IPad over heating

[StevenL757]

On 7/25/2022 at 11:42 PM, PT20J said:

I point the wemac vent down below the pilot's knee on my M20J up to cool the back on my yoke mount. I also adjust the Rosen visors to keep the sun off it. Turning the brightness down helps.

Skip

This.  Exactly.

[Bob E]

9 hours ago, ArtVandelay said:

That’s not possible if you’re making a long cross country trips. iPad batteries can not run FF or GP for hours. I be surprised if they can last 4 hours, let alone a full 8 hour day.
If you charge them, then plug them in, your not charging the battery as much as powering the electronics.

From the article What to Do When Your iPad is Getting Hot:  "Don't use iPad while charging. Charging your iPad can raise the temperature a good amount, especially if it's in use while charging." https://www.lifewire.com/fix-ipad-getting-hot-4582410

On long cross-country trips you can certainly run a few hours without the charger, especially during the time when the sun is most direct. Obviously plug in the charger when you have to - use the air vent and the slap-on sunshade to keep direct sunlight off the screen, and that will probably suffice to keep it cool enough.

[McMooney]

If you turn off cellular data, the battery in your ipad will last MUCH longer.

I fly with just bluetooth enabled, both the IPAD mini5 and mini6 will last about 4 or 5 hours.  Normally i keep them charging while flying.

Honestly, i had forgotten about the whole Overheating thingee.  Maybe the newer ipads work better ?

[Pinecone]

iPads and phones already only charge to 80% battery capacity.   Otherwise, their life in consumer use would be too short.

You only charge a lithium battery to 100% if you absolutely need the capacity (like RC planes and helicopters).

 

[NewM20CPIC]

On 7/25/2022 at 10:24 PM, larryb said:

I agree getting rid of sunlight is best. I designed and printed this mount for my mini6 because Ram didn’t have the model yet. I added dual fans and risers to direct the airflow. So far so good.

Excellent.  I bought one.  Thanks

 

[A64Pilot]

On 7/27/2022 at 8:23 AM, PeteMc said:

Not an overheating note, but just one all should remember for good iPad/electronics battery longevity...  Do Not fully charge your iPad, phone, etc. for every day use.  It's okay to fully charge it as needed, like before a full day of flying.  But when you're sitting at home planning flights or using it to watch a movie, or even the morning before a short breakfast flight, don't just plug it in and leave it plugged in.

That last 10-20% of charging is that hardest on the newer type batteries.  But the newer type batteries do not mind multiple charging cycles as much as the older original iPad batteries did.  So if the battery drops down to 40%, go ahead and charge it back to 80%.  And this is better for the battery if you do it twice in a day vs. going to the full 100%.  Also do not run the battery completely to 0, that 20-80% range is the sweet spot for most batteries.

This is absolutely NOT an old wives tale, it is exactly how you should treat your Li-po battery for maximum life, whether it be your toothbrush or your Tesla.

The second worst thing you can do to a Li-po battery is charge it to 100%, the worst thing you can do is charge it to 100% and leave it there, for this reason the newer Iphones learn your usage pattern and only finish the charge just before the phone is unplugged for the day.

You would think consumer devices would only charge to 80% but label it 100% and greatly extend their battery life but they don’t, they don’t because the marketing dept that relies heavily on advertising how many hour of battery the device has won’t let them, this is true believe it or not for Tesla and other EV’s who’s batteries cost tens of thousands of dollars too.

I can post all kinds of links about this, many just people rehashing the same stuff and much of it incorrect data, but Battery University is a very reliable link when batteries are the subject.

https://batteryuniversity.com/article/bu-808-how-to-prolong-lithium-based-batteries

A general rule of thumb is you double the battery life for each 10% that you don’t fully charge it, ex only charge to 90% every day and you double its life cycle count wise.

‘For this reason I only charge our Tesla to 60% daily as we recharge every night that’s plenty for daily use. In terms of longevity, the optimal charge voltage is 3.92V/cell. Battery experts believe that this threshold eliminates all voltage-related stresses; going lower may not gain further benefits but induce other symptoms

3.92 v per cell is 60% to 65%.

If you really want to learn about Li-po batteries, like maybe for example your considering an EV and want it to last as long as possible, or just like accumulating knowledge, give that link a read.

 

[ArtVandelay]

I charge my iPad and iPhone to 100% every day, I can’t be bothered to monitor the charging cycle. This is automatically true for my G5 backup battery and panel mounted Aera 660 that are always charged. I’ll just have to change them out (all above are 2-6 years old, so seems better than posted articles).

[Pinecone]

1 hour ago, A64Pilot said:

You would think consumer devices would only charge to 80% but label it 100% and greatly extend their battery life but they don’t, they don’t because the marketing dept that relies heavily on advertising how many hour of battery the device has won’t let them, this is true believe it or not for Tesla and other EV’s who’s batteries cost tens of thousands of dollars too.

Some devices do.   That is why they can get so many cycles.  Phones get a 1000 cycles or more, which is not common if you charge to 100%.

 

[A64Pilot]

1 minute ago, Pinecone said:

Some devices do.   That is why they can get so many cycles.  Phones get a 1000 cycles or more, which is not common if you charge to 100%.

 

Some may I’m sure, but how do you know which ones do? Surely those that do would advertise “our battery lasts twice as long as others” wouldn’t they, especially if stopping at 90% did double cycle life, that’s been proven.

For 99% of the population consumer electronics batteries last long enough, and their demise is very often the impetus used to get them to buy another device, most don’t care if their battery only lasted three years, time for a new phone anyway, did you hear the new Iphone 14 is out?

That’s why most consumer devices don’t have replaceable batteries anymore. I’ve changed batteries in an older Ipad, and buddy it was a chore, it’s not so bad with my Iphone 6s, but newer phones and Ipads it’s nearly impossible, when my battery went bad in my Ipad Pro I’m using now Apple replaced the device, not the battery.

It went bad because I used it as a chart plotter on the boat and it was always plugged in and always at 100% SOC, that’s when I learned that’s not a good practice for an Ipad, I thought it was the way to keep the battery new, always plugged in meant you never used it right?

You could determine if a device stops charging early if you knew its battery number of cells and could measure its voltage of course, but who does that?

But many if not most do what @ART do, who cares, I’ll just buy another one when I have to, which is fine for most people, but if you choose to at least double the cycle life of a battery it’s not hard to do, and if your considering buying an EV with a battery costing in excess of $10,000, why not make it last much longer.

Note I’m quoting cycle life, because of course simple time takes its toll too, but with chemistries changing quickly calendar life is unknown, so when you see claims of a million mike EV battery, realize that’s discounting calendar aging almost certainly.

LifePo4, Lithium-Iron etc is coming on strong and it’s way more tolerant of 100% SOC and has a much longer cycle life too, but it’s not as energy dense.

I’d expect Garmin back-up batteries would be Life-Po4 or will be before long. If for no other reason Life-Po4 is exceedingly difficult to make burn, where Li-Po does occasionally catch fire.

[A64Pilot]

Cycle life of typical Li-Po vs SOC%, now those are FULL cycles, as most of us never do that our numbers will be better

On edit, usually a battery is considered “dead” when it’s lost 20% rated capacity, Tesla says 30%, but many, many of us have devices with well less than 80% capacity yet they still give a long enough life, so who cares? That’s one reason why so many get long lives out of their batteries, they are still using them long after they are considered “dead”. And we should in my opinion use them until their life is too short for our use.

CHARGE LEVEL* (V/CELL)	DISCHARGE CYCLES	AVAILABLE STORED ENERGY **
[4.30]	[150–250]	[110–115%]
4.25	200–350	105–110%
4.20	300–500	100%
4.15	400–700	90–95%
4.10	600–1,000	85–90%
4.05	850–1,500	80–85%
4.00	1,200–2,000	70–75%
3.90	2,400–4,000	60–65%
3.80	See note	35–40%
3.70	See note	30% and less

 

[BloodRedSkies]

At work we use the ipad pro and I've never seen one over heat. We leave them plugged in almost 100% of the time. 9+ hours of flying a day. 

[Pinecone]

3 hours ago, A64Pilot said:

Cycle life of typical Li-Po vs SOC%, now those are FULL cycles, as most of us never do that our numbers will be better

On edit, usually a battery is considered “dead” when it’s lost 20% rated capacity, Tesla says 30%, but many, many of us have devices with well less than 80% capacity yet they still give a long enough life, so who cares? That’s one reason why so many get long lives out of their batteries, they are still using them long after they are considered “dead”. And we should in my opinion use them until their life is too short for our use.

CHARGE LEVEL* (V/CELL)	DISCHARGE CYCLES	AVAILABLE STORED ENERGY **
[4.30]	[150–250]	[110–115%]
4.25	200–350	105–110%
4.20	300–500	100%
4.15	400–700	90–95%
4.10	600–1,000	85–90%
4.05	850–1,500	80–85%
4.00	1,200–2,000	70–75%
3.90	2,400–4,000	60–65%
3.80	See note	35–40%
3.70	See note	30% and less

 

Based on that chart, which is similar to ones I have seen before, cell phones are probably limiting charges.  Most people charge their phone every night, so 3 year life is more than 1000 cycles.

[PeteMc]

22 hours ago, A64Pilot said:

You would think consumer devices would only charge to 80% but label it 100%

A lot of people do really need the max battery life they can get.  But as you're implying, most of us do NOT.  I've always wished there was an option that will Stop the charging at 80% and not start charging again until the battery hits 70% - which is pretty unlikely if you're doing an over night charge. 

 

My Android does have an Adaptive Charging mode you can tie to an Alarm to have the phone not rapid charge and then sit there overnight, but it still goes to 100%.  So I usually try to charge it up to ~80% before I go to bed and then, if needed, bring it back to around 80% again while I'm having breakfast.

 

Edited May 13, 2023 by PeteMc

[A64Pilot]

18 hours ago, Pinecone said:

Based on that chart, which is similar to ones I have seen before, cell phones are probably limiting charges.  Most people charge their phone every night, so 3 year life is more than 1000 cycles.

Maybe, All these charts are run at full depth of discharge, and most people plug their phone in at about 50% charge every night, depending of course on how heavy they use the thing. But you would hope that a responsible company would be limiting charge to extend battery life, especially if the device isn’t designed for the battery to be changed.

Apple quite logically in my opinion defines a cycle as 100% use of the batteries capacity, so if you use 33% a day, three days is a cycle. Most others define a cycle as every time you charge and ignore depth of discharge.

But how long they last is still not really known as the new chemistries are just too new.

Too often you see “Experts” like in this article https://ev-lectron.com/blogs/blog/how-long-does-a-tesla-battery-last declare that since the Tesla battery will last at least 1,500 cycles with x miles of range per cycle and average driver drives x miles a day that a Tesla battery will last 30 years on average.

Uh, maybe not, because calendar age also ages a battery, not just cycles as well as temp etc. But we don’t really yet know the effect of time on a battery, because Tesla for example has changed battery chemistries every few years, so while we are beginning to know how long the older Model S batteries last, the new ones are very different, and are treated differently too.

But we DO know that if your average daily use is 1/3 capacity that if you stop charging at 66% and discharge to 20 or 30% or so that you will greatly extend the batteries life as opposed to charging to 100% every day.

‘Apple has modified their software so that the phone only completes the charge until just before it’s put into use on average to extend battery life, I’d expect that as people learn more about Li-Po batteries they will offer the option of terminating the charge early. People are learning, I bought a charger for my electric bike that has an 80, 90 and 100% charge switch on it, and the kit manufacturers are beginning to tell buyers that if they limit the charge to 90% that they will double the batteries life.

So whats this got to do with Ipads? Well ideally don’t keep it fully charged if possible, and at every stop take the thing and put in on the back seat under a towel.

I would like it if Apple gave us the option of only charging to 65% or so for devices kept plugged in, but they don’t, maybe as people learn they will?

[A64Pilot]

1 hour ago, PeteMc said:

A lot of people do really need the max battery life they can get.  But as you're implying, most of us do NOT.  I've always wished there was an option that will Stop the charging at 80% and not start charging again until the battery hits 70% - which is pretty unlikely if you're doing an over night charge. 

 

My Android does have an Adaptive Charging mode you can tie to an Alarm to have the phone not rapid charge and then sit there overnight, but it still goes to 100%.  So I usually try to charge it up to ~80% before I go to bed and then, if needed, bring it back to around 80% again while I'm having breakfast.

 

I think people are learning more and more about the care and feeding of batteries and I suspect they will start expecting such software charge limiting in devices, just hasn’t happened yet.

But I also think a not insignificant number of people that live on the phone need every bit of battery they can get and as is they are partial charging just to get through the day, and as they are the ones that most often buy the latest, greatest most expensive phones that the number of hours a phone can operate may outweigh making a battery last longer, because this user is buying the next greatest thing as soon as it’s released, so manufacturers are catering to them?

[Oscar Avalle]

Check out MyGoFlights Cool Cases with built-in fan powered off your USB power cord or the ipad battery.
they work.


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I agree. I have one and it solved my overheating issues.


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