ICAO Equip codes.... I give up, help!

[Flyingfisher]

      Good morning mooniacs, I've been googling and reading advisory circulars, reddit, wikipedia, just... anything I can to try to get my head around these ICAO equipment codes but I just cant figure mine out and I sick of either having to tell ATC I cant accept clearances they give me so here's hoping someone can help.

      My aircraft is humble. I have enroute GPS only. (Not approach certified) VOR/DME, Transponder with mode C no ADS-B

      Under Domestic rules I file /i but as i have no approach capability I keep having to turn down and correct controllers who give me approach clearances. Can someone please help? Thank you in advance.

[Bob - S50]

I'm not sure I can help but I'll tell you what I found.  First, what codes have you been using?  Second, I'll assume that since you have a VOR/DME you also have an ILS.  Looking at the 1-800-wxbrief website I would think your equipment code would be: SDG  where S=Standard, VOR/ILS/VHF comm, D=DME, and  G=GNSS

If you don't have ILS capability then I would think your code would be: DGOV where D=DME, G=GNSS, O=VOR, and V=VHF comm.

If one of those is what you are already using, you might try entering a NAV/ remark in the Other Information section.  That's supposed to be a free text entry but I'm not sure about what formatting is allowed.  That is, I don't know (doubt) that you are allowed to use spaces.  Maybe periods or underscores would be allowed.  So maybe something like this:

NAV/GNSS.ENROUTE.ONLY

Your surveillance code should be C which means mode A and C

Although it might all be for nothing because I'm not sure the equipment codes get forwarded to ATC yet or if they bother looking at them.

Good luck though.

[PaulM]

Which GPS do you have?.. 

Garmin has this little cheat sheet for their products. 

Download the Garmin Flight Plan Information Excel file now.

<Zip.. Bob already covered the codes>

I'm not sure that the controllers really read that data, and I definitely don't see them looking down at line 18 for a PBN/S1 or PBN/S2 to assign GPS approaches. these days if it isn't on the data tag area it isn't important to them.   The 80/20 rule applies.. if 80% of the airplanes can take the RNAV/ILS.. then you just assign it, and let the 20% say "unable /I  or /U"..

I would suggest that you request the ILS or VOR approach farther out that will short circuit their default decisions.  If the airport is uncontrolled they expect you to get the weather and then tell them which approach you want. Into my airport I can usually also pick the IAP.   (Request RNAV 25 SAX transition)  For towered airports when you report the ATIS, make the request for the approach type.

You can also try filing /U for a bit and see if that helps as that was a much more common old radios only equipment code. 

Or is your problem that there are only RNAV approaches, and you just need to keep trucking along under their vectoring until the MVA gets you into VFR? 

[Flyingfisher]

Haha thanks for the responses guys! It's an Apollo 55, enroute only. I've been filing as pictured. Its been working fine but every once in a while I'll be flying along just inside the clouds and be cleared for the RNAV at my home airport and I'll either have to fib and accept it knowing I'll be out of the clouds high enough (which is a big nono) or admit that I dont have RNP for an approach and it adds 20 minutes to my flight ad I get vectored a million miles around for the VOR approach from timbuktu. The alternative to this is having them hold my hand and vector me for everything in sight because they won't give me direct.. it's frustrating. So I just trying to get it right, Thanks guys!

Edited November 30, 2018 by Flyingfisher

[Mooneymite]

If you set up Fltplan.com and file use it, I think it takes care of all that for you.

You could see what it comes up with, or just email them at support@fltplan.com.  Those folks are pretty savvy.

[carusoam]

In the past, I used Gus’ advice...  fltplan.com always worked...

Essentialy my KLN90B wasn’t used to go direct very often... (cost of database updates had something to do with it...)

my equipment list was VOR, ILS and DME...  whichever code covers that... and a mode C transponder...

Flying the East Coast was mostly VOR to VOR using GPS for making straight magenta lines... (for me)

 

this may be a current list... or not...

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equipment_codes

Best regards,

-a-

[PaulM]

3 hours ago, Flyingfisher said:

So I just trying to get it right, Thanks guys!

I see you set DSGR.  If you look at the Garmin list Nothing older than a 430 has an PBN code other than B2 S1.. and those have approaches, so Garmin doesn't think a GPS155 meets C2.. C4 is for airline type DME-DME RNAV systems.. not what you have.  B4 is for RNAV systems in airliners, not  rho-theta RNAV's like a KNS-80 and not a straight DME & VOR.  

So all you could  qualify for is B2...  Garmin didn't include the GX55 on that list, but I'm sure that all GPS units are 5NM 95% of the time.   or leave off the "R" code. 

those detailed codes are really for Eurocontrol automatic flight planning,  where airways and sectors will be marked "at least B3 to fly this route".. if you have a B4 you would be rejected for the route.   

Norcal and Fresno Approach are not going to see those codes, so you have to ask for the MDA/MVA on the way in, or how about flying the LOC into KFAT for a low approach & VFR over to KFHC, or a missed and transition to the VOR/DME @ FRAME. 

 You can ask for a clearance at 2000' BEREN  SIPZY   EWNEL  FRAME.     They shouldn't have a problem with this route as it is the approach, so they would have to already have that space cleared for you.   You just can't go below the MDA. until you see the airport. 

When you see the airport, you ask for the visual, which is still an IFR maneuver so you don't need VFR clearances, or if you see nothing, you are on your way to FRAME the IAF for the VOR/DME. 

[Bob - S50]

I agree with Paul.  Neither B4 nor C3 seem appropriate.  Either just B2 (RNAV 5, GNSS) or ...maybe... C2 (RNAV 2, GNSS) would be appropriate.

[kortopates]

Think you got the help on codes you requested but understand that is not going to solve the issue you raise. Even without filing /G on a domestic flight plan they'll assume you are GPS equipped even when not because so few of the aircraft they work with aren't GPS equipped these days. You just need to be proactive about what you need. That is, as soon as your talking to approach near enough to your destination, tell them you have the Atis and are requesting what ever (ground based) approach you want or the visual. I always do that and have the approach loaded and briefed before I leave the enroute structure on vectors - and I almost always get what I request. But with very few surprises that way. Of course it helps to have familiarity with the airspace as well.


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[GDGR]

Hope this helps. Was given to me by my FIC

Completion of ICAO Flight Plan.pdf

[Flyingfisher]

Very complicated but I think I'm getting it. Why can't I have a dispatcher on my personal flights?  Thank you all for your insights and resources. 

[kortopates]

Very complicated but I think I'm getting it. Why can't I have a dispatcher on my personal flights?  Thank you all for your insights and resources. 

But it’s much more rewarding to be our own dispatcher!


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[Flyingfisher]

On 12/4/2018 at 11:56 PM, kortopates said:

But it’s much more rewarding to be our own dispatcher!


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No doubt  

 

[GDGR]

11 hours ago, Flyingfisher said:

No doubt  

 

They also really cut into the aircraft's UL. 

[midlifeflyer]

Given your equipment, you are only entitled to G,S in the equipment field, plus DME if you have an actual DME box. The "R" signifies you have terminal/approach GPS capability. You don't. The PBN box should be empty; it is used to give specific information about the "R."

In theory, G without R tells them you only have enroute capability, but as you've found, ATC assumes equipment requirements. Someone else suggested filing /U, but I'm not sure even that will help. I've received direct to a waypoint when filing /U, something which, in theory, can't be done.

I've heard recommendations to use the KISS principle, even if you have extended capabilities. Most of them don't make a difference on what services US ATC provides.

Edited December 7, 2018 by midlifeflyer