Where do they sell all those stolen Garmins?

[Jerry Pressley]

Middle of the night thieves hit the Morristown, Tn airport and took every Garmin in the tie down area.  I was lucky in that I only lost one 430.  Smokey mountain Aero lost 430's, 530's and sw panels.  Baron lost a 530 AND 430.  all in all upwards of $75,000 lost.  All have serial numbers.  Probably little Chance of recover.   Locking the door is a waste of time because most doors use the Bendix drawer keys and a small handful of keys will open 95% of the gen avia fleet.  I suspect they will be hitting more airports doing same thing in the near future

[JT]

Very sad that this is happening now. But not surprising. 

I have a sound system rental business in NYC - we've had 4 jobs since March. On one of those jobs in Connecticut, on October 3rd, something happened that has never happened in 35 years of doing this kind of work. I had a truck broken into, they got away with 40K worth of audio gear. My crew were complacent, broke company rules and parked where they should not have. Be diligent, people are desperate and I'm afraid it won't get better any time soon. 

[1001001]

If you haven't already, make sure all the thefts are reported and the serial numbers submitted to the NCIC by local police.

[McMooney]

omg that's total BS, hope they get a new bff in prison

[takair]

http://aea.net/stolenequipment/
 

It would be great if they made this list public, but at least avionics shops can view the list prior to tagging equipment. 

[1001001]

1 minute ago, takair said:

http://aea.net/stolenequipment/
 

It would be great if they made this list public, but at least avionics shops can view the list prior to tagging equipment. 

Do they get their data from NCIC or direct submissions, or some other source?

[takair]

2 minutes ago, 1001001 said:

Do they get their data from NCIC or direct submissions, or some other source?

Aviation Crime Prevention Institute.....http://mobile.acpi.org.....but I’m not sure where they get info.....  There is a form to be filled out there too, so worth reporting there...

[carusoam]

Garmin has a procedure to follow... I called their help line to see if they could help me find it...

1) Police report

2) S/Ns

3) Email to Aviation.support@garmin.com

4) I sent a message over to Trek Lawler to see if there is a more direct route for the email... if he messages me back, I’ll include that as well...

if I remember correctly, it is really difficult to use a stolen Garmin radio... their value is incredibly limited...

Good luck!

Best regards,

-a-

[RobertGary1]

A friend sent his jpi in to be repaired. Apparently they came back and said it was a stollen demo and he had to pay extra for that. The shop may have accidentally installed a demo. So don’t seek service if it’s stollen.  
 

legally if you did transfer ownership I think Garmin has to transfer the STC to your aircraft serial number. 
 

maybe they just use the parts??

 

-Robert

2 minutes ago, carusoam said:

Garmin has a procedure to follow... I called their help line to see if they could help me find it...

1) Police report

2) S/Ns

3) Email to Aviation.support@garmin.com

4) I sent a message over to Trek Lawler to see if there is a more direct route for the email... if he messages me back, I’ll include that as well...

Good luck!

Best regards,

-a-

Garmin probably always knows the s/n since they issued the STC against your aircraft I believe. They probably charge a fee if you sell it to transfer the stc. 
 

-Robert 

[Pasturepilot]

Someone will probably step in and say this would never work, because of (insert reason here) but an idea of how they might get away with these shenanigans. 
 

Make two raids.
 

Raid one: Only hit birds with incredibly popular avionics installed. You can be ugly with this operation; if some metal gets bent no big deal. Hang on to the boxes nabbed from this trip for raid number two. 
 

Raid two: requires more precision, a little more surgical. Armed with the boxes stolen from the first trip, find birds with identical equipment installed. Swap the (assumed to be reported as) stolen box for an identical box. Don’t damage the planes, you don’t want anyone to think these birds were disturbed. 
 

The stolen avionics from the first raid would be reported, but with those boxes already installed, nobody would check the serial numbers against the database for a while, until they go in for service. By then the trail is cold, any fingerprints are long covered over and wiped away. 
 

This process doubles the effort required before making a sale, but might cover the tracks long enough.  
 

The boxes netted in the second raid, similarly, would have been sold and installed before anyone realized THOSE serial numbers were also stolen.  
 

Are database updates serial specific, or will they work on any box running the specified hardware? 

[201Mooniac]

3 minutes ago, Pasturepilot said:

Are database updates serial specific, or will they work on any box running the specified hardware? 

Database updates use the system id which comes from the config module so that won't help here.

[Pasturepilot]

6 minutes ago, 201Mooniac said:

Database updates use the system id which comes from the config module so that won't help here.

Thanks. Seeing as how I’ve just got a pair of Kx155s and an iPad, I’ve got a lot to learn before installing my upgrades. 

[Hank]

Theives can't see through a canopy cover if you're outside . . . . And likely too much hassle to cut away just to see if your stuff is what they want. 

[Steve W]

28 minutes ago, 201Mooniac said:

Database updates use the system id which comes from the config module so that won't help here.

Not on the 430/530 series.

My serial number in Garmin's system for updates those 2 were:  1 and 2 as it's the serial numbers on the cards that mattered(but didn't have to be entered).

[201Mooniac]

21 minutes ago, Steve W said:

Not on the 430/530 series.

My serial number in Garmin's system for updates those 2 were:  1 and 2 as it's the serial numbers on the cards that mattered(but didn't have to be entered).

Ah, yes, very true, I was thinking of GTNs

[takair]

51 minutes ago, Pasturepilot said:

Someone will probably step in and say this would never work, because of (insert reason here) but an idea of how they might get away with these shenanigans. 
 

Make two raids.
 

Raid one: Only hit birds with incredibly popular avionics installed. You can be ugly with this operation; if some metal gets bent no big deal. Hang on to the boxes nabbed from this trip for raid number two. 
 

Raid two: requires more precision, a little more surgical. Armed with the boxes stolen from the first trip, find birds with identical equipment installed. Swap the (assumed to be reported as) stolen box for an identical box. Don’t damage the planes, you don’t want anyone to think these birds were disturbed. 
 

The stolen avionics from the first raid would be reported, but with those boxes already installed, nobody would check the serial numbers against the database for a while, until they go in for service. By then the trail is cold, any fingerprints are long covered over and wiped away. 
 

This process doubles the effort required before making a sale, but might cover the tracks long enough.  
 

The boxes netted in the second raid, similarly, would have been sold and installed before anyone realized THOSE serial numbers were also stolen.  
 

Are database updates serial specific, or will they work on any box running the specified hardware? 

As I recall, a similar scheme was reported a few years ago....can’t recall where....

[whiskytango]

58 minutes ago, Pasturepilot said:

Someone will probably step in and say this would never work, because of (insert reason here) but an idea of how they might get away with these shenanigans. 
 

Make two raids.
 

Raid one: Only hit birds with incredibly popular avionics installed. You can be ugly with this operation; if some metal gets bent no big deal. Hang on to the boxes nabbed from this trip for raid number two. 
 

Raid two: requires more precision, a little more surgical. Armed with the boxes stolen from the first trip, find birds with identical equipment installed. Swap the (assumed to be reported as) stolen box for an identical box. Don’t damage the planes, you don’t want anyone to think these birds were disturbed. 
 

The stolen avionics from the first raid would be reported, but with those boxes already installed, nobody would check the serial numbers against the database for a while, until they go in for service. By then the trail is cold, any fingerprints are long covered over and wiped away. 
 

This process doubles the effort required before making a sale, but might cover the tracks long enough.  
 

The boxes netted in the second raid, similarly, would have been sold and installed before anyone realized THOSE serial numbers were also stolen.  
 

Are database updates serial specific, or will they work on any box running the specified hardware? 

For this to work the thieves would have to match the existing flight plans and personal waypoints stored in the databases of the boxes they take on Raid 2.  I would know right away that someone had switched boxes if I go to create a new flight plan and see that my existing flight plans were missing or the database contained a bunch of flight plans that I never created.  Of course the time interval between Raid 1 and Raid 2 may be enough time for the bad guys to sell the Raid 2 boxes, even if I, as the Raid 2 victim, discover and report the theft the next time I go flying.

[Davidv]

1 hour ago, whiskytango said:

For this to work the thieves would have to match the existing flight plans and personal waypoints stored in the databases of the boxes they take on Raid 2.  I would know right away that someone had switched boxes if I go to create a new flight plan and see that my existing flight plans were missing or the database contained a bunch of flight plans that I never created.  Of course the time interval between Raid 1 and Raid 2 may be enough time for the bad guys to sell the Raid 2 boxes, even if I, as the Raid 2 victim, discover and report the theft the next time I go flying.

I’m not saying it can’t happen but I always laugh at this scenario.  Anyone who has been through an avionics upgrade and knows the work that goes into configuring units with various HSIs and PFDs knows how far fetched this scenario is.  If there are thieves who can sit in a plane with a flashlight in their mouth and seamlessly integrate an older Garmin box in a matter of minutes or several hours (assuming the second aircraft doesn’t have the same EXACT panel as the first aircraft) they deserve the avionics tech equivalent of the Nobel prize.  They probably would make way more money opening an avionics shop and completing full panels in a week.

[RobertGary1]

4 hours ago, Davidv said:

I’m not saying it can’t happen but I always laugh at this scenario.  Anyone who has been through an avionics upgrade and knows the work that goes into configuring units with various HSIs and PFDs knows how far fetched this scenario is.  If there are thieves who can sit in a plane with a flashlight in their mouth and seamlessly integrate an older Garmin box in a matter of minutes or several hours (assuming the second aircraft doesn’t have the same EXACT panel as the first aircraft) they deserve the avionics tech equivalent of the Nobel prize.  They probably would make way more money opening an avionics shop and completing full panels in a week.

For sure. I have to believe that something on the circuit board is worth money. 
 

-Robert 

[V1VRV2]

The avionics get sold outside the country. Mexico, South America most likely. 

[RobertGary1]

1 hour ago, V1VRV2 said:

The avionics get sold outside the country. Mexico, South America most likely. 

With no database what can they do with it?

 

-Robert 

[Rusty Pilot]

Jerry sorry to see that happen to you and Brent and the other good folks in Morristown.  I wouldn't expect much of a market for stolen Garmin's without yellow tags.  Pat

[Hank]

11 hours ago, RobertGary1 said:

A friend sent his jpi in to be repaired. Apparently they came back and said it was a stollen demo and he had to pay extra for that. The shop may have accidentally installed a demo. So don’t seek service if it’s stollen.  
 

legally if you did transfer ownership I think Garmin has to transfer the STC to your aircraft serial number. 
 

maybe they just use the parts??

 

-Robert

Garmin probably always knows the s/n since they issued the STC against your aircraft I believe. They probably charge a fee if you sell it to transfer the stc. 
 

-Robert 

Surely you don't expect thieves and their customers to follow the rules??? If they did, they would not steal radios and other stuff in the first place. And their customers know why they're getting such good prices . . . Or even access in parts of the world where Big G isn't set up to distribute and install . . .

[steingar]

Thieves aren't smart.  Were they smart they'd not be thieves.  Crime really doesn't pay unless you get into the more white collar stuff.

[Ron McBride]

How about spares for a flight school?   How about spares for an owners planes?   I bet a radio shop could sell them, and nobody would know.