provides this BBS as a free service, he doesn’t ask for anything in return. He doesn’t want any trouble, he doesn’t have time to be a baby sitter, he’s expecting all of us to act like adults and it’s easier to delete your rant.  I understand that, why can’t you? 

I find this BBS an invaluable source of information with a little bit of virtual camaraderie.  If you were running this BBS and you had a choice to delete a post or turn off the board what would you do?  I’m sorry you had a bad experience at a MSC, get over it.  We all have.  But don’t try to start a fight now with Craig.

 

[mooneym20d]

Quote: jetdriven

So which happens more? Owner trashes shop's reputation or owner gets screwed for ten or

twenty grand.    I'd like to hear about it.  I've heard plenty of owners get robbed.  

[John Pleisse]

Quote: jetdriven

Perhaps i will. I love spirited debates on issues.  Oherwise we would all be climbing at 25 square still. Oh, and book values plus one gallon per hour.

Until then, why don't you attempt to attack Mike Busch again and see how far that goes?  http://www.mooneyspace.com/index.cfm?page=6&mainaction=posts&forumid=3&threadid=3722

[jetdriven]

Quote: GeorgePerry

This post reminded me of a lesson I learned long ago.  The Better Business Bureau is a great way to research a business and the "proper" forum with which to air a grievance and file a complaint.  Let the BBB arbitrate your dispute.  If the business doesn't response, then they’ll get bad marks on the BBB’s website.  Before I exchange legal tender with a business I'm not familiar with, I make a habit of checking the local BBB website.

[rbridges]

I know someone had a bad time with Cole Aviation, but my personal experience was good.  Granted, it wasn't for an annual, but it was a fairly expensive bladder installation.  Joey seemed really nice, met me on a Saturday to drop off the plane, and was very willing to talk about the different mooneys in his hangar.

[mooneym20d]

Quote: jetdriven

This post reminded me of a lesson I learned long ago.  The Better Business Bureau is a great way to research a business and the "proper" forum with which to air a grievance and file a complaint.  Let the BBB arbitrate your dispute.  If the business doesn't response, then they’ll get bad marks on the BBB’s website.  Before I exchange legal tender with a business I'm not familiar with, I make a habit of checking the local BBB website.

[GeorgePerry]

Quote: mooneym20d

 

before you trust the BBB, consider this:

http://bbbroundup.com/LeadStory.html

http://www.slate.com/articles/business/the_customer/2010/12/busted_watchdog.html

 

http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/business-bureau-best-ratings-money-buy/story?id=12123843#.TuDPkZjfbzI

 

 

seems we can only count on each other

[danb35]

Quote: tony

I don’t understand your point for posting this other than you have an axe to grind.  I guess it doesn’t matter with whom.

[bnicolette]

I think that if we make a post good or bad redarding a maintenance event and keep emotion out of it, there really shouldn't be a problem.  I don't see a problem with posting the name of the shop/mechanic then a completely factual description of how that event went.  Such a thread could be a real asset to us on this forum and potentially save all of us a lot of distress.

[M20F-1968]

I would like to a a form on this site which is dedicated to mainenance.  What I imagine is a site where an owner can start a thread (chapter in the site) listing the name of the mechanic or facility and he and others can list their experiences under the shop/mechanic heading. 

The owners should be factual and objective in their experiences, listing what was done correctly or incorrectly.  Opinions are probably OK but should be based on facts.  The posting of facts should let the reader draw his/her own conclusions.

I the end, we would have  a listing of facilities under which would be a cross-section of reported experiences which owners felt were important enough to post. 

Smaller local shops that do excellent work could earn the recognition they deserve, and the lesser shops would also gain the reputation their history warrants.  The national shops that we know of most likely would continue in the reputation they have already earned.

Ho can we set something like this up?  Any software people here that can help?

 

[Sabremech]

While we're at it, let's set up a section for shops or mechanics to share their experiences with owners and pilots who refuse to pay their bills and maintain their airplanes IAW the FAR's. It could also include those owners who have a mechanics lien against their airplane for failure to pay the bill. This way when one of these bad owners brings their airplane to you because they can't find anyone to work on it, you can check the list and tell them to take their plane elsewhere.

 It would be interesting to see which list is longer!

[laytonl]

I had some fairly extensive work done by Joey Cole and was  pleased with the results.  It wouldn't release the airplane until he was satisfied with the maintenance, which including him returning parts to the repair facility because of problems with the repairs.  Price was a little high, but in line with what he quoted.  Lee

[Clarence]

Quote: mooneym20d

Here's my recent experience.

I brought my 1971 M20E into Flight Level Aviation (An authorized Mooney Service center) located at KOWD, Norwood, MA. I had a left tank leak. I told them I was quoted between $8000 - $10000 to completely strip and reseal both tanks. I was clear that any price above this would be unacceptable and I would be going to AirMods and Repair in NJ. I also elected to do only the leaky tank and asked that the price be between $4000 - $5000. The manager assured me that the tank would be done professionally and in a timely manner and at the cost we discussed. He said he had a "tank guy" in house. I dropped the plane off at the specified time and went to check on the status four days later. Nothing had been done. I was clearly upset and the manager was unsympathetic to my concerns, but, he assured me it would get done. I also had some work done on the cowl flaps (they wouldn't stay closed) and a vaccum gage problem.

After two weeks, I figured they should've be done by then. Not even close. The strip job was "impossible" to them. They discovered some surface corrosion in the tank and the sealant was not coming off. I became concerned because I spoke with AirMods and Wilmar and they said, "If done right, the longest it should take to strip one tank is 5 days." I used this as a benchmark to check their work. I also mentioned the quote and he assured me it would not come in over budget.

Long story, short - I got screwed! After a month, I picked up the plane, but they didn't have a bill ready for me. I was suspicious. When I got the bill, It was $9800. I was shocked.

The amount of sealant in the tank was double the amount necessary and sloppy. It was splattered everywhere. They broke a push to talk switch, didn't install my pull ring for the fuel selector drain, the cowl flaps were worse (needed re-rigging, not a new spring and washers as they had said), didn't install interior panels correctly. And, for the icing on the cake, the sump drain had been sealed so I couldn't sample fuel from the tank they sealed.

I paid the $7500 thus far. I will not pay them more. I would stay away from this shop.

[mooneym20d]

IMO, the only thing that would render the work unairworthy would be the inability to sample fuel from the sealed tank. When I mentioned this to the shop, they said it was debris and that I would have to pay $35 for a new sump drain and one hour labor. The drain was new to begin with. It was sealed.  I have retained a lawyer and I'm considering my options. I set up a meeting with the shop for tomorrow afternoon. 

[N601RX]

Quote: mooneym20d

IMO, the only thing that would render the work unairworthy would be the inability to sample fuel from the sealed tank. When I mentioned this to the shop, they said it was debris and that I would have to pay $35 for a new sump drain and one hour labor. The drain was new to begin with. It was sealed.  I have retained a lawyer and I'm considering my options. I set up a meeting with the shop for tomorrow afternoon. 

[mooneym20d]

I did. They were initially sealed so they had to strip that section of the lower rib to ensure they were open. Yet another example of an MSC that should have remedial training.

[rocketman]

For what its worth - it takes a grain of salt to condemn or criticize especially when you have a bad outcome (service, cost, time etc) but it takes a huge PR drive to reverse the effects of a few critical remarks. The recent threads about Cole Aviation is just not fair to someone who devotes his entire life trying to help the few of us Mooney owners in the Southeast. I doubt there is any one MSC that has not had one complaint from an unhappy customer. Please don't use this forum as a Topix posting. If you do, I will leave as well as many others who don't appreciate cheap trashing bantering. 

[pjsny78]

For what its worth - it takes a grain of salt to condemn or criticize especially when you have a bad outcome (service, cost, time etc) but it takes a huge PR drive to reverse the effects of a few critical remarks. The recent threads about Cole Aviation is just not fair to someone who devotes his entire life trying to help the few of us Mooney owners in the Southeast. I doubt there is any one MSC that has not had one complaint from an unhappy customer. Please don't use this forum as a Topix posting. If you do, I will leave as well as many others who don't appreciate cheap trashing bantering. 

 

 

Rocketman,

I have been trying to stay away from this topic but thought I should post this. I understand that the mechanic you referenced has a loyal following. I can only speak of my experience. There were glaring issues that if the mechanic followed the Mooney service checklist at annual would have and should have been corrected. Instead they were not and could have ended with an accident on 1 issue and another if under IMC conditions could have as well. I have gotten beat up by some in the past for this, but the fact is that mooneyspace is the best place on the web where Mooney owners can get information on everything Mooney. If I had read of the comments on here before I got an annual I would have made a different decision.  As you can see in this post and the one before it was deleted, was there is a mix of experiences with different shops. It’s up to the reader to make a decision and you have the opportunity like others have, to express good experiences.  

To be fair. In the last few months I have used the following service centers:

Dugosh: Extremely helpful and knowledgeable. I wish I was closer to have my plane serviced more.

Henry Weber Aircraft: Very Knowledgeable and efficient staff. Had me in and out.  I think I found a home in these guys.

Air-Mods: very good the only problem I have with them is not even, in their control and is very minor. They have to charge out of state customer’s sales tax. Other than that they have been great and always have made themselves available.  Really good people and do good work.

Air East: well let’s just say I like the others better even though they are located on my home base.  

[N601RX]

Quote: mooneym20d

I did. They were initially sealed so they had to strip that section of the lower rib to ensure they were open. Yet another example of an MSC that should have remedial training.