Engine Reliability - E/F vs C

[Hank]

13 minutes ago, carl said:

 

But if I did I would put my old airplane oil in the car, its like brand new. 

If it's like brand new, why not leave it in the plane???? 

[carl]

On 12/9/2015 at 6:00 PM, StinkBug said:

I would have had to do 6 oil changes in the same time this summer. 10 hours is ridiculous, do you change the oil in your car every 500 miles too? Cause it's basically the same thing.

 

3 minutes ago, Hank said:

If it's like brand new, why not leave it in the plane???? 

Because I want  it to stay that way. 

[Hank]

You know what? It's your plane and your money, spend it the way that makes you happy. Just save some to buy avgas!

[garytex]

On December 9, 2015 at 8:29 PM, carl said:

 

Bob

you are right there ,i do admit im a low hour flyer . so that is say every 3 months 

 so the expense is not a big deal 

but there should be a good filter that cleans out this micro abrasives .

there isnt . 

 

 If you place for small  rare earth magnets on the outside of your oil filter they will pick up micro ferrous  particles. I've done this and you can see a black smudge on the inside of the oil filter where these little ferrous particles  are pulled out of the oil.  These are the little magnets that are so strong that they're hard to pull apart and will come close to pinching your fingers. Neodymium  if I remember correctly.

[garytex]

With regards the C versus E- F debate, as an old motorhead I think there's absolutely no doubt you will spend more on engine maintenance on an IO. But after years of being frustrated with poor induction and pour mixture distribution of carbureted engines, I've really come to appreciate that the I/O  angle valve head engine is certainly the very best at making the least  noise and the most power out of a gallon of gas. I regularly burn 7 to 8 gallons of gas going 145 to 155 kn in my F.  Ultimately the gas savings makes it just about to wash on maintenance.  And I get there faster .  However the IOS are another 10 gees to buy.  And sometimes 10 gees is important. It was very important to me on the first airplane that I bought, and I bought my first airplane based on the fact that it would stagger through the air and only cost $13,000.  

The above comments  from the guys about condition and selecting based on frequency of use so you don't have a rusty cam crap out in 200 hours are probably more important than the efficiency. 

 Another thing that makes it easy to buy a good airplane is to shop locally  and slowly if you possibly can.

Good luck, have fun, most airplane purchases turn out fine.

 

[Yetti]

Has anyone ever seen a rusty cam lobe?   Why can you take a V8 that has been sitting for 20 years and fire it up and no cam failure?

[Shadrach]

2 hours ago, Yetti said:

Has anyone ever seen a rusty cam lobe?   Why can you take a V8 that has been sitting for 20 years and fire it up and no cam failure?

I have the bottom end of a 43 yr old 500cc Triumph twin sitting in my hangar. I bought it as a parts engine around 2003. Every time I look at the cams, 2 things come to mind:

1) I hope the Mooney's cam is fairing as well.

2) What a pity that a 4 decade old British motorcycle is proving to have more robust components than a currently produced aircraft engine.

[carusoam]

Location of the cam to the source of its oil is responsible for its lubrication...

The Lycoming is different than the Continental in a significant way.

I would need Byron or somebody with his level of experience to explain the details.

As for sitting 20 years and no rust... Good raw materials?

follow-up questions..

1) Does the IO540 cam outlast the cams in the IO360? Fewer IO540s around for comparison.

2) What is the difference between the cam and the oiling system on an IO540 vs IO360?

3) Do Continental cams suffer the same fate as Lycoming?

Best regards,

-a-

[Pictreed]

On December 11, 2015 at 11:11 PM, garytex said:

Another thing that makes it easy to buy a good airplane is to shop locally  and slowly if you possibly can.

Good luck, have fun, most airplane purchases turn out fine.

 

Good point.  I'm working on purchasing a 65 E locally and I'm helping do the annual today.  That way I've been all over the plane and looked at everything up close.  They've explained to me about the towing hazards, how the h stabs work and what to look at during preflight, maintenance pointers and so on.

I also got to cycle the gear while on the jack stands to get a feel for it. 

I've had the opportunity to ask them all these things that rumble around in newbies heads keeping us up at night about owning their first Mooney. 

Tim

 

[Smiles201]

I sometimes ask the same question, and it seems to me that you hear more about crankcase cracks in the e. Not sure if that is a true statement or not, just my observation. No balance weights in that engine as opposed to the j. Not sure about the f. May pay to talk to some of the well known engine shops.

[carl]

On 12/12/2015 at 3:50 PM, Pictreed said:

Good point.  I'm working on purchasing a 65 E locally and I'm helping do the annual today.  That way I've been all over the plane and looked at everything up close.  They've explained to me about the towing hazards, how the h stabs work and what to look at during preflight, maintenance pointers and so on.

I also got to cycle the gear while on the jack stands to get a feel for it. 

I've had the opportunity to ask them all these things that rumble around in newbies heads keeping us up at night about owning their first Mooney. 

Tim

 

open up all the access points and check for corrosion 

[Shadrach]

44 minutes ago, Smiles201 said:

I sometimes ask the same question, and it seems to me that you hear more about crankcase cracks in the e. Not sure if that is a true statement or not, just my observation. No balance weights in that engine as opposed to the j. Not sure about the f. May pay to talk to some of the well known engine shops.

 All 4 cylinder lycs have the propensity to crack. The "counter weights" are not really "balance weights" and are mounted 90° to the crank throw.  They are not there to make the engine smoother (but I can't they don't); they are there to eliminate harmonics at certain RPMs. This is the reason non counterweighted engines have a "no ops" restriction at certain RPMs.  I've honestly not noticed that the "counterweighted" engines are any smoother, but that's anecdotal.  

http://mechanicsupport.blogspot.com/2012/04/lycoming-or-continental-counterweight.html