Putting in LASAR 201 Windshield

[jamesm]

M20Doc  "instrument panels with plate nuts"  Do mean inspection panel ? on the outside of the aircraft ?  or ????

 

Thanks

[Pictreed]

As John and Clarence have said, access panels on the instrument panel would be the best.  

I've seen some of the RV10 guys doing this. 

I met a guy this week that has installed a few so I might look into it. 

Tim

[Guest]

9 hours ago, jamesm said:

M20Doc  "instrument panels with plate nuts"  Do mean inspection panel ? on the outside of the aircraft ?  or ????

 

Thanks

No, I installed plate nuts around the perimeter of the instrument panel on the supporting structure.  This make removing the panels very easy if needed.  The SWTA STC allowed for replacing the forward skin with a one piece without access or inspection holes, which is what I did.

Clarence

[M20F-1968]

No.  The instrument panel should be designed in broad sections, with the ability to remove the instruments and their racks from the face of the instrument panel.  Once removed, you should also be able to remove the instrument panel itself directly from the face of the panel.  The operative word is screws, not rivets.

John Breda

[Bart Chilcott]

I'm very interested in hearing your honest opinion on this entire process DXB.  The windscreen upgrade has been on my list.  From an aesthetics point, its just looks better but I've always struggled with the cost of this.  All quotes I've received have been around 70 hours at $95.00 per hour shop rate plus the kit making it close to 10K.  Please give us all a synopsis when you're done with it.  I'm interested to learn if you find it quieter and if you pick up a few knots. 

[Guest]

19 minutes ago, Whiskey Charlie said:

I'm very interested in hearing your honest opinion on this entire process DXB.  The windscreen upgrade has been on my list.  From an aesthetics point, its just looks better but I've always struggled with the cost of this.  All quotes I've received have been around 70 hours at $95.00 per hour shop rate plus the kit making it close to 10K.  Please give us all a synopsis when you're done with it.  I'm interested to learn if you find it quieter and if you pick up a few knots. 

It should be about week of work for one guy to install the kit.

Clarence

[Hank]

Just now, M20Doc said:

It should be about week of work for one guy to install the kit.

Unless he's never done one, and is learning on your dime.

[Bart Chilcott]

39 minutes ago, Hank said:

Unless he's never done one, and is learning on your dime.

Thats NOT happening on my Mooney. :-)

 

[1967 427]

Anyone considering this mod has probably come across this web site.  It constructs 2 smaller access panels, which is a nice option to have, and seems easier than modifying hydrolic reservoir.   http://www.coreutilities.com/mooney/201Windshield.html. 

[Hank]

Yeah, that looks like boatloads of work. But I have those little access panels and boy do they make a difference!

[mike20papa]

Anyone who has put in the single piece windshield or the 201 kit can attest to the work required - just fitting the windshield in place.  The thicker plastic takes a lot of shaping to get to fit at the bottom inside corners and everywhere else.   It is as much an artistic effort as a mechanic's exercise.  I would advise anyone thinking about the job to expect to have their patience tried to the limit.  All I've been brave enough to attempt is the single piece upgrade and you can see some of the "sculpting" required to get a descent fit.  A pneumatic die grinder fitted with a small sanding drum is the tool I found most useful.  

 

[DXB]

Well, this mod was supposed to get done in early June originally, but it appears the shop is too backed up now with more "essential" jobs fixing bent Mooneys.  Now looking like it will have to wait until after Oshkosh.

What could be more essential than spending a ton of money for a modest aesthetic and speed gain on an old plane? 

Maybe I should focus on some more essential stuff too for a couple months...

 

[macosxuser]

On 5/19/2016 at 2:54 PM, jetdriven said:

You dont want anything other than riveted skin there, or else it will eventually leak.  Mooney pilots always are resistant to doing the windshield conversion for fear of losing their avionics access panels. Why do they need the access panels? So they can more easily remove their water-damaged radios for service.

If you seal with Silicone or other crap I agree, but I'm thrilled that my E has the SWTA conversion, because those panels have come in great handy as I remove 50 years of old wiring and bad "upgrade" decisions.

 

Seal back up with tank sealant, and they will not leak.

[RLCarter]

I would ask the shop installing the mod why your plane got bumped, unless they are cutting you a deal

[DXB]

FINALLY in the shop for the install. Hope to have it back in a couple weeks. Famous last words?

My install was delayed by my  shop being packed all summer with every manner of  Mooney maintenance disaster discovered during annual that turn into multi-month ordeals. Spar cap corrosion. Tubular frame corrosion.  Recognizable engine components found in the suction screen.  The stuff of nightmares!

[Conrad]

Oh great now I'm gonna have Mooney nightmares. Why would you do this to me...

[Ron McBride]

Lasar installed mine, and charged 40 hrs. flat rate.  I did hear that it took longer though.  My plane just looks much newer.   I have the 201 windshield, cowl closer, oil cooler relocation, dual landing lights, aileron seals, flap seals, tail seals.  I am averaging 148 Knots with a 1600 hour engine.

Ron

[kpaul]

1 hour ago, N803RM said:

I have the 201 windshield, cowl closer, oil cooler relocation, dual landing lights, aileron seals, flap seals, tail seals.  I am averaging 148 Knots

I must be moving into the CB club.  I average 140 kts and only have the cowl closure.  I like the look of the 201 windshield, but can't see spending the AMUs.

[M204ever]

 

On 26.9.2016 at 5:18 PM, N803RM said:

Lasar installed mine, and charged 40 hrs. flat rate.  I did hear that it took longer though.  My plane just looks much newer.   I have the 201 windshield, cowl closer, oil cooler relocation, dual landing lights, aileron seals, flap seals, tail seals.  I am averaging 148 Knots with a 1600 hour engine.

Ron

I have nothing installed . I am averaging 145 with a polished wing.

[PTK]

On 5/26/2016 at 6:20 PM, Whiskey Charlie said:

I'm very interested in hearing your honest opinion on this entire process DXB.  The windscreen upgrade has been on my list.  From an aesthetics point, its just looks better but I've always struggled with the cost of this.  All quotes I've received have been around 70 hours at $95.00 per hour shop rate plus the kit making it close to 10K.  Please give us all a synopsis when you're done with it.  I'm interested to learn if you find it quieter and if you pick up a few knots. 

I'm not versed in the C at all but it seems to me force fitting a windshield that doesn't belong is a lot of work. What is the most compelling reason to do this? Although an argument could be made the esthetics are improved, the stock C is not a bad looking airplane imo. Does speed improve considerably?

[RLCarter]

PROS: Looks better, less wind noise and a little faster

CONS: You lose the access panels to the backside of the instrument panel

[Hank]

6 hours ago, PTK said:

What is the most compelling reason to do this? Although an argument could be made the esthetics are improved, the stock C is not a bad looking airplane imo. Does speed improve considerably?

Bob Kromer says its worth 2-3 knots, the same as waxing the wings, except it's permanent and requires no on-going maintenance. It also provides much better outside vision. Fortunately I have the no-longer-available SWTA version which retained the outside access panels.

[PTK]

I would think the aerodynamically inefficient cowl would be more of a priority in the C than the windshield.

[Hank]

39 minutes ago, PTK said:

I would think the aerodynamically inefficient cowl would be more of a priority in the C than the windshield.

I've got what's available there, too--the guppy mouth closure. This is why we're excitedly watching David's new cowl front!

[Bob_Belville]

My '66E has a 201 windshield (LASAR STC) and an ARI cowl closure.