sdflysurf Posted December 30, 2019 Report Posted December 30, 2019 Nothing like the last minute... We bought some used technology to bring our 1968 M20F into the 1990's era and add ADSB. My Center rack used to have ADF, old King Nav/Com, and a KNS80, the right side had an old transponder, com, and CDI. Left side I removed the original audio panel. New equipment will be a PS Engineering Audio Panel GMA340, Garmin GNS430 (non-waas - primary Nav/Com/GPS) connected to our KI-206 CDI/Glideslope, King KX-125 (secondary Nav/Com with Digital CDI), Garmin GTX-327, and a Freeflight FDL-978-XVR for in/out ADSB with Wifi to the IPAD. I am working with an IA who will sign off the 337, but I am electronics savvy so I will be doing most of the work. We are making new wiring harnesses complete so that we can mostly do a plug and play installation after bench testing the equipment! I appreciate anyone's comments/suggestions! Here are pictures of the demo and new-to-us used gear: Quote
carusoam Posted December 31, 2019 Report Posted December 31, 2019 Got any coin left for... engine monitor co monitor USB plugs mounted in the panel... sometimes part of a clock or other radio... Just ideas, cause you asked... Best regards, -a- 1 Quote
sdflysurf Posted December 31, 2019 Author Report Posted December 31, 2019 The right side panel should be nice and open for a JPI which we will be looking for soon. Hoping to do that with a CIES fuel sender package. I never thought about a CO monitor in the panel, is there one you suggest? Also never thought about USB in the dash besides the lighter adapter. Thanks for the tips! Also - this will be the first time this plane has seen intercom jacks in the back seat... Have you seen USB plugs in the back seat also? 1 Quote
Skates97 Posted December 31, 2019 Report Posted December 31, 2019 45 minutes ago, sdflysurf said: The right side panel should be nice and open for a JPI which we will be looking for soon. Hoping to do that with a CIES fuel sender package. I never thought about a CO monitor in the panel, is there one you suggest? Also never thought about USB in the dash besides the lighter adapter. Thanks for the tips! Also - this will be the first time this plane has seen intercom jacks in the back seat... Have you seen USB plugs in the back seat also? Quickest/easiest is the Sensorcon. @DanM20C worked out a group buy discount which I believe is still good. Remove the clip off the back and a little velcro will put it anywhere you want in the panel. 4 Quote
carusoam Posted December 31, 2019 Report Posted December 31, 2019 Plenty of options for USB ports... none are low cost... https://www.aircraftspruce.com/categories/aircraft_parts/ap/menus/el/powerconvert_cabin.html But, they are worth having when your iPad charts start running low on power... Best regards, -a- 1 Quote
DanM20C Posted January 3, 2020 Report Posted January 3, 2020 On 12/31/2019 at 12:28 PM, Skates97 said: Quickest/easiest is the Sensorcon. @DanM20C worked out a group buy discount which I believe is still good. Remove the clip off the back and a little velcro will put it anywhere you want in the panel. Thanks for reminding me about that tread. That discount no longer worked but Sensorcon has offered a new code. I have edited the original post to show the current code. Cheers, Dan 1 2 Quote
sdflysurf Posted January 14, 2020 Author Report Posted January 14, 2020 (edited) FYI - this is the beforehand picture of my panel, and the proposed layout of my center rack. I hope to clean up the panel with a new metal panel (searching for Solidworks/CAD files) I know I'll be doing it again when I add Garmin G5 or something similar, as well as a JPI EDM, but for now I could use a better looking panel with some nicer labels and maybe going for a more 6 pack look. Edited January 14, 2020 by sdflysurf Quote
Browncbr1 Posted January 14, 2020 Report Posted January 14, 2020 With patience, you will get there. Think long and hard about your long term upgrade path. 4 Quote
markgrue Posted January 14, 2020 Report Posted January 14, 2020 Personally I would move the cht gauge to the right side and put a Davtron 803 clock temp and voltmeter there. It is nice to have it next to the dg because a hold can be the longest 4 minutes of your life in hard IFR if you have to keep looking back and forth. Mark 1 Quote
sdflysurf Posted January 15, 2020 Author Report Posted January 15, 2020 22 hours ago, markgrue said: Personally I would move the cht gauge to the right side and put a Davtron 803 clock temp and voltmeter there. It is nice to have it next to the dg because a hold can be the longest 4 minutes of your life in hard IFR if you have to keep looking back and forth. Mark Thank you - since I am not yet IFR, your suggestion has got me looking around for something, but also I have my IPAD mounted to a RAM on my yoke with foreflight which has a timer, and the Garmin GTX 327 has a timer/clock built in to meet the IFR requirement. I also have an apple watch. So, what do most people use for hold timing? What other IFR timing requirements are there (since I haven't ever flown IFR yet)? Quote
Browncbr1 Posted January 15, 2020 Report Posted January 15, 2020 (edited) 13 hours ago, sdflysurf said: Thank you - since I am not yet IFR, your suggestion has got me looking around for something, but also I have my IPAD mounted to a RAM on my yoke with foreflight which has a timer, and the Garmin GTX 327 has a timer/clock built in to meet the IFR requirement. I also have an apple watch. So, what do most people use for hold timing? What other IFR timing requirements are there (since I haven't ever flown IFR yet)? I use a dual kitchen timer on my yoke, but I’ve never gotten a hold in the real world. Also, my GTN automatically starts a timer when entering a hold anyway. there are timed approaches that you’ll want to learn to fly though. But, with LPV or ILS available everywhere I go, I’ve never needed to do that real world. Edited January 15, 2020 by Browncbr1 1 Quote
sdflysurf Posted January 15, 2020 Author Report Posted January 15, 2020 4 hours ago, Browncbr1 said: Also, my GTN automatically starts a timer when entering a hold anyway. Will my new(to me) Garmin GNS430 do the same? I am installing a non-waas unit. Quote
sdflysurf Posted April 9, 2020 Author Report Posted April 9, 2020 (edited) Thanks all who have been posting their upgrades and answering questions for me! After much hemming and hawing I have changed my mind and decided on the STRATUS ESG with 3i (hide the 3i behind the panel?). This is due to my proximity to mexico and I didn't want to be stuck with 978 if Mexico clamped down on 1090ES. I have found various panels/CAD files through emailing some of you and others. I will be uploading my finals and any other DXF/DWG files that might be helpful for others later. I decided NOT to attempt to mess with the switches and Throttle/Mixture/Prop and existing circuit breakers, so these will just cover the top section of the instrument panel LEFT and RIGHT sides. The new left panel will be floating off/tilted forward like the last but without the bend in the middle. The new right side will be just a cover for the old panel upper section. I plan to cut the metal behind so I can move things around as I please. I did swap my DG and King GS for an HSI, I also found me a timer and a JPI700 with EGT/CHT. I couldn't find a reasonable USB charging option for the panel so I am sticking with the good-ol-cig adapter unless I find something else. Attached are my drawings/chickenscratch. Found a local guy to cut/powdercoat/silkscreen and I will do a test run this weekend while we add the antennas and etc. Wish me luck! Edited April 9, 2020 by sdflysurf 2 Quote
Hank Posted April 9, 2020 Report Posted April 9, 2020 While you're rebuilding the whole panel, think about moving the ignition to the bottom. Then if you install something else, the keys won't dangle in front of it and obscure your view. It's the factory location on my 1970 C. 3 Quote
carusoam Posted April 10, 2020 Report Posted April 10, 2020 The suction gauge might be worth thinking about... mini gauge is all that is required.... If it can be put next to your vac driven gyro and vac lo light... each time you use one, you see the other... This is more for flying in IMC and knowing every five years or so.... you might get a vac problem... Also review the clearance depth of the HSI to make sure it is free of the yoke vertical movement... If the HSI is a long square box, this could cause interference... PP thoughts only, not an instrument guy... Best regards, -a- Quote
tmo Posted April 10, 2020 Report Posted April 10, 2020 17 hours ago, sdflysurf said: I couldn't find a reasonable USB charging option for the panel You did see the updated review by @EricJ that he recently posted here - right? It mentions a marine panel mount unit that might be of interest. Quote
sdflysurf Posted April 10, 2020 Author Report Posted April 10, 2020 8 hours ago, carusoam said: The suction gauge might be worth thinking about... mini gauge is all that is required.... If it can be put next to your vac driven gyro and vac lo light... each time you use one, you see the other... This is more for flying in IMC and knowing every five years or so.... you might get a vac problem... Also review the clearance depth of the HSI to make sure it is free of the yoke vertical movement... If the HSI is a long square box, this could cause interference... PP thoughts only, not an instrument guy... Best regards, -a- The one that I have in the plane actually has "cessna" written on it. it seems to be a threaded connector on the back. I didn't think about replacing it - I'll check with the avionics tech that is helping me this weekend. 1 Quote
sdflysurf Posted April 10, 2020 Author Report Posted April 10, 2020 4 hours ago, tmo said: You did see the updated review by @EricJ that he recently posted here - right? It mentions a marine panel mount unit that might be of interest. Thanks for that link - so what if I used that marine version that isn't for certified use? Is that even doable legally? I don't have a problem with my existing cig adapter and using a plug in style USB charger (what I've been doing so far) - but if there is a legal solution to adding USB ports that doesn't run more than $50 I'd be happy to clean it up! Quote
gsxrpilot Posted April 10, 2020 Report Posted April 10, 2020 I like what you're doing. That's gonna be a nice panel. Personally, I wouldn't spend anything on a USB charger. A $20 adapter in the cig plug will work just fine. Spend the money on other things. If it were me, I would move the ignition switch to the bottom left corner of the panel and then I'd also move the clock to the left side. That space between the 6pack and the center stack is valuable real estate. You might want to add a CDI in that spot some day. 4 1 Quote
carusoam Posted April 10, 2020 Report Posted April 10, 2020 The O’s ignition switch is bottom left... I don’t have anything dangling on it other than the connector that keeps it connected with the hangar keys... One issue with the placement... you can’t look at it to see what position the key is actually in... You bump your head before aligning your eyes enough to see the RLBS graphic on the switch... Run-up is purely by memory... click, click, click... someday that can be a challenge for everyone.... Hmmm, was that one click or two....? Best regards, -a- Quote
sdflysurf Posted April 12, 2020 Author Report Posted April 12, 2020 (edited) On 4/10/2020 at 2:08 PM, carusoam said: The O’s ignition switch is bottom left... I don’t have anything dangling on it other than the connector that keeps it connected with the hangar keys... One issue with the placement... you can’t look at it to see what position the key is actually in... You bump your head before aligning your eyes enough to see the RLBS graphic on the switch... Run-up is purely by memory... click, click, click... someday that can be a challenge for everyone.... Hmmm, was that one click or two....? Best regards, -a- So are you saying you also prefer the ignition switch moved up where you can see it? (not trying to pin one member against another - just asking for clarification on your post! ) Edited April 12, 2020 by sdflysurf Quote
sdflysurf Posted April 12, 2020 Author Report Posted April 12, 2020 (edited) I have no experience with CNC/Waterjet companies.... but I priced out someone very experienced in panel fabrication at $1790 "dealer cost" and $2753 "list price" for the whole thing (cutting, powdercoating, labeling), and then I found a guy local that was pricing only the aluminum cutting out for around $500, but THEN I found a guy with same day turn around for $120!!!!! If anyone needs a panel cut let me know I'll get it done and ship it out to you if I have time! They missed an instrument hole on my TEST print (I'm sure they would fix it if I asked), but otherwise I'm stoked! Now to compare in the aircraft and make adjustments! Edited April 12, 2020 by sdflysurf 1 Quote
Skates97 Posted April 12, 2020 Report Posted April 12, 2020 What is the spacing, center to center, on your breakers? Quote
sdflysurf Posted April 12, 2020 Author Report Posted April 12, 2020 20 minutes ago, Skates97 said: What is the spacing, center to center, on your breakers? I copied from someone else's DXF File. They seem a comfortable center to center width of .7845" (each breaker diameter measures .52") But the height spacing I think I will increase for the labeling purposes...right now in the picture it shows .9928" vertical center to center. 1 Quote
carusoam Posted April 12, 2020 Report Posted April 12, 2020 1 hour ago, sdflysurf said: So are you saying you also prefer the ignition switch moved up where you can see it? (not trying to pin one member against another - just asking for clarification on your post! ) Yes... and no... I found I was having difficulty one day, remembering how many clicks one way or the other... Then realized... going all the way left was going to turn things off... going all the way right was going to risk engaging the starter... So... looking at the switch was a good idea... so I bumped my head instead... Then went with the momentary off position as the solution... My switch is low and left... raising it up would help some... bringing it closer to the middle would help some... Marking it better would help some... My eyeballs are nearer to the ceiling... than many... The two separate independent L/R mag switches is looking better for this challenge... Long term, I had to work on clearing up my memory challenges... Best regards, -a- Quote
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