How many times does the plane(s) actually kill someone

[HXG]

How many times does the plane actually kill someone

By Yetti,  July 18 in Mooney Safety & Accident Discussion

 

Just Once   

 

[M20F]

On 7/18/2019 at 4:29 PM, Yetti said:

We know according to the NTSB it is always the pilots fault.    So what percentage of times can no amount of skill or planning is it actually the planes fault.

Legally it is never the planes fault see 91.7

[Hank]

6 hours ago, M20F said:

Legally it is always the pilots fault see 91.7. 

Nothing quite like beating a dead horse. Five posts? Really?????

[carusoam]

Mike, you can delete the extras if you want...

It is an option, for the person who writes the post...

I think it may have been a ploy to catch up in the post count....   

I’m still ahead by a few...

Best regards,

-a-

[Skates97]

On 8/4/2019 at 6:24 AM, HXG said:

How many times does the plane actually kill someone

By Yetti,  July 18 in Mooney Safety & Accident Discussion

 

Just Once   

 

Ok, slightly morbid, but that did make me laugh.

[M20F]

15 hours ago, Hank said:

Nothing quite like beating a dead horse. Five posts? Really?????

Clearly some sort of Internet snafu.  I deleted them which I would have done sooner with a PM or you could have PM’ed the moderator. 

[M20F]

15 hours ago, carusoam said:

Mike, you can delete the extras if you want...

Thanks not sure what happened there but going to guess some sort of user error.  

[jlunseth]

I dunno. My experience is different from the Nall Report and FAA statistics.  Here’s the score for the past ten years:

1. Loss of oil pressure, declared emergency over Canada, successful emergency dive and landing.  Saw an oil drip on the nose gear prior to flight, had the aircraft pulled into the shop to inspect and diagnose, mechanic said that was normal for quick drains. Blew out all the oil in 2 1/2 hours.

2. Had the coupler fall off the alternator and into the operating engine because another mechanic failed to install a bushing internal to the coupler.  No maintenance manual I guess.  Had to operate with the Master off to preserve battery power for gear extension.  Successful landing.

3. Lost three couplers in quick succession causing alternator malfunction because an OEM supplier was not producing to spec. 

4. Had a line guy plug a 28 volt charger into my 14 volt system, boiling the battery.

5. Lost a vacuum pump, not in IMC. Safe landing. Probably my fault, should not have let it go that long.

6. Oil blowing out of the cowling because of a frozen air-oil separator.

7. Lost comm when the GPS containing the only radio burned out. Got to make a light gun landing during an airshow.

8. Not to mention the truly awful annual at purchase, too long a story to go into but we caught the mistakes before there were any incidents.

Pilot related accidents or incidents:0

Now, the pilot has been known to flat spot tires with regularity while practicing maneuvers, on occasion makes a less than perfect landing, sometimes has to request instructions to be repeated, and once in awhile has forgotten to close a flight plan when there are lots of passenger issues to deal with on landing.

It took me a long time and bitter experience to find a mechanic that does not try to kill me.

[larrynimmo]

On ‎7‎/‎19‎/‎2019 at 10:11 AM, Hank said:

The Mooney into the berm wasn't making full RPM. The pilot should have noticed; but he had been in & out of that field in the past. Bad operation (black not pushed fully forward), bad governor, bent linkage??? Existing issue before this flight, or newly developed during this takeoff? We may never know. But overweight surely falls on Pilot Responsibility and is for sure a Contributing Factor. 

a failing engine will still achieve full rpm due to the low attack of blades in feathered state only require about 60% power (my guess)   you can have rpm without the work performance creating sufficient thrust.  long runways give you the time to identify.  My point is that just because you are achieve RPM, doesn't mean (on a constant speed prop) that you are performing work (ie thrust)

[PT20J]

17 hours ago, larrynimmo said:

a failing engine will still achieve full rpm due to the low attack of blades in feathered state only require about 60% power (my guess)   you can have rpm without the work performance creating sufficient thrust.  long runways give you the time to identify.  My point is that just because you are achieve RPM, doesn't mean (on a constant speed prop) that you are performing work (ie thrust)

To make rated static rpm requires near rated power. That's how the setting for the low pitch stops is determined. The governor doesn't come into play until you have significant airspeed. It's  why you check rpm early in the takeoff roll -- it's not a check on the governor, it's a check that the engine is putting out the proper power. Similar to the field barometric check on radials.

[larrynimmo]

without a working governor you would go well over 3,000 rpm

 

[PT20J]

19 minutes ago, larrynimmo said:

without a working governor you would go well over 3,000 rpm

 

Not at low airspeed.

[larrynimmo]

on ground before rolling...if I throw the throttle in fast, it will overspeed...

[PT20J]

That's because the rapid acceleration causes the prop to momentarily exceed the speed that it can maintain with the engine at full power. 

[Blue on Top]

I am a firm believer that the vast majority of fatal accidents are pilot error, but ...

Can the engineers/designers/mechanics do something different to take a link out of the accident failure chain?  One advantage of new avionics is that they record everything.  We need to learn from these accidents.