flyboy0681 Posted January 26, 2015 Report Share Posted January 26, 2015 Not fixed? But that's what all the Obama fans keep telling us. Obamacare is just wonderful! Everything is great now! Any bill you have to bribe votes, grant multiple exemptions, then cheat the rules to only need 50 votes instead of 60, and have a vote in the wee hours of the morning, on something with 1200 pages ... you haven't even read ... it must be just great! But it is all working out pretty good, because now Obama and his staff are just making it up ... week by week ... over the next several years ... Great way to get world class health care! (But republicans are idiots?) Hey Dave, I though all Canadian's hated their free, socialized healthcare. What gives? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyboy0681 Posted January 26, 2015 Report Share Posted January 26, 2015 It's not like the American pharmas have produced most of the medical breakthroughs in the past few centuries? The rest of the west is just pumping out cures like no tomorrow! Actually, some (but certainly not all) of the biggest pharmaceutical discoveries of the 20th century were not American. Alexander Fleming (penicillin) was a Scot and Frederick Banting (Insulin) a Canadian, not to mention Charles Gerhardt (Aspirin) was French. Then there's Morphine Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetdriven Posted January 26, 2015 Report Share Posted January 26, 2015 I read more drug research and development goes on In Switzerland than here, where Pharmaceutical companies spend more on marketing and advertising than developing new drugs. Then we get to pay 5-10 sometimes 100 times more for the same drug. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carusoam Posted January 26, 2015 Report Share Posted January 26, 2015 Follow taxation rules and see where global Pharma companies put their headquarters... Ireland seems to be a popular place recently. George Merck was a European pharmacist/chemist... Merck in the US was separated from Merck AG, something related to WWII reparations? Merck US, recently combined with Schering Plough that was once separated from Schering AG for the same reasons? Many global companies find it beneficial to perform R&D in Basel, Switzerland...again, taxation policy. Warner Lambert used to have R&D in Basel. They got bought up by a small company called Pfizer. Bring back the tax relief to the U.S. for research, companies will reinstate R&D here as well... Another old topic... Remember all the jobs in American manufacturing? They have been turned into fewer jobs with higher quality and output by automated machines... Corvette fans will be impressed... http://speed.academy/lt4-v8-gm-engine-plant-tour-assembly-how-its-made/ Stay ahead of the curve. It's not going to get any easier. -a- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BorealOne Posted January 26, 2015 Report Share Posted January 26, 2015 Funny I never hear you all whining about the layers of government red tape which American pharmas must navigate and their effect on driving up the costs? Maple Leaf fans always complain that its so much harder to play hockey in Toronto than the rest of the country, too. I have no idea why Big Pharma needs rabid fans, but I'm sure they are happy to have you rooting for them, Dave. Most of the basic R&D in pharma is tax-payer subsidized. If it's not an outright grant, it's a hefty tax-deduction. Most pharmas spend twice the amount on marketing as they do on R&D and product approvals. Because you should go see your doctor and ask for drugs that you saw on TV. Oh, and much of the R&D these days doesn't actually go into innovative development, but into patent protection. The National Institute of Health Care Management estimated that 85 percent of drugs approved by the FDA between 1989 and 2000 were modifications of existing drugs. Light, D. W., et al. concluded that 1/2 of the more important new drugs are being discovered by R&D in other countries and later marketed in the United States. (Am. J. Bioethics 4(1), 2004) More inconvenient facts here: http://www.bbc.com/news/business-28212223 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 26, 2015 Report Share Posted January 26, 2015 Is Timmy still medicated or has he been institutionalized? It must be hard for him to remember why no one likes airplanes. I'm not sure which page of this book to find the answer for him. Clarence Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carusoam Posted January 26, 2015 Report Share Posted January 26, 2015 Which greedy system is going to provide the best biotechnology solution for the modern medicine for Hepatitis C? R&D by various companies is providing solutions for the problem. Greedy health insurance providers are deciding which product they prefer to pay for... The system has a tendency to support first to market by which products clear the Phase III commercialization hurdle first. The greedy scientists provide for add-on applications for the drugs using the Phase IV post commercialization process. The greedy FDA provides the hurdles. The greedy scientists provide the heavily documented solutions. The greedy engineers put all types of automated equipment to work. The greedy marketing people explain the new products to the user at a level they can understand. Before the product is launched, the greedy lawyers are involved with patent protection in hundreds of markets. When the system doesn't work as planned, a different set of greedy lawyers take up the charge again. Viagra, the blue pill, comes from research for improved blood circulation. Happy greedy scientists, doctors, engineers all working overtime to bring the Pfizer product to market in a responsible way. Greedy over-the-boarder 'pharmacists' selling drug products on-line to customers in the US have created an interesting business model of cutting out the health care specialists like greedy doctors.... Greedy finance people determine which companies to combine to extract the most "value" in the public markets by closing facilities and laying off the most people possible while still producing the products. Go greedy capitalism! How long can we live with the products brought by the greedy systems? How long can we live without them....? Natural products have always been good for people. Nothing dangerous ever comes from natural products like alcohol and tobacco? How about Marijuana, that's naturally got to be good...? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Pleisse Posted January 26, 2015 Report Share Posted January 26, 2015 Oh...and patent manipulation. Wouldn't want to make a buck for a few years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyboy0681 Posted January 26, 2015 Report Share Posted January 26, 2015 Many many health care breakthroughs were not American. Small pox immunizations from an English surgeon, microorganisms from a Dutch entrepreneur, x-rays from a German physicist, genetics from an Austrian monk, and penicillin from an English doctor ... Man's quest for knowledge and answers has no borders ... You forgot to mention that perhaps none of these discoveries could be credited to socialized health care? Fleming discovered penicillin(1928) as an accident after leaving trays out on a corner table while he was gone on vacation. (His lab at stake Mary's hospital was known to be always a mess), a month later he discovers some trays of staph were contaminated with a fungus, and that fungus killed staph. His work was ignored and taken up later by others. Socialized care in England did not come another twenty years. Banting was at Toronto, became interested in the pancreas, built on others work to find a way to isolate and extract human Insulin. Socialized health care in Canada was not introduced until decades later. The chemist Gerhardt in the1800s took ancient remedies of willow bark and modified them forming acetylsalicylic acid.You forgot to mention Bayer made money calling it aspirin and selling it all over the world. Please feel free to attack Bayer as a greedy capitalist! I'm well aware of Fleming's unusual discovery, I just wanted to point out that American's were not (and are not) the only ones who contribute to the better of mankind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyboy0681 Posted January 26, 2015 Report Share Posted January 26, 2015 Is Timmy still medicated or has he been institutionalized? It must be hard for him to remember why no one likes airplanes. I'm not sure which page of this book to find the answer for him. Clarence His HMO only authorized five days. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Pleisse Posted January 26, 2015 Report Share Posted January 26, 2015 People here loudly proclaim that we have the best healthcare system in he world, until they get sick and go bankrupt for it. Some even die because you know, health insurance companies had whole departments to deny claims and even rescind policies. And for all that we spend 18% of GDP on it, and double digit inflation incosts, and worse outcomes that pretty much every other advanced nation that pays half per capita we do. Half. But ther sure are a lot of people yelling their heads off here about Freedom. Where is personal responsibility? Our obesity rate is approaching 40%. This accounts for a larger part of our health expense than anything you have enumerated. Is it really our government's job to monitor this? It is the difference in cost per patient here and abroad. My kid's public middle school....fat kids everywhere. PE, 3 days a week. Their previous Catholic school, one hour of PE everyday, 1/2 hour recess and nobody has a choice, you must play on an athletic team after school. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Pleisse Posted January 26, 2015 Report Share Posted January 26, 2015 I read more drug research and development goes on In Switzerland than here, where Pharmaceutical companies spend more on marketing and advertising than developing new drugs. Then we get to pay 5-10 sometimes 100 times more for the same drug. Novartis... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyboy0681 Posted January 26, 2015 Report Share Posted January 26, 2015 Oh...and patent manipulation. Wouldn't want to make a buck for a few years. The TV commercials are the worst part of pharmacopeia. The only other country that I'm aware of that allows this practice is New Zealand, and I think they tone them down a lot more there. Why ours have to have the top 100 side effects is beyond me. They should only be required to mention the top two. And whatever happened to restless leg syndrome? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyboy0681 Posted January 26, 2015 Report Share Posted January 26, 2015 Where is personal responsibility? Our obesity rate is approaching 40%. This accounts for a larger part of our health expense than anything you have enumerated. Is it really our government's job to monitor this? It is the difference in cost per patient here and abroad. My kid's public middle school....fat kids everywhere. PE, 3 days a week. Their previous Catholic school, one hour of PE, 1/2 hour recess and nobody has a choice, you must play on an athletic team after school. I agree 100%. Many blame it on "cheap" calories, but that makes me wonder why I'm not obese. Growing up in NYC in the '70's I had access to every imaginable junk food, yet me and my siblings were very trim. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Pleisse Posted January 26, 2015 Report Share Posted January 26, 2015 I agree 100%. Many blame it on "cheap" calories, but that makes me wonder why I'm not obese. Growing up in NYC in the '70's I had access to every imaginable junk food, yet me and my siblings were very trim. Companies like Mickey Dee's know they are facing a liability nightmare. Big Mac? Gone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyboy0681 Posted January 26, 2015 Report Share Posted January 26, 2015 Companies like Mickey Dee's know they are facing a liability nightmare. Big Mac? Gone. The reporting of the demise of the Big Mac was a a bit premature: http://www.snopes.com/media/notnews/bigmac.asp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Pleisse Posted January 26, 2015 Report Share Posted January 26, 2015 The reporting of the demise of the Big Mac was a a bit premature: http://www.snopes.com/media/notnews/bigmac.asp Really......I only heard it second hand and maybe McDonalds should take a hint. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BorealOne Posted January 26, 2015 Report Share Posted January 26, 2015 I'm confused - so 'regulated' means 'socialist'? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyboy0681 Posted January 26, 2015 Report Share Posted January 26, 2015 Not a "rabid" fan. But ssshhhhh ... Don't let Obama and the American socialists know about R&D in other countries or he'll issue executive orders preventing that from leaving the US too ... so they are forced to stay here and pay higher taxes ... just like he did to Burger King ... !!!! (Most of the oil companies already escaped!) All these companies are just inherently evil. And the waste on advertising! Like good socialists ... are we to believe if a socialist government just took over these evil companies getting tax deductions and making a profit, our good, holy pure, government regulators will cure all illness? That is what socialists do. Pick a business. Complain about their profits, complain about not paying enough taxes. Complain that their product is evil, because their motive for profit is evil. Offer a "good" socialism as a cure for "bad" free enterprise. You pick and chose however, pharmas, oil companies, health care ... are the favorites socialist when not attacking fast food, and soda pop or guns ... Those are all evil and we are "victims." Same ole broken record. Nice well rehearsed arguments you make though ... What a load of horsecrap. If you were correct on this one then we wouldn't be sending software jobs to India at an alarming rate. Instead Obama would be doing everything in his power (even an EO) to keep them here. You conservatives never cease to make me laugh. You throw around the "S" word more than any other word in the English lexicon. After all is said and done, you and your minions will look like a bunch of idiots once he is out of office and everything comes into focus. You guys will look much like the birthers do now, a whiny bunch of malcontents who cry every day because their man (men) lost in 2008 and 2012. It's about time you all got over it. Move on with your life. I don't carry on because Al Gore lost and while I didn't agree with all of Bush's policies, I wasn't going around crying the entire eight years like you people are. Sheesh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyboy0681 Posted January 26, 2015 Report Share Posted January 26, 2015 I'm confused - so 'regulated' means 'socialist'? You live north of the border and probably have a difficult time understanding the mentality of the American conservative. They are passionate about their politics and if they don't like a policy that the other side promotes, they whine about it and throw all kinds of names at them. Sometimes this passion is so strong that they will do everything in their power to obstruct government. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyboy0681 Posted January 26, 2015 Report Share Posted January 26, 2015 Not doing your research again? Obama's Executive order was three or four months ago? He waited until the day after he bombed Syria for first time, and while the obedient media was in a frenzy discussing bombs, he issued an executive order (targeting Burger King) preventing corporations from merging and re-establishing corporate status outside the US. Thereby, forcing them to remain US entities and pay our higher tax rates. It's the same for citizens. Once you are here, our government feels like they legally own you ... and your income until death! Andy said as much about his sister living abroad ... While I don't like taxes as much as the next guy (and especially you), I guess it won't mean much to you when I say that American's are among the least taxed people on the planet. https://rankingamerica.wordpress.com/2010/04/15/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyboy0681 Posted January 26, 2015 Report Share Posted January 26, 2015 and while the obedient media was in a frenzy discussing bombs, he issued an executive order (targeting Burger King) preventing corporations from merging and re-establishing corporate status outside the US. Thereby, forcing them to remain US entities and pay our higher tax rates. It's the same for citizens. Once you are here, our government feels like they legally own you ... and your income until death! Andy said as much about his sister living abroad ... Does the "obedient" media include Fox? While I applaud Fox for issuing three separate apologies on the same day, they have yet to report on the findings of Darrell Issa's subcommittee report on the IRS "scandal". I guess CNN isn't the only news outlet that omits major stories. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alex Posted January 26, 2015 Report Share Posted January 26, 2015 Flyboy4 44 is here.....do we know where FOXdriven or Andy might be? Anyone? Too harsh? .....ban me! http://www.politico.com/blogs/media/2015/01/report-fox-news-protestor-shoots-himself-outside-news-201609.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyboy0681 Posted January 26, 2015 Report Share Posted January 26, 2015 Software jobs to India! Obama promised to keep our jobs here! And he is historic! That is what Obama said Romney would do ... (send our jobs to,China) and he would keep,our jobs here! Remember "Osama bin Laden dead - GM alive!" So you are saying he makes false promises he doesn't keep and never intend to? Romney Obama ... no difference at all? Got you! Since the subject of India software development is very near and dear to me, I keep my head to the grindstone on the subject. What you obviously don't know is that in 2010 Obama proposed a surcharge (ok, you can call it tax) to those American companies that ship off software jobs to India and lay off their employees, to act as a disincentive. The GOP viewed it as an additional tax on American companies and it never made it to committee. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyboy0681 Posted January 26, 2015 Report Share Posted January 26, 2015 Flyboy4 44 is here.....do we know where FOXdriven or Andy might be? Anyone? Too harsh? .....ban me! http://www.politico.com/blogs/media/2015/01/report-fox-news-protestor-shoots-himself-outside-news-201609.html If you know anything about Bellvue, you would know it's not typically the place where you are taken for medical treatment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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