GTN 650 bluetooth connection

[rturbett]

I just found that my new to me gtn650 has bluetooth out to connect to my ipad.  I have just started using foreflight. Does anyone have experience using the two together?

Would I be better off using the Garmin Pilot app for simplicity?

 

Thanks,

Rob

[Fly Boomer]

1 minute ago, rturbett said:

Would I be better off using the Garmin Pilot app for simplicity?

Garmin and Foreflight are the most popular, but there are several others.  You should get a bunch of replies on this.

[amillet]

My GTN 750 and Flightstream 210 work great with Foreflight on IPad mini. 2 way communication 

[PeteMc]

Your GTN either has a Flight Stream (FS) 510 SD Card in it or a FS210 behind the panel and that's what you want to look for on the Bluetooth list to connect to.  The GTN does not have Bluetooth built in (don't get me started on how dumb that was when Garmin released the newer Xi version....)

ForeFlight with the GTN/FS connection works great, you'll enjoy it.  If this is a new installation, then all the Software should be up to date.  But if you've had the GTN and ForeFlight is the new component, check with your avionics shop to see if either or both the GTN and FS need to be updated.  There have been some changes this year that may or may not affect you. 

As for FF vs G Pilot, people like both, but I think FF is the overall leader and you'll be happy with your choice.

 

Edited December 9, 2023 by PeteMc

[McMooney]

I'm really a fan of Garmin Pilot but honestly they are about 99% the same, Garmin may have a slight(really slight) lead if you have multiple devices.

[Jim Peace]

1 hour ago, McMooney said:

I'm really a fan of Garmin Pilot but honestly they are about 99% the same, Garmin may have a slight(really slight) lead if you have multiple devices.

They are no where close to the same. One is intuitive (FF), and one is the biggest royal pain in the ass. 

[ArtVandelay]

GP interface is like GTN, Aera 660, G3X, etc.

If using Garmin equipment, having a consistent interface makes it easier to use. I personally didn’t like FF when I tried it out way back in 2015. There’s also a free version of an EFB for IOS FltPlan Go if you are a CB. I don’t like it either, reminds me of FF.

[PeteMc]

1 hour ago, McMooney said:

Garmin may have a slight(really slight) lead if you have multiple devices.

Not really any difference with multiple devices, at least that I've seen.  Granted I usually just connect my primary iPad to the GTN and my Backup to the GNC so the vast majority of time I'm really flying 1:1.

Now if you have a Garmin EIS, there's no way to get the data into FF like you can with G Pilot.  But that's not a consideration for me.  And following the G Pilot FB Group, a lot of the issues/features that people are talking about already exist in FF.

 

Edited December 9, 2023 by PeteMc

[Fly Boomer]

53 minutes ago, Jim Peace said:

They are no where close to the same. One is intuitive (FF), and one is the biggest royal pain in the ass. 

So, no strong opinions either way then?  

[McMooney]

7 hours ago, PeteMc said:

Not really any difference with multiple devices, at least that I've seen.  Granted I usually just connect my primary iPad to the GTN and my Backup to the GNC so the vast majority of time I'm really flying 1:1.

Now if you have a Garmin EIS, there's no way to get the data into FF like you can with G Pilot.  But that's not a consideration for me.  And following the G Pilot FB Group, a lot of the issues/features that people are talking about already exist in FF.

 

by multiple devices, i also mean watches, adsb receivers and such.   all my stuff just works.  no poking fiddling blah blah it just works.

as for differences in features, As an ex ff user, i don't see or use anything that matters.   Little background, i originally bought into gp due to not wanting to buy apple devices not because i owned garmin products.

at first, there were really notable features missing, but now, i couldn't tell you one without putting them side by side.  note, this is for the apple version of the products, android GP lags a bit.

 

oh there is one thing, gp on android looks 100x better than gp or foreflight on apple, just sayin

 

Edited December 10, 2023 by McMooney

[McMooney]

7 hours ago, Jim Peace said:

They are no where close to the same. One is intuitive (FF), and one is the biggest royal pain in the ass. 

hmm, i don't have that problem

[PeteMc]

2 hours ago, McMooney said:

oh there is one thing, gp on android looks 100x better than gp or foreflight on apple, just sayin

Yea, FF claims you just can't do it on Android because there are too many variations...yada...yada...yada....

Worked with a number of development teams and they said talk like that was typically because management didn't know how to handle two teams or they didn't want the expense of two teams.  And then there is the possibility that the Exec is an Apple only type. 

 

[Andy95W]

16 hours ago, Jim Peace said:

They are no where close to the same. One is intuitive (FF), and one is the biggest royal pain in the ass. 

I get FF free from my work, and I seriously dislike it.  It is a royal pain in the ass.

[ArtVandelay]

oh there is one thing, gp on android looks 100x better than gp or foreflight on apple, just sayin

Ridiculous, the screen resolution is are very close between them and the higher refresh rate won’t be noticeable unless the screen images are rapidly changing like for games, movies. And since the higher refresh rates drain the battery faster, Android automatically slows the refresh rate anyway unless required.
And basically the graphics are the same between the two versions.

[donkaye]

21 hours ago, Jim Peace said:

They are no where close to the same. One is intuitive (FF), and one is the biggest royal pain in the ass. 

I think the most intuitive one is the one you use.  I have both, as a result of the discount FF gives to flight instructors.  The app I use most is Garmin Pilot because the interface is basically the same as every other product I use.  I find FF convoluted and not intuitively obvious, but there are some things I like about it that GP doesn't have.

There is a FF course being given by Brian Schiff and Mike Jesch right now.  They have been having 2 hour lessons each month for many months now.  How easy can FF be to learn with hours and hours of lessons needed to really understand it.  GP is pretty simple to use even if you don't have prior experience.

[midlifeflyer]

7 minutes ago, donkaye said:

I think the most intuitive one is the one you use.  I have both, as a result of the discount FF gives to flight instructors.  The app I use most is Garmin Pilot because the interface is basically the same as every other product I use.  I find FF convoluted and not intuitively obvious, but there are some things I like about it that GP doesn't have.

There is a FF course being given by Brian Schiff and Mike Jesch right now.  They have been having 2 hour lessons each month for many months now.  How easy can FF be to learn with hours and hours of lessons needed to really understand it.  GP is pretty simple to use even if you don't have prior experience.

I agree completely with your first sentence. 

 

[McMooney]

6 hours ago, ArtVandelay said:

 

Ridiculous, the screen resolution is are very close between them and the higher refresh rate won’t be noticeable unless the screen images are rapidly changing like for games, movies. And since the higher refresh rates drain the battery faster, Android automatically slows the refresh rate anyway unless required.
And basically the graphics are the same between the two versions.

 

Seriously, take your apple device to a samsung store and load up the trial version of gp on the samsung galaxy tab s9+, it's not subtle

[Pinecone]

I use FF with GTN-650Xi/FS510.

But I also need GP to do the Database Concierge wireless upgrade of databases in the 650.

GP interface is similar the 650 and my AERO 760.  But I started with FF as a EFB (get Mil version for free from CAP), and prefer that.

[rturbett]

How do you get the foreflight instructor discount? Does Garmin offer this too?

[midlifeflyer]

9 hours ago, rturbett said:

How do you get the foreflight instructor discount? Does Garmin offer this too?

FF 33% discount is via membership in either of the two national instructor organizations, NAFI and SAFE. 

Garmin Pilot CFI discounts don’t exist 

[midlifeflyer]

On 12/9/2023 at 2:17 PM, rturbett said:

I just found that my new to me gtn650 has bluetooth out to connect to my ipad.  I have just started using foreflight. Does anyone have experience using the two together?

Would I be better off using the Garmin Pilot app for simplicity?

 

Thanks,

Rob

Yes, I use FF and the GTN (and GNS and G1000) together. And have used Pilot as well. Both work with Garmin avionics’ Connect and FlightStream. Same functionality. The only difference is that Pilot allows you to update the avionics’ database wirelessly instead of by updating the data card on your computer. 

[midlifeflyer]

On 12/10/2023 at 2:33 AM, PeteMc said:

Yea, FF claims you just can't do it on Android because there are too many variations...yada...yada...yada....

Worked with a number of development teams and they said talk like that was typically because management didn't know how to handle two teams or they didn't want the expense of two teams.  And then there is the possibility that the Exec is an Apple only type. 

 

I agree the idea that it can’t be effectively done on Android is nonsense. There are medical monitoring devices running on Android. I think it’s more about the market than anything else. 

The iPad had a huge head start. I saw Foreflight on an early adopter’s iPad. Even then it was impressive, but I was going to wait for an Android tablet. I waited…and waited…and waited. Finally went to a local presentation on Foreflight and WingX. Ordered an iPad the next day and chose FF. Between them, FF and WingX took the small pilot market by storm, and it was all iOS. By the time Android tablets existed, the market was owned by Apple, and FF had already begun to outstrip WingX. Actually, I think that may have been the reason WingX finally put together an Android version. It never went anywhere and is basically crippleware compared with its iOS version.

You can still see the effects. Pilot’s Android version is consistently behind its iOS version in features and functionality. I’m sure if the Android market were important, it would be on par. DroidEFB, the earliest Android contender hasn’t had a significant update in years (I have an Apple hater friend who had been using it for years. Then he did a California to North Carolina cross country with a FF user. After the trip, he bought an iPad.)

The best of the Android bunch is probably iFlyEFB which took the interesting step of layering its product on top of the OS rather than integrating it into the OS, so it works exactly the same on Android, iOS, and Windows. Fantastic app, but there are some limitations associated with that choice. The free Avare is fine for VFR but pretty basic. FltPlan Go! runs surprisingly well on both, but it’s all about features. And no Android EFB  except Pilot and FltPlan Go! will connect with Garmin avionics, anyway. Thats going to affect the market too.

[Pinecone]

11 hours ago, rturbett said:

How do you get the foreflight instructor discount? Does Garmin offer this too?

If you have more than one Garmin panel mounted product with databases, and get a OnePak, you get GP Premium for free, but still have to pay for GP Standard.