Looking for M20C, 1970 or later

[rbuck]

I'm new to Mooneys, but I'm interested in purchasing an M20C. I'm looking for a 1970 or later, something that mechanically functions well and has mid-engine time for sub-$40,000. I know, a tall order.

 

I'm currently in Afghanistan, but will be returning home in a few months and hope to find a plane then. This will be my first plane to own, and I'm not sure where else to look beyond this group. Anyone have anything like this, or would know the direction to point me in?

 

Thanks in advance.

[Jerry 5TJ]

There are currently 20 M20C airplanes listed on controller:

 

http://www.controller.com/drilldown/modelList.aspx?manu=Mooney

 

Controller seems to be one of the most active sites for plane sales these days. 

[rbridges]

why 1970 or later?  

[Hank]

Cause they're GOOD! :-)

[rbuck]

It's kind of a small thing, but I like control levers a lot more than the push-pull rods on engine controls. Weird, maybe, but true. From what I can tell, it's the 1970 and later models that have those.

[rbridges]

It's kind of a small thing, but I like control levers a lot more than the push-pull rods on engine controls. Weird, maybe, but true. From what I can tell, it's the 1970 and later models that have those.

 

there's some other subtle differences.  IIRC, ownership changed during that time.  I'd research some things and decide.  The only apparent exterior cosmetic difference came in '64 when the rear window changed.  Mine has a retractable vacuum operated step.  Others have mechanical and fixed steps.  You can't install rosen visors on pre-67 models, etc.  Little things to know about each model year. There's people on here that can regurgitate the stuff on demand.  

 

also, you may want to post your ad on barnstormers.  they allow free word ads on their website.

[rbuck]

Ah, I see. Thanks for the info. It's kinda hard to do research given my current location, but I am going to look into the corrosion deal. Barnstormers is a good idea, too. I'll try it.

 

Also, since I'm new to Mooneys, and owning planes in general, what are the typical operating costs like? I've been researching that over time, but you all would probably know better.

 

And the first question still applies, too, if anyone has any other thoughts.Thanks!

[Z W]

You can find plenty of fine examples of a M20C for under $40k, but you will find that you probably cannot get everything you would otherwise want.  The biggest items:

 

1. An IFR GPS (if you plan to fly IFR)

2. A functioning autopilot

3. A 4-cylinder engine monitor

4. A standard 6-pack panel for your instruments

5. Nice paint and interior

 

Those are the biggest ticket items.  At $40k if you find one with a mid time engine and all of that, it will be a steal.  You probably need to set your priorities from that list, and then look for a plane offering the most for the buck.

 

Operating expenses, you should budget $10k/year for hangar, insurance, annual, and basic maintenance.  Gas and oil changes is extra.  If you have any major repairs that will be too low; If you don't, it will be a little high.

[Hank]

A good C is a bargain. Hangar rent varies by where you live--there have been threads on here documenting from $100 to >$600 per month. Find out what it costs in your area, and get on the list(s) at the airport(s) near you, or where you think you will be next.

 

I find my long term, block fuel burn to be really close to 9 gph. I run anywhere from 85-110 hours/year; call it 100 hours = 9 gallons. Gas prices vary widely, too; it's $5.60 at home, but I just paid ~$160 for 22 gallons on the road [$7.25! OUCH!!], so $6 is easy math for a decent approximation. 100 hours = 900 gallons x $6 = $5400 in fuel.

 

Change the oil every 50 hours [7 quarts x $8 = $56; price a Champion filter, $20?]; by my next change probably in June, I'll have added 4 quarts, call it $150/year.

 

Insurance will run $1000 & up depending on hull value, pilot experience, hangarage, location, etc. I do owner-assisted annuals, parts count varies, call it $1500-$2000 annually. Don't yet have a bill for my recent carb overhaul, but my tank reseal a couple years ago was $6500 cash. Battery every 2-3 years is $250; main tires are $140 each; tubes are >$100 each [yikes!]; nose tire is about to be replaced again, but they're cheaper [i think I put one on in 2008, and may replace it this summer; just replaced my mains for the first time last fall, been flying the plane since '07].

 

Add it up for a rough cut at operating expenses, just don't give me the total please.

 

A nice thing about the C model is the wing leveler, you really don't need a fancy autopilot. The two Brittain systems are excellent [AccuTrack and AccuFlite]; one is a heading bug to fly in long, straight lines, the other one will fly a route from your Nav source [mine is wired to my G430W, and to Nav2 King VOR], but neither does anything for altitude. Even without them, if your servos are good, you won't need an autopilot, she'll fly straight and level. My servo rebuild at Thanksgiving was $124 plus shipping, you can't touch that on STEC or any others!

 

Engine monitors are nice to have, as are storm scopes, XM weather, fuel totalizers, etc., but they aren't necessary. I get by very well with factory single-point probes, single EGT and an added on Carb Temp gage.

 

Watch for the typical Vintage Mooney lookouts [search for George Perry's excellent thread from 3 or 4 years ago]. Electric gear and flaps became standard in '69; the rudder was lengthened to reach below the horizontal stabilizer in '66 or '67, and you will want the longer one. Get a good pre-purchase inspection! A manual-gear C sold near here last summer [my A&P traveled ~30 Mooney minutes to do the PPI] for mid-$30's, but alas, no GPS. You pays your money and makes your choice. If I recall correctly, the new owner flew the plane home, and not long after flew it to Oshkosh. It's doable, but will take some searching.

 

Keep us posted on your return and your research. We can be pretty good at checking into stuff before you get back. I have no idea when the throttle quadrant started, but I like it.

[SkyBound]

Hi Rbuck,

 

Please take a look at my 1970 M20C with a fresh March 2013 Annual and IFR Pitot Static inspection currently listed for $29,990:

 

http://www.treborav8.com/Treborav8/My_Sales_Albums/Pages/1970_Mooney_Ranger_M20C.html

 

I have owned the airplane for the last 8 years and hope to find a good new home for it.  Please feel free to PM for more information.

 

--Alex

 

http://mooneyspace.com/gallery/album/13710-/

[jbgood11X]

I'VE GOT A GOOD E MODEL THAT WILL BE FOR SALE ABOUT THEN  JUST WAITING FOR MY F MODEL TO GET DONE    JOHN 815 210 2675

[rbuck]

Wow. Thanks everyone for all of your info. Alex, I'll take a look at it in a second. And John, just let me know when you are interested in selling.

Since I'm over here, the best way to contact me is via email at robbucknam@aol.com

 

-Rob

[rbuck]

Gentlemen,

Well, I'm just over a month from coming home to the US (I can't wait!), and I have a couple of questions for you all.

 

First off, I'm still looking at buying an M20C. The more research I do on the planes and the more I just read from this site, the more I want one. Ha. I'm pretty excited. First question, though, is simply when do you think is an appropriate time to start looking around? I realize I started this thread probably a little bit early, and am just curious as to when I should start getting serious with trying to find something. I feel a little bad that I've contacted a few people (including Alex above), but still can't really action on anything.

 

Second question is with the transition to a Mooney. I'm still a fairly new pilot, only about 150 hours, all in a good old Cessna 172. I'm planning on coming home, taking a long weekend (we have a bunch of them in a row) to re-familiarize with an instructor, then knock out my complex endorsement. Trouble is, the only retractable trainer that I can find around my home is a 172RG. I'm assuming that, even after I get my complex, I'll want to at least get checked out in a M20C. Would I plan on doing this when I go find a new one, or should I get that done before hand, too? If before, do you all know anyone in the Seattle-Tacoma area that I could contact about it?

[BigTex]

Rob - I'd say you can watch the market to see what's out there but unless you're ready to make the purchase, you might want to hold off.  It will likely take you several months to find the right aircraft but when you do, you'll need to jump on it because there's no garantee it will stay around very long.  Especially the good ones.

 

For transition traing... You might want to just wait until you purchase your plane and combine the transition training with your complex checkout.  Your insurance company will likely require 10+ hours of dual instruction before being allowed to solo.  That's more than enough time to get your complex endorsement.

[SkyBound]

Rob,

 

You shouldn't feel bad about contacting people early as you do your research.  I was happy to share the information with you.

 

I agree with Gary - combine the transition training to the Mooney with the complex checkout.  That's what I did when I bought my plane.  I had very similar 150 hours of experience in mostly 150/172s.  The insurance company required 5 hours dual and 5 hours solo prior to carrying passengers.  The training went by fast.  I suggest finding a CFI familiar with Mooneys so that you can be properly taught all the intricacies and emergency procedures.  The complex part is easy - you just have to remember to put the gear down. ;-)  Doing it in the plane that you own will also be most cost effective and will allow you to get to know your airplane with confidence.

 

--Alex

[rbuck]

Awesome. Thanks. I'll plan on doing that, using the plane I'll get for the transition.

[b65cuda]

Rob,

I did the same as you. I was in Iraq browsing these forums for months. Then, it was mentioned that my plane would be for sale on here before it was posted anywhere else. I was about a month out from returning home, but I asked that they give me a chance before listing it. I had the pre-buy done while I was overseas, and with some help from a contact at the airport the plane was located, I got a good feel for the airplane. When I returned to the states, I had 1 day that I renewed my medical and flew an hour with an intructor in a warrior. The next day I flew out to California, spent a day looking over the entire plane, reading every logbook entry, and 20 years of mx reciepts. I had already studied the operating handbook, and read the entire Mooney Mx manual. I had an instructor hired to complete my transition training and did it in very minimal time since I had become so familiar with the aircraft prior. After completing the deal, I hired a commercial pilot to make the flight home. We spent 1 extra day in Cali flying his sight seeing tour routes. Flying over the Golden Gate Bridge, a Buhdist Temple, along the coast, wine vinyards, and doing touch and go's in some amazing places was an excelent way to spend one of my first days back from deployment. It also gave me all the confidence I needed that the plane would get me home. Over the next two days I made the trip from Santa Rosa, CA to Abilene, TX, with a night in Phoenix to visit family and show off my life long dream come true, and had the hours I needed for insurance purposes to start flying with passengers.

I have been extreemly happy with my purchase. As far as cost of ownership. I figure on $1k/month keeps me in good with the finance company, hangar, insurance, and savings for annuals and general mx.

Fast forward a couple of years, I am now looking to get married and take on 3 little ones, so my baby will be listed for sale very soon. Should post on controller today. I can reply to topics here at work, but I get blocked by the military network if I try to start a new topic here. For whatever reason at home, if I try to log into mooneyspace, all I get is a message saying apache is functioning normally.

Not to hijack your thread, but if you or anyone is interested in a well maintained F model that is right around your price range, shoot me an email at b65cuda@yahoo.com and I'll email you the flyer with all the details and pictures. I will continue to try to get it posted here when I figure out what I am doing wrong. I am pricing it low trying to get started on savings for this wedding! Vegas is sounding really good right now.

Stay safe out there,

Anthony Dickerson

1967 Mooney M20F Exec 21.pdf

[carusoam]

Anthony,

Let us know if you need a post started. Leave the specifics here, I can start the new thread, cut and paste style...

Thanks for your service.

Best regards,

-a-