ADS-B Compliant?

[Meshach]

When bought the AC, the 335 was already installed. Broker listing had said “no ADS-B”. I asked my mechanic if it has ADS-B out, he said if it doesn’t have a U-avionics tail beacon, it doesn’t… How do I know for sure? 

[Meshach]

To be clear, it does Not have a U-avionics tail beacon. But the paperwork would seem to indicate that it does have ADS-B out…?

[Marc_B]

@Meshach It would seem that if it’s truly a GTX335 it should have ADS-b out. The GTX325 is the Mode C only.

Take a recent flight time and do a FAA performance request and see what’s being picked up…

https://adsbperformance.faa.gov/paprrequest.aspx

[Meshach]

I did one of those but frankly I’m not sure what I’m looking for on the report 

[PT20J]

Maybe this will help.

https://adsbperformance.faa.gov/paprusersguide.pdf

[Ragsf15e]

1 hour ago, Meshach said:

I did one of those but frankly I’m not sure what I’m looking for on the report 

The report shows you have 1090 mhz adsb out and your system is set to report dual adsb in.  Normally you wouldn’t have dual in unless you’re using a portable with dual?  So you do have adsb out.  The “in” setting adjusts how the adsb system sends you traffic.  That might need some thought/research, but the adsb out is good.

[Meshach]

22 minutes ago, Ragsf15e said:

The report shows you have 1090 mhz adsb out and your system is set to report dual adsb in.  Normally you wouldn’t have dual in unless you’re using a portable with dual?  So you do have adsb out.  The “in” setting adjusts how the adsb system sends you traffic.  That might need some thought/research, but the adsb out is good.

Thanks! 

[Meshach]

27 minutes ago, Ragsf15e said:

The report shows you have 1090 mhz adsb out and your system is set to report dual adsb in.  Normally you wouldn’t have dual in unless you’re using a portable with dual?  So you do have adsb out.  The “in” setting adjusts how the adsb system sends you traffic.  That might need some thought/research, but the adsb out is good.

So this report is proof that I have ADS-B out? My A/P and the broker were both wrong?

[MikeOH]

8 minutes ago, Meshach said:

So this report is proof that I have ADS-B out? My A/P and the broker were both wrong?

Pretty much!

The report would not have come back with any data if your system wasn't transmitting (the 'OUT' part)!

BTW, love your "audio panel"; that's the one I have

[EricJ]

27 minutes ago, Meshach said:

So this report is proof that I have ADS-B out? My A/P and the broker were both wrong?

Looks that way.  I hope you got a discount for not having ADS-B-out.    

[Ragsf15e]

The adsb in “dual” or “none” or “uat” thing is always confusing, but I think your system reports your capabilities so the adsb system knows what traffic you might see or might not see and if it needs to send you the data over uat, then it does.

Example - if you have no “in”, then the adsb system doesn’t send you the atc radar traffic around your aircraft as you couldn’t receive it.  
 

Or also, if you’re UAT only, 1090 mhz adsb traffic will be sent to you over uat.  Id think most systems are dual receivers now though.  If you’re using a portable though, you might want to set the “out” system to report “dual in” so the faa will send you the non adsb traffic around your aircraft.  It’s pretty darn confusing.
 

at least that’s how I understood it…

Edited November 23, 2024 by Ragsf15e

[Pinecone]

ADSB In is not transmitted to a specific aircraft it is just transmitted.  So if your ADSB registration says In, but you don't have it it doesn't change anything.

The GTX-335 does not have ADSB In.  It is only ADSB Out.  There are two versions, one with a built in GPS and one without.  The one without GPS needs a separate GPS for position data.

My CAP-10 has a GTX-335 with built in GPS, because it does not have a GPS at all.  I am planning on changing to a GTX-345 and GNC-355 (GPS and Comm)

[Ragsf15e]

23 minutes ago, Pinecone said:

ADSB In is not transmitted to a specific aircraft it is just transmitted.  So if your ADSB registration says In, but you don't have it it doesn't change anything.

The GTX-335 does not have ADSB In.  It is only ADSB Out.  There are two versions, one with a built in GPS and one without.  The one without GPS needs a separate GPS for position data.

My CAP-10 has a GTX-335 with built in GPS, because it does not have a GPS at all.  I am planning on changing to a GTX-345 and GNC-355 (GPS and Comm)

I think adsb in is transmitted to a specific aircraft in certain situations.  That’s how you get the non adsb aircraft via the faa radar.  Those aren’t sent out unless there’s an “in” aircraft near them.  Ill try to find a document, but actually im pretty sure about it.  

[Ragsf15e]

47 minutes ago, Pinecone said:

ADSB In is not transmitted to a specific aircraft it is just transmitted.  So if your ADSB registration says In, but you don't have it it doesn't change anything.

The GTX-335 does not have ADSB In.  It is only ADSB Out.  There are two versions, one with a built in GPS and one without.  The one without GPS needs a separate GPS for position data.

My CAP-10 has a GTX-335 with built in GPS, because it does not have a GPS at all.  I am planning on changing to a GTX-345 and GNC-355 (GPS and Comm)

Here, read this one.  Tis-b and ads-r are only transmitted to “client aircraft” and depend on their out/in status.  Now, that doesn’t mean that you can’t pick up the uat sent to other aircraft, you will if they are close to you.

in contrast, fis-b (weather) is not client based and is just broadcast to all.

https://www.faa.gov/air_traffic/technology/equipadsb/capabilities/ins_outs#:~:text=Traffic Information Services – Broadcast ( TIS,and be within radar coverage.

Edited November 23, 2024 by Ragsf15e

[PT20J]

ADS-B IN surveillance (i.e., "traffic") is really a collection of related services.

ADS-B provides air-to-air  traffic information without any ground infrastructure involvement. If you have a 1090ES receiver, you receive traffic from proximate aircraft transmitting ADS-B OUT on 1090ES. If you have a UAT receiver, you receive traffic from proximate UAT equipped ADS-B OUT aircraft. If you have a dual band receiver, you get all the proximate traffic from all ADS-B OUT equipped aircraft.

ADS-R retransmits 1090ES traffic to proximate UAT equipped aircraft and vice versa so that even if you don't have a dual band receiver, you will get traffic for all nearby aircraft equipped with ADS-B OUT.

TIS-B transmits data to ADS-B IN aircraft that it receives from FAA radar. This allows aircraft that are not ADS-B OUT equipped to be sent as traffic to ADS-B IN equipped aircraft.

 

[Ragsf15e]

20 minutes ago, PT20J said:

ADS-B IN surveillance (i.e., "traffic") is really a collection of related services.

ADS-B provides air-to-air  traffic information without any ground infrastructure involvement. If you have a 1090ES receiver, you receive traffic from proximate aircraft transmitting ADS-B OUT on 1090ES. If you have a UAT receiver, you receive traffic from proximate UAT equipped ADS-B OUT aircraft. If you have a dual band receiver, you get all the proximate traffic from all ADS-B OUT equipped aircraft.

ADS-R retransmits 1090ES traffic to proximate UAT equipped aircraft and vice versa so that even if you don't have a dual band receiver, you will get traffic for all nearby aircraft equipped with ADS-B OUT.

TIS-B transmits data to ADS-B IN aircraft that it receives from FAA radar. This allows aircraft that are not ADS-B OUT equipped to be sent as traffic to ADS-B IN equipped aircraft.

 

One thing to consider is if you have an out only such as @Pinecone gtx-335 and you use a portable device for “in” such as a stratus, you may be missing out on some traffic (tis-b).  It would depend on the gtx-335 configuration set by the avionics shop.  I think most of the portable devices are dual in but if not, you could also miss ads-r.  I believe it’s possible to set up a grx-335 to report “dual in” if you go into the config which would then get you the tis-b and ads-r (depending on “in” setting) on your portable.

Edited November 24, 2024 by Ragsf15e