lost electrical

[Yetti]

 

[N201MKTurbo]

I hate to be a back seat driver (my wife would argue with that statement), but, I would have steered off the runway and headed for the grass.

[Marc_B]

360 for spacing, S turns, land in grass?  The caption reads electrical issue and no flaps.  You could see the closure rate even prior to touch down.  This was unfortunately a case of target fixation on "I just want to land."  Helmet fire is a hard thing to fix in the middle of an emergency if you aren't prepared.

Also a great time for copilot/pax to pull out cell phone Foreflight and see if any obvious ADS-b traffic behind you...looks like pilot had an ipad and I suspect it had some type of Stratus/ADS-b connection maybe??...something is on the upper windscreen between them...Runway is 4313x75.

I'm not sure why they thought that this was a good idea when it appears there were better options than intentionally running into another aircraft if it was solely an electrical out?  But a good reminder to think about engine out emergencies and trying to fit into traffic flow, or perhaps use cell phone to call tower and land at a towered airport.  A great reminder to have a backup radio in your bag with extra batteries.  Cell phone could have also been used to call Unicom to relay radio traffic and alert to emergency.

https://asn.flightsafety.org/wikibase/465937

Bad case but a great teaching case to think about contingency plans to make sure your emergency doesn't become others.

If you were watching this unfold in the pattern would you have told the lead aircraft to go around and sidestep immediately??  Really unsure what this looked like from the aircraft in the pattern?

[201er]

Must be relying on those emags or something or why on earth wouldn't he just go-around?

[EricJ]

3 hours ago, N201MKTurbo said:

I hate to be a back seat driver (my wife would argue with that statement), but, I would have steered off the runway and headed for the grass.

Or just land on the taxiway or the grass next to the runway.    That was gonna be an accident from the very beginning of the video.

I'm assuming they lost both electrical and the engine?   If the engine was still running that should have been a go-around from before the vid even started.

[GeeBee]

That is some really poor decision making.

 

[hammdo]

Oil pressure, fuel pressure, suction in the green but, oil temps were around 100°. I’d suspect engine not running but windmilling based on that. RPMs around 1500…

Taxiway looked clear and grass available. Why ruin someone else’s day. Plenty of options to not hit the plane on the runway…

Why would you post this anyway on the internet? FAA will have his a** now…

-Don

[toto]

11 minutes ago, hammdo said:

Oil pressure, fuel pressure, suction in the green but, oil temps were around 100°. I’d suspect engine not running but windmilling based on that. RPMs around 1500…

The YouTube description doesn’t mention anything about the engine though. I would think “engine not producing power” would be the first thing in this list….

”First the headsets went out, then the radio, then the avionics (navigation). We knew we had to get down quickly and made an emergency landing behind another plane with no working instruments.”

[hammdo]

Hum.. go around would have been in order if that is the case… VFR in the video…

-Don

[toto]

The only scenario that makes any sense to me is the speculation online that he was so freaked out by the electrical failure that he had tunnel vision on landing and did not even see the Cessna ahead until they were on the runway.

[Bolter]

There is audio from CTAF.  Of course nothing from the Grumman without electrical, but someone on the ground warned the CEssna that a Grumman was gaining on him.  It is about mid of the audio where it happens.   

 

[LANCECASPER]

There's Stupid and then there's Really Stupid.

Stupid was to not land on the grass or a taxiway. Really Stupid was to post your video on YouTube.

[toto]

58 minutes ago, LANCECASPER said:

There's Stupid and then there's Really Stupid.

Stupid was to not land on the grass or a taxiway. Really Stupid was to post your video on YouTube.

It was posted by a passenger .... who might not be on speaking terms with the pilot this week

 

[Pinecone]

Hmm, basic 6-pack and "no working instruments" with an electrical failure???

And flaps on a Grumman do very little, other than lower the nose a bit.  53 versus 56 knots stall speed.

 

[1980Mooney]

6 hours ago, LANCECASPER said:

There's Stupid and then there's Really Stupid.

Stupid was to not land on the grass or a taxiway. Really Stupid was to post your video on YouTube.

 

5 hours ago, toto said:

It was posted by a passenger .... who might not be on speaking terms with the pilot this week

Even the passenger is stupid. His kneejerk action was to post the video nearly immediately and thank the “skilled pilot for getting them down” in the video description. The passenger actually thinks the pilot saved his life rather than being the one that nearly killed him. 

The responses posted on the passenger’s YouTube have been scathingly critical of the pilot. 

Yet surprisingly the passenger leaves this embarrassingly incriminating video up. 
 

Well at least it will make the FAA & NTSB’s jobs a lot easier….

[201er]

 

[MikeOH]

DANG!  That's gonna take a lot of rubbing compound

[LANCECASPER]

58 minutes ago, 201er said:

 

How no one got killed or seriously injured in that is amazing - during the collision or during the confrontation after. . .lol.

[201er]

Have you seen that panel? He didn't have much to lose in the first place!

Just a backup AI, single com radio, flaps, lights, and transponder... in day VMC!

I guess having been brought up on gliders and no-electric J3 Cubs, I fail to appreciate the massive panic someone can have over the transponder not working or something

[IvanP]

From the sound of the recording, it does not seem that the prop was only windmilling. I think the engine was running at or close to idle on final. The sound changed just before he touched down and the pilot appears to be pulling the throttle on touchdown. I have experienced loss of engine in flight and it sounded much different from the video.  

[redbaron1982]

23 minutes ago, IvanP said:

From the sound of the recording, it does not seem that the prop was only windmilling. I think the engine was running at or close to idle on final. The sound changed just before he touched down and the pilot appears to be pulling the throttle on touchdown. I have experienced loss of engine in flight and it sounded much different from the video.  

The engine was producing power, for sure. After landing you can see the RPMs at a steady 800. There is no way the prop would windmill at 800 RPMs while taxing at 30kt

[IvanP]

I woud love to hear from the pilot what was going through his head when he decided to land on an occupied runway. It is easy for us to pass judgment from our keyboards, but none of us were there. Not trying to defend the poor airmanship here, just curious about the pilot;s thought process and cause for this mishap. Glad nobody got seriously hurt. This could have been lot uglier.  

[EricJ]

1 hour ago, IvanP said:

I woud love to hear from the pilot what was going through his head when he decided to land on an occupied runway. It is easy for us to pass judgment from our keyboards, but none of us were there. Not trying to defend the poor airmanship here, just curious about the pilot;s thought process and cause for this mishap. Glad nobody got seriously hurt. This could have been lot uglier.  

I suspect he's feeling pretty bad and kicking himself.    That stuff is often much clearer after the fact.   

 

[toto]

Yep. He’s gotten enough airplay on the forums this week that I’m sure he’ll surface somewhere.

I really wish he would have yanked the mixture after touchdown just to get the prop stopped, but he was deeply into “resignation” at that point and just riding it out.

Obviously lots of mistakes here, but I’m sure each of us is glad that our worst aviation moment isn’t on YouTube

 

 

[IvanP]

The story is getting better. the passenger who posted teh video also talked to local news and, of course, they loved the story. This kind of stuff puts GA in really bad light. From the passenger's account, the total extent of the Grum's "emergency" appeared to be the electrical issue. I really loved the bit about having to jumpstart the plane before the flight. The FAA is probably going to show this pilot some tough love in the near future. 

 

 

Edited 4 hours ago by IvanP