Which Mooneys had the best wings and airframes?

[FloridaMan]

I've heard people say things about different years of Mooneys having "clean" wings, different airspeed limitations and that some year-models were reported to be faster than others due to difference in the wing. I know the 67 wing had a twist that was later abandoned. 

Anybody know which years had what? 

[MBDiagMan]

This should be interesting and educational.

[carusoam]

The answer goes along with who owned the company at the time.  How much money they were trying to save by using lower cost rivets in place of smooth flush rivets...

Any list of Mooney production numbers usually details this factoid...

Best regards,

-a- 

[MyNameIsNobody]

Aviation Consumer Quote: “Mooney connoisseurs tell us the best Mooneys ever built were the 1966-67 models.  These had most of the airplane’s desirable features-the square windows, flush riveted wing, retractable step, optional manual landing gear, good corrosion-proofing and the wide deck engines.  The 1966 E models seem to have the smoothest wings I ever saw, comments long time Mooney mechanic Charlie Dugosh”.

[ArtVandelay]

The twist supposedly makes stalls more docile by reducing AOA towards elevators and having inside of wing stall first, but my J has the stall strips that accomplished the same thing. I assume that was cheaper but definitely not an eloquent solution.

[kerry]

  The A model has the cleanest and fastest wing.  Bill Wheat told me they mated a 250 hp Lycoming to a M20A.  He told me it was the best Mooney he ever flew.  

[M20F-1968]

The metal Mooney wing has been consistently the same structurally.  The twisted wing was made in 1967-68.  My 68 F has a twisted wing.  In reality is reality is not "twisted" but rather the outboard tip of the leading edge was pushed down about an inch before the outboard lap joint was riveted.  Yes, fuel tank arrangements have changed, and wing tips were added and have evolved.  But, structurally it is the same wing.  

There have been claims that the "twisted" wing is slower.  My airplane (now essentially a J without inner gear doors) is a solid 160 kt. airplane at 10,000 ft.   I have no comparison is the wing makes the stall any more docile as I have no comparison.  

John Breda

[M20F-1968]

I did fail to address the "clean" wing concept.  The 67-68 models (at least the E and F) had flush rivets up until the  area where the air would be expected to separate from the wing and had flush inspection panels.  This was changed in 1969 when many flush rivets were replaced by button head rivets to save cost and the flush inspection panels were replaced with surface mounted panels.  These cost saving measures were reversed in the J models.

John Breda

[ArtVandelay]

The metal Mooney wing has been consistently the same structurally.  The twisted wing was made in 1967-68.  My 68 F has a twisted wing.  In reality is reality is not "twisted" but rather the outboard tip of the leading edge was pushed down about an inch.
There have been claims that the "twisted" wing is slower.

Do you still have stall strips?

[TheTurtle]

how can you "see" the twisted wing?  How do I know if I have button head rivets?  My rivets definitely stick up some.  I thought J's and up have counter sink rivets which I assumed are smooth to the metal skin?

Edited April 9, 2018 by TheTurtle

[Igor_U]

15 hours ago, TheTurtle said:

how can you "see" the twisted wing?  How do I know if I have button head rivets?  My rivets definitely stick up some.  I thought J's and up have counter sink rivets which I assumed are smooth to the metal skin?

Good morning,

Your '67F should have skin attached by countersunk rivets on forward 40% of the wing, up to the front spar. You can see those are flush with the skin. Aft wing, in the area of non laminar air flow, Mooney at the time used universal head rivets (round head) like MS20470. you should clearly see the head protruding of the skin.

IIRC, in his book "Those remarkable Mooneys", Larry Ball is writing that only '67F got the "twisted" wing that shares with M22 Mustang. It's been a long time I've read that book so I might be wrong; unfortunately, I'm not at home to check that but I hope someone here can verify that. Of course, I could be completely wrong here and twisted wing was actually in production for couple of years  like M22 production.

As to see the twist, you could look at the profile of the wing and notice leading edge of the wing is a degree or two lower then the inboard of the wing resulting in lower AoA and delayed stall of the wingtips.

 

Regards,

 

Edited April 10, 2018 by Igor_U

[RobertGary1]

On 4/8/2018 at 10:59 AM, M20F-1968 said:

I did fail to address the "clean" wing concept.  The 67-68 models (at least the E and F) had flush rivets up until the  area where the air would be expected to separate from the wing and had flush inspection panels.  This was changed in 1969 when many flush rivets were replaced by button head rivets to save cost and the flush inspection panels were replaced with surface mounted panels.  These cost saving measures were reversed in the J models.

John Breda

My 76 F has flush rivets on the wing. 

-Robert

[N6758N]

4 hours ago, RobertGary1 said:

My 76 F has flush rivets on the wing. 

-Robert

Even on the bottom? I know the 75s do not have flush rivets on the middle-rear portion of the wing but I wonder if the 76 models started again since the J was coming down the line right after that...

 

[DXB]

On 4/8/2018 at 1:59 PM, M20F-1968 said:

I did fail to address the "clean" wing concept.  The 67-68 models (at least the E and F) had flush rivets up until the  area where the air would be expected to separate from the wing and had flush inspection panels.  This was changed in 1969 when many flush rivets were replaced by button head rivets to save cost and the flush inspection panels were replaced with surface mounted panels.  These cost saving measures were reversed in the J models.

John Breda

Identical shift in rivets and panels in '69 happened for C model as well.