Ovation 2 to Ovation 3

[Alan Maurer]

 Has anyone done 

ovation 2 to ovation 3?

is it worthwhile?

[carusoam]

Welcome aboard Alan!
 

O1 - > O3 is worthwhile...

Eagle - > Screamin’ Eagle is worth it...

Using something like the transitive property....

The O2 is very much like an O1 performance wise... 280hp.

So...

O2 -> O3will be worth it as well...

 

Now... do you like 30% shorter T/O runs and incredible initial climb rates?
 

If you do, the Standing O, for you... is most likely worth it...

If you are short on dough, fly off a 10k’ long runway, In middle America... To cruise at 5k’... spending the conversion dough on gasoline may be a better choice... 

It is an easy seat of the pants decision to make...

If you are a numbers guy... compare the POH to the STC performance data...  they had me at hell...O3... 

As my O1 reached time for OH, I went for a ride in @Cris’s Screamin’ Eagle.... eye opening performance difference... visceral.

Did you mean worthwhile? Or worth it...?

Worth it... is a common topic of discussion around MS...   worth the dough...

Worthwhile... less common... worth the time.... not much time used for the O3 conversion... so... absolutely worthwhile!

PP thoughts only, not an engine parts sales guy...

Best regards,

-a-

[Niko182]

11 minutes ago, Alan Maurer said:

 Has anyone done 

ovation 2 to ovation 3?

is it worthwhile?

As in what regard? Everything on an O3 can be had on an O2. Theyre the same plane.

[Jeff_S]

Well, they are essentially the same plane, with one key difference...those extra 30 hp on takeoff are a huge improvement, as Anthony notes above.  By allowing RPMs all the way to 2700, instead of capping at 2500, you get much better takeoff and climb performance.  Even once at altitude, if you bump up the RPM to do a cruise climb you will see significant improvement.

Also, for those with built-in A/C like me, the O3 allows continuous use of the A/C even on takeoff, where I believe the O1-O2s require the A/C to be off for takeoff.

And Niko, you can upgrade your Eagle to 310hp as well, if you haven't already...which with the lower gross weight of the Eagle makes it truly LEAP off the runway.

Of course, once in cruise, you can back the RPMs off to regular cruise levels, at which point you still get all the fuel efficiency and speed for which the Ovation gets...well, Ovations!

[EarthboundMisfit]

On 7/23/2020 at 4:10 AM, Jeff_S said:

Also, for those with built-in A/C like me, the O3 allows continuous use of the A/C even on takeoff, where I believe the O1-O2s require the A/C to be off for takeoff.

Yeah, our O2 POH says A/C off for takeoff, but leaving it on doesn't seem to bother it all.  The thing wants to fly at 50-55KIAS.

[StevenL757]

On 7/22/2020 at 12:06 AM, Alan Maurer said:

 Has anyone done 

ovation 2 to ovation 3?

is it worthwhile?

Can you give some additional context?

If you’re talking engine power only, the O3 310hp upgrade is extremely well worth the investment. 

[Mooney217RN]

On 7/21/2020 at 9:06 PM, Alan Maurer said:

 Has anyone done 

ovation 2 to ovation 3?

is it worthwhile?

I did it, but with a caveat.  The prior owner had already done the prop.  So I went from an Ovation 2 GX to an Ovation 3 GX with only the STC, a governor modification and fuel flow adjustment.

It is worth it IF you are based at or frequent a high altitude airfield.  My field elevation is 5,900'.  We regularly see density altitude in excess of 8,500'.  So for me, it's worth it.  That said, the STC permits you to operate at 2700 RPM for up to 5 minutes as I recall, then 2,550.  The original design was for 2,500 RPM.  I cruise at 2,450 RPM.

I like it, but I am a mountain flier.  If you're a sea level based pilot and don't venture to high altitude airfields, I'd say save your money.  I flew my plane about 20 hrs before deciding to finish the conversion.  You won't increase your cruise speed, only your climb performance.

[Niko182]

Just now, Mooney217RN said:

I did it, but with a caveat.  The prior owner had already done the prop.  So I went from an Ovation 2 GX to an Ovation 3 GX with only the STC, a governor modification and fuel flow adjustment.

It is worth it IF you are based at or frequent a high altitude airfield.  My field elevation is 5,900'.  We regularly see density altitude in excess of 8,500'.  So for me, it's worth it.  That said, the STC permits you to operate at 2700 RPM for up to 5 minutes as I recall, then 2,550.  The original design was for 2,500 RPM.  I cruise at 2,450 RPM.

I like it, but I am a mountain flier.  If you're a sea level based pilot and don't venture to high altitude airfields, I'd say save your money.  I flew my plane about 20 hrs before deciding to finish the conversion.  You won't increase your cruise speed, only your climb performance.

The STC allows for continuous operation at full power.

[Mooney217RN]

Just now, Niko182 said:

The STC allows for continuous operation at full power.

Niko-  I could be wrong about that, I haven't looked at it in a while, but I recall there being a limit to how long you can operate at 2,700 RPM.  That said, you certainly won't damage that engine operating it at 2700 RPM for any length of time.

[M20S Driver]

47 minutes ago, Mooney217RN said:

Niko-  I could be wrong about that, I haven't looked at it in a while, but I recall there being a limit to how long you can operate at 2,700 RPM.  That said, you certainly won't damage that engine operating it at 2700 RPM for any length of time.

When I talked to Bob Minnis to buy my STC, he said you can run it at 2700 rpm all day if you can afford the gas

[StevenL757]

2 minutes ago, M20S Driver said:

When I talked to Bob Minnis to buy my STC, he said you can run it at 2700 rpm all day if you can afford the gas

True, but what he failed to mention is that you'd likely need a top OH before you'd make it to TBO.

[carusoam]

Yes, yes, yes...

FF goes up with the HP delivered/used...

CHTs are important... like a TC’d engine you have the choice to operate conservatively and maintain cylinders...

You want to be really good at multi-tasking... scanning...

... Or... fly in flaming dragon mode... Damn the cylinders, full speed ahead! 
 

Some owners will choose one or the other, some will choose both...
 

PP thoughts only, Bob Minnis is the best!

Best regards,

-a-

[Angelfall]

4 hours ago, Mooney217RN said:

I did it, but with a caveat.  The prior owner had already done the prop.  So I went from an Ovation 2 GX to an Ovation 3 GX with only the STC, a governor modification and fuel flow adjustment.

It is worth it IF you are based at or frequent a high altitude airfield.  My field elevation is 5,900'.  We regularly see density altitude in excess of 8,500'.  So for me, it's worth it.  That said, the STC permits you to operate at 2700 RPM for up to 5 minutes as I recall, then 2,550.  The original design was for 2,500 RPM.  I cruise at 2,450 RPM.

I like it, but I am a mountain flier.  If you're a sea level based pilot and don't venture to high altitude airfields, I'd say save your money.  I flew my plane about 20 hrs before deciding to finish the conversion.  You won't increase your cruise speed, only your climb performance.

Who sells the STC nowadays (just the paper) and how much does it cost?

 

[Niko182]

Just now, Angelfall said:

Who sells the STC nowadays (just the paper) and how much does it cost?

 

Mooney sells it. Curious if you can still get it. It costs 4995. Look around since some shops mark up the price. Lasar charged like 8 grand, while AGL did it for 4995.

[carusoam]

Welcome aboard Angel!

Or congrats on your first post!!!

The Mooney factory purchased the STC from its author back around 2012 or so...

You should be able to call the factory...

People around here have mentioned who they spoke to, lately...
 

I bought a version for my O back in 2012... while updating my engine and prop.

Best regards,

-a-

[LANCECASPER]

9 hours ago, carusoam said:

I bought a version for my O back in 2012... while updating my engine and prop.

I bought mine for an Ovation in December 2014 from Bob Minnis. Mooney must have bought it after that.

[StevenL757]

6 minutes ago, LANCECASPER said:

I bought mine for an Ovation in December 2014 from Bob Minnis. Mooney must have bought it after that.

Correct.  And unfortunately, shops/resellers can mark it up as they choose.  It was $6,750 for me in May 2014 when Minnis still possessed it.

[FlyingScot]

It is absolutely worth it. I fly often in the mountains (moderately high alt) in the south (high density alt) And out of shorter airfields. Let me repeat ~ It is absolutely worth it! 

 

 

[xcrmckenna]

Welcome aboard Alan!
 
O1 - > O3 is worthwhile...
Eagle - > Screamin’ Eagle is worth it...
Using something like the transitive property....
The O2 is very much like an O1 performance wise... 280hp.
So...
O2 -> O3will be worth it as well...
 
Now... do you like 30% shorter T/O runs and incredible initial climb rates?
 
If you do, the Standing O, for you... is most likely worth it...
If you are short on dough, fly off a 10k’ long runway, In middle America... To cruise at 5k’... spending the conversion dough on gasoline may be a better choice... 
It is an easy seat of the pants decision to make...
If you are a numbers guy... compare the POH to the STC performance data...  they had me at hell...O3... 
As my O1 reached time for OH, I went for a ride in [mention=8065]Cris[/mention]’s Screamin’ Eagle.... eye opening performance difference... visceral.
Did you mean worthwhile? Or worth it...?
Worth it... is a common topic of discussion around MS...   worth the dough...
Worthwhile... less common... worth the time.... not much time used for the O3 conversion... so... absolutely worthwhile!
PP thoughts only, not an engine parts sales guy...
Best regards,
-a-

Is the STC conversion prop specific? I’m looking at an O2 with the 310hp upgrade. It has the 3 blade Hartzell. I would like to put an MT prop to help bump up the UL. Do ovations have Charlie weights?


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[carusoam]

3 minutes ago, xcrmckenna said:

Is the STC conversion prop specific? I’m looking at an O2 with the 310hp upgrade. It has the 3 blade Hartzell. I would like to put an MT prop to help bump up the UL. Do ovations have Charlie weights?


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See if the STC includes it...

I recall considering the 4 blade MT... But the MT wasn’t STC’d yet for the O...
 

There were essentially two STCs one to cover the prop, one to cover the 310hp, and one person that didn’t want to charge too much...

There is so much data for the acclaim prop.... it was an easy decision to make...

Plenty of composite prop data generated over the last eight + years... no fear going that way either...

Best regards,

-a-

[StevenL757]

30 minutes ago, xcrmckenna said:

Is the STC conversion prop specific? I’m looking at an O2 with the 310hp upgrade. It has the 3 blade Hartzell. I would like to put an MT prop to help bump up the UL. Do ovations have Charlie weights?

The STC allows for the use of either...

• Hartzell F7693/DF-2
• Hartzell F7498 (Acclaim Type-S prop)
• Hartzell composite scimitar
• MT 4-blade composite 

You’ll likely wind up going through shock discs much faster with the MT prop, given the CG shift much further aft.  Removing Charlie weights only helps the situation somewhat.  One member here @Txbyker experienced this in his 2005 Ovation about a year or two ago.  He since sold his Ovation, so not sure if he’s still around to comment on his experiences.
 

[Jeff_S]

Okay, enquiring minds want to know...what are Charlie weights?  I've not heard that term before.

[Cruiser]

Charlie weights are metal ballast in the tail, normally on a bracket in front of the last bulkhead and stacked, one, two or three as needed to move the CG of the airframe. 

[carusoam]

Jeff,

Your individual status for Charlie weights will be listed in your plane’s POH section regarding weight and Balance...

The O has a few weighty options like O2, Fiki anti-Ice, and/or AC... if you selected any of these items... one or more of the lead bricks got removed...

If you got a heavier prop, another lead brick may have been added compared to the slightly lighter Mac prop of the early O1s...

You will have a record of what exactly is in your trunk...

There were a few options of brick sizes the factory could select from to taylor the WnB...
 

PP thoughts only, not a mechanic...

Best regards,

-a-

[xcrmckenna]

Back when I was younger this would have been a Charlie weight, but now it’s a Charles weight...... Sorry I cant stop with the dad jokes...




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