New Member, Thinking about a Mooney

[Dave Colangelo]

First I would like to introduce myself as a new member here. I recently got my PPL ticket (about 75 hours at this point) and am beginning to think about purchasing a plane. Ive done my research and have a fair Idea of what Im looking for at this point. For my mission the older Mooney's mainly M20C and M20E seem to fit the bill pretty well from a speed, efficiency and load stand point. I realize that they are basically 2 adults and bags planes (Im about 190 and my girlfriend does not understand what "pack light" means) which is what im looking for at this point. 99% of my time so far has been in a piper (warrior/archer) and those are also contenders in my search but there is something that draws me to the Mooney's. 

The plan: I am about to start my instrument rating (will get complex sign off in the process, most likely in an arrow). I know it takes time to find the right plane and Im in no rush, just gathering info for the time being. 

Questions: 

- Im based out of Philly (KPNE usually) where are the Mooney shops/mechanics in the area? What are the rates? Anyone specific I should be looking into around the area?

- I wont ask about yearly cost as I know that varies from plane to plane, the M20C's seem to be going in the 40K range for a nicely equipped one and the E's in the 50K-ish range for a nice one (on trade-a-plane, barnstormers etc). Is this what they are actually trading hands for? More? Less? 

- If there are any M20C/M20E owners in the Philly area I would love to chat about your plane and if you are looking for a weekend copilot I would be happy to come along, the truth is I have never been in a Mooney. 

- Is there anywhere in the Philly area to rent an M20C/E as I would like to get checked out and get some time in one. 

[carusoam]

Welcome aboard Dave!

There is a rental Mooney at the MSC in NJ.  An excellent opportunity to see various Mooneys.

There is also a NJ Pilots group that organizes fly-ins.

Best regards,

-a-

[LevelWing]

The purchase price of the aircraft will vary, partly because of what's in it and partly because of perceived value by the owner ("my" plane is worth more than others). I purchased my C for a lot less than $40k and it runs great and works well for me. It doesn't have an IFR GPS but has everything else I need and I've done all my instrument training in it (just need to finish up). 

If I could do it over again I would get one with an IFR GPS. That's the only thing I wish I had done, otherwise I got the perfect plane for me. Buy the plane you with what you want in it now, if you're able, rather than trying to upgrade later. It's a lot cheaper. If that's not an issue for you then your options will open up a lot.

Something else to consider in your costs is the 2020 mandate. Until and unless they change the date again you'll need to factor in the cost to upgrade to be compliant.

Good luck with your search. 

[Dave Colangelo]

I am aware of the 2020 update and I need to do more research into what thats going to entail/what I need to be looking for when it comes to a plane that has been taken care of. I have a few hours on the Garmin 430 at this point and would like to find a plane with a 430 (I know they are cheaper if you buy them in the plane than upgrade to them). If I buy I would be looking for something that is IFR ready or could be made so with only a few small changes. 

 

I see that NJ has a 20J for rent which I might go check out but I would like to try and get into a C or E if I can find one. 

Regards 

Dave

[Marauder]

First I would like to introduce myself as a new member here. I recently got my PPL ticket (about 75 hours at this point) and am beginning to think about purchasing a plane. Ive done my research and have a fair Idea of what Im looking for at this point. For my mission the older Mooney's mainly M20C and M20E seem to fit the bill pretty well from a speed, efficiency and load stand point. I realize that they are basically 2 adults and bags planes (Im about 190 and my girlfriend does not understand what "pack light" means) which is what im looking for at this point. 99% of my time so far has been in a piper (warrior/archer) and those are also contenders in my search but there is something that draws me to the Mooney's. 

The plan: I am about to start my instrument rating (will get complex sign off in the process, most likely in an arrow). I know it takes time to find the right plane and Im in no rush, just gathering info for the time being. 

Questions: 

- Im based out of Philly (KPNE usually) where are the Mooney shops/mechanics in the area? What are the rates? Anyone specific I should be looking into around the area?

- I wont ask about yearly cost as I know that varies from plane to plane, the M20C's seem to be going in the 40K range for a nicely equipped one and the E's in the 50K-ish range for a nice one (on trade-a-plane, barnstormers etc). Is this what they are actually trading hands for? More? Less? 

- If there are any M20C/M20E owners in the Philly area I would love to chat about your plane and if you are looking for a weekend copilot I would be happy to come along, the truth is I have never been in a Mooney. 

- Is there anywhere in the Philly area to rent an M20C/E as I would like to get checked out and get some time in one. 

I believe Dev (DXB) is based at KLOM and has a C. I'm over a N57 and have an F. I believe there is a C for sale at the NJ MSC that carusoam mentioned.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[orionflt]

ACE at ABE (allentown) also has Mooneys, and I have a C in Quakertown.

 

Brian

[Dave Colangelo]

I did see that the MSC @ trenton-robinsville has 2 C's for sale. They are both nice looking planes and I may drive out and take a look at them as the weather is just starting to get nice around here.

It does look like ACE has a C, Im going to give them a ring about what I need to do to take a lesson in it. I lived up in the Lehigh Valley for a few years and the drive is not that bad from philly so I dont mind heading up there to fly on a nice saturday. 

I was flying out of KDYL for a time and there was a C that was there every so often, i think there is also an F for sale on the field.  

[Mcstealth]

Welcome to the forum. Looking forward to reading about your plane search.

 

david

[Supercop0184]

Welcome to the group Dave! I too am a newer posting member here but I can tell you I've experienced a lot of help from these folks in helping me with all my Mooney questions.

Here is what I can tell you: I to have a majority of my hours in Pipers, with a slightly smaller amount of hours in Cessnas. I did my private pilot checkride in a Cessna, but up until last Sunday owned Cherokee for two years. When I bought my Cherokee, I never saw myself wanting to do anything other than VFR flying. About six months ago I started wanting to get my instrument ticket. My Cherokee had very antiquated IFR stuff, but I got to the point where I really wanted good instruments. Upgrading my Cherokee to good instruments was going to cost a fortune, and I am always really loved Mooneys, so I put the Cherokee up for sale and yesterday made an offer on a nicely equipped C model. Any question that you have, Post-it here. If you need a ride, ask for it here. If you want to look at different models, ask here. These folks have been great help, and I am proud to be a part!

With that being said, if you've never flown a C model, give one a shot. Compared those to the Cherokee 180, the difference is night and day. Nice tight controls, actually feels like more cabin room, full power on the runway. A solid fast airplane. I fell in love my first flight:

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[Bob_Belville]

Welcome aboard Dave.

It sounds like you are thinking pretty clearly and our MS folks in your area will be willing to help you.

As a long time M20E owner I must protest again the "2 plus luggage" moniker some would want to tag the original (Al Mooney) concept of the perfect 4 place personal plane. See pic. (This was a 500 mile trip @ 10,000' over our mountains with overnight luggage, not a 30 minute plane ride.)

Bob

[Dave Colangelo]

3 hours ago, Bob_Belville said:

Welcome aboard Dave.

It sounds like you are thinking pretty clearly and our MS folks in your area will be willing to help you.

As a long time M20E owner I must protest again the "2 plus luggage" moniker some would want to tag the original (Al Mooney) concept of the perfect 4 place personal plane. See pic. (This was a 500 mile trip @ 10,000' over our mountains with overnight luggage, not a 30 minute plane ride.)

Bob

Bob, good to see that the plane can be packed nicely! I assume your E is of the later/bigger variant based on the windows? 

 

What is the best way to find out about the local fly in's? If there is one near buy I may drive out to meet everyone and see some of the planes up close. 

 

 

[carusoam]

Contact 201er here.  He is the guy that runs the NJ Mooney Pilot group.

put 201er in the search box.  Or click here...

http://mooneyspace.com/profile/8223-201er/

Best regards,

-a-

[Hank]

Dave--there are some "later" Es, clear up into the 70s. No such thing as a "bigger" E, though.

• A-E are short bodies
• F-K are mid-bodies, 10 extra inches split between back seat legroom and baggage space
• L on up through the soon-to-be-approved U & V are long bodies, a little more than two feet longer than my C

I've also done some 4-person trips, usually 30 minutes or so in each direction, but once we went an hour and a half out, ran around, then went back. Mooneys are incredibly capable and versatile, even backwoods capable in the right hands.

[Dave Colangelo]

11 hours ago, Hank said:

Dave--there are some "later" Es, clear up into the 70s. No such thing as a "bigger" E, though.

• A-E are short bodies
• F-K are mid-bodies, 10 extra inches split between back seat legroom and baggage space
• L on up through the soon-to-be-approved U & V are long bodies, a little more than two feet longer than my C

I've also done some 4-person trips, usually 30 minutes or so in each direction, but once we went an hour and a half out, ran around, then went back. Mooneys are incredibly capable and versatile, even backwoods capable in the right hands.

Hank, I was under the impression (and most likely incorrectly) that were 2 different E/C body styles (I assumed they were different sizes) this style and this style. It also sounds like the planes have a way better useful load than I expected which is good to see!

[Bob_Belville]

12 hours ago, Dave Colangelo said:

Bob, good to see that the plane can be packed nicely! I assume your E is of the later/bigger variant based on the windows? 

 

What is the best way to find out about the local fly in's? If there is one near buy I may drive out to meet everyone and see some of the planes up close. 

 

 

I have a '66E. Yes, the earliest Es are distinctive, along with Cs, for their smaller, curved rear windows. I think both Cs and Es changed to the squared windows with the '65 models. 

[Bob_Belville]

Dave, you might want to bookmark this link.  

Mooney Model Chronology (1948-2006)

http://www.mooneyevents.com/chrono.htm

[kevinw]

There's a '68 C for sale on this forum. N6905N. Looks like a nice plane that might be worth looking at.

[Dave Colangelo]

N6905N is a nice bird! 

[Hank]

1 hour ago, Dave Colangelo said:

Hank, I was under the impression (and most likely incorrectly) that were 2 different E/C body styles (I assumed they were different sizes) this style and this style. It also sounds like the planes have a way better useful load than I expected which is good to see!

The only thing that changed was the shape of the rear window. I like the larger back window . . .

[MyNameIsNobody]

Welcome.  You are on the right track (experience both personal and here at MooneySpace).  I went a similar route.  Complex in Arrow.  Owner of a vintage Mooney with about 100 hours.  E&C are both great planes.  F's too.  If I had it to do over again I would be flying a Mid-80's 201 with removable/fold down rear seats.  Some E's and F's have fold down seats.  NICE to have option.  Find your plane WITH stuff you want (Airframe/avionics).  It is a buyers market.  Enjoy!

[Chris from PA]

I have a '65 C model and I'm also at KPNE. I'd be happy to chat with you and take you up for a ride. Send me a message and we'll pick a day. Chris

Edited March 4, 2016 by Chris from PA

[Dave Colangelo]

44 minutes ago, MyNameIsNobody said:

Welcome.  You are on the right track (experience both personal and here at MooneySpace).  I went a similar route.  Complex in Arrow.  Owner of a vintage Mooney with about 100 hours.  E&C are both great planes.  F's too.  If I had it to do over again I would be flying a Mid-80's 201 with removable/fold down rear seats.  Some E's and F's have fold down seats.  NICE to have option.  Find your plane WITH stuff you want (Airframe/avionics).  It is a buyers market.  Enjoy!

Right now my biggest issue is the flight schools near me. I live in center city Philadelphia and was training up at KPNE until the flight school closed (right after my second solo). I was pretty determined to finish up and put up with an hour and a half drive to KDYL to finish everything up. Someone ended up buying the flight school at KPNE and are just getting planes back in the air but they have no complex or HP planes running yet (not sure they even own one yet). KDYL has one arrow that has had some recent issues but I think is flying again. Once the school at KPNE gets a complex plane up and running ill get checked out (I may head up to DYL and try and do it one weekend this month if I can). Next step is to get in the M20C up at KABE and try to get some time in type (or hop in a flight with a local owner if anyone here wants company )

As for the plane, from what i have seen I think I will wait it out a bit and try and get one with a standard 8 pack and 430. They seem to command a bit higher on the price and rightfully so but I know I will be impatient once I get it and wont want it to sit in the avionics shop for 6 months getting upgraded. 

[Dave Colangelo]

Chris, PM sent 

[PaulM]

Have you thought about KVAY on the NJ side?.. they have a flight school there.   (and claim to have an Arrow).

The school at N87 (Robinsville) has a J in their rental fleet.   

Don't worry about complex/HP until after you have the the private.. It's only a few hours of extra training. I transitioned to a M20J in about 1 week. 

Learning to land in the simple trainers (172, warrior etc) is much more forgiving. 

Edited March 4, 2016 by PaulM

[Dave Colangelo]

17 minutes ago, PaulM said:

Have you thought about KVAY on the NJ side?.. they have a flight school there.   (and claim to have an Arrow).

The school at N87 (Robinsville) has a J in their rental fleet.   

Don't worry about complex/HP until after you have the the private.. It's only a few hours of extra training. I transitioned to a M20J in about 1 week. 

Learning to land in the simple trainers (172, warrior etc) is much more forgiving. 

I got my PPL about 3 months ago and have been trying to fly as much as the weather will allow (which is less than I would like). I took the written @KVAY, all in all KVAY, N87, and KDYL are all about the same distance from me (around an hours drive considering city traffic). I did see the J at N87 but the price is significantly higher than the arrows around here. KPNE is significantly closer (and thus easier for after work evening flying) which is mainly why I have been waiting to see what they get back in their fleet.