Solo Cup Delivery System

[Yetti]

I've seen it all now.   Drone with a Solo Cup Delivery System.

 

[Yetti]

Seems like a Country and Western song should be written about this

[A64Pilot]

You would think they would have the cup flip and drop the grenade out of it to make sure it comes out of the cup.

You can jury rig a poor man’s Claymore by nailing a C rat can to a tree and put a grenade in it with the pin pulled, then run a trip wire tied to the grenade, wire pulls the grenade out, spoon flies and boom.

You want to swap the fuse with a smoke grenade fuse though, they have no delay, be careful with that though because if you forget and throw it, it’s going off the instant it leaves your hand. I was surprised when I found out about this that the fuse is interchangeable. Wanna frag someone? swap fuses on their grenade

I’m surprised the Russians aren’t shooting these drones down, Commercial drones are easy to jam 

[Hank]

1 hour ago, A64Pilot said:

I’m surprised the Russians aren’t shooting these drones down, Commercial drones are easy to jam 

This was a RUSSIAN drone . . . . 

[A64Pilot]

11 hours ago, Hank said:

This was a RUSSIAN drone . . . . 

OK then the Other side then, Commercial and better hobby drones all work on 2.4 GHZ, same frequency RC went to years ago, it’s a single frequency now and different aircraft are “paired” to the transmitter allowing a great many to fly on one frequency. Jamming a single frequency is easy, if you have to cover a whole band it’s only a little harder then you have to “barrage” jam which just takes more power. Any hobbyist can build a crude jammer.

Of course anything that transmits is easy targeted, way back in the day by a HARM, today it would be easy to have a suicide drone home in on the transmitter, kill the operator and transmitter and you have killed the drone.

What’s possible with modern electronics is nothing short of amazing, 20 years ago light up a flight of Longbows with only one sweep of Radar the angle of arrival of the beam was known precisely, couple that with all the aircraft were on a digital net with each other and their locations were precisely known so that the precise location of the radar could be triangulated, from there it was a simple matter to launch a radar Hellfire to that precise location and the missile using its own radar would kill the transmitter.

First Gulf war, no Iraqi artillery battery ever fired a second shot, not even one, they all received counter battery fire after firing the first shot. As soon as they fired Radar knew their precise location. That was thirty years ago? US self propelled artillery can now shot and scoot, stop, fire and move immediately.

 

[Yetti]

On 5/19/2022 at 4:59 PM, A64Pilot said:

You would think they would have the cup flip and drop the grenade out of it to make sure it comes out of the cup.

You can jury rig a poor man’s Claymore by nailing a C rat can to a tree and put a grenade in it with the pin pulled, then run a trip wire tied to the grenade, wire pulls the grenade out, spoon flies and boom.

You want to swap the fuse with a smoke grenade fuse though, they have no delay, be careful with that though because if you forget and throw it, it’s going off the instant it leaves your hand. I was surprised when I found out about this that the fuse is interchangeable. Wanna frag someone? swap fuses on their grenade

I’m surprised the Russians aren’t shooting these drones down, Commercial drones are easy to jam 

modified RPG round that is nose heavy so does not need to come out of the cup. You know unless you are one of those people that reuses the solo cups by washing them.    Drop mechanism is easier with servos than rotate.   String and pull a pin on the string.

The ruskie command forgot to plan on gas for the tanks.   You think they gave them jamming equipment?   The second best delivery system I saw was some NLAW carrying cases mounted to electric Bike.   Stealthy fast and silent.   Easy retreat.

 

Edited May 24, 2022 by Yetti

[A64Pilot]

Most of the worlds militaries are looking at electric bikes, many years ago Rangers in Savannah rode Kawasaki dirt bikes, but as you say electric bikes are silent.

A few years ago hybrid Military vehicles were considered because they could have a limited silent range, but not be tied to chargers.

So far as not planning on fuel etc. I think they thought it would be like invading Czech in 68, that is they would overwhelm the defenders and burn captured fuel, no need for sustainment

But now that they have bogged down they have two choices, either quit or reinforce.

If we are really shipping HIMARS in any real quantity, and if they aren’t destroyed right away, that will be a game changer. I think HIMARS is an improved MLRS. We used to call them a Grid square eliminators, meaning that everything within a box 1,000 meters X 1,000 meters died, even main battle tanks. So any grouping of Russian Military will be a target, and if they are within 50 miles or so will be killed, best defense is don’t group up, but that’s Soviet doctrine to group up and be an overwhelming force.

I’m sure we aren’t sending ATACMS, that gives an even longer range.

The MLRS / HIMARS are particularly suited for anti armor, essentially making a Motorized Rifle Regiment go away, so it will force a major change in doctrine making them break up into much smaller maneuver units. I don’t know how Russia is deploying their Armor whether they are using Soviet doctrine or not, I Retired 20 years ago so I’m way out of date.

If the Ukraine had Fire Finder radar and HIMARS in sufficient quantity, they could make Russia’s Artillery go away.

I don’t know if it’s myth or not, but we were told no Iraqi artillery battery in the first Gulf war ever fired twice, our counter battery fire was that effective, and MLRS is particularly effective in counter battery fire.

What’s NLAW ?

Edited June 3, 2022 by A64Pilot

[tgardnerh]

What’s NLAW ?

Discount Javelin. I don't mean that dismissively--they're highly sophisticated themselves, just a bit less involved than the Javelin and a lot cheaper. (iirc line of sight only, shorter range, no homing, but still very good at delivering a superplastic jet of metal through the top of a tank)
Apparently they've been used to unbelievably strong effect.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[N201MKTurbo]

What’s NLAW ?
 

M72 made by Nammo, about $2500/round. A Javelin round is about $75000. I’ve worked on both of them.

Edited June 3, 2022 by N201MKTurbo

[GeeBee]

Reminds me of my good friend Hugo Marom. Czech born, holocaust survivor was the initial cadre of Israel's Air Force during the partition. Dropped hand grenades from an E-2 Taylorcraft as their first missions during the Partition. The objective of course was to fly at the correct AGL altitude to get a near ground air burst.

[A64Pilot]

WWI they dropped flechettes on ground troops, no explosive just big darts, probably never knew they were coming. silent killers

‘We have always been pretty inventive in killing each other

https://www.awm.gov.au/collection/REL%3A05361

With helicopters we “ran nails” thousands of tiny flechettes made like nails, when the rocket motor burned out the warhead would pop releasing 2,200 nails and marked by orange smoke. 

Edited June 4, 2022 by A64Pilot

[Pinecone]

On 5/20/2022 at 2:35 PM, A64Pilot said:

OK then the Other side then, Commercial and better hobby drones all work on 2.4 GHZ, same frequency RC went to years ago, it’s a single frequency now and different aircraft are “paired” to the transmitter allowing a great many to fly on one frequency. Jamming a single frequency is easy, if you have to cover a whole band it’s only a little harder then you have to “barrage” jam which just takes more power. Any hobbyist can build a crude jammer.

It is not a single frequency.  It is a band.  And most of the systems are spread spectrum to reduce the risk of jamming or simple overloading of a slot.

https://www.rcmodelreviews.com/spreadspectrum01.shtml

 

[Pinecone]

On 6/4/2022 at 3:03 AM, GeeBee said:

Reminds me of my good friend Hugo Marom. Czech born, holocaust survivor was the initial cadre of Israel's Air Force during the partition. Dropped hand grenades from an E-2 Taylorcraft as their first missions during the Partition. The objective of course was to fly at the correct AGL altitude to get a near ground air burst.

 

US O-1 Birddog pilots did this in SAE.  They would put the grenade, with pin pulled, in Mason jars.  They used shorter delay fuses than for hand thrown.

They would toss them out the open window, when they hit, the jar would break, releasing the spoon and setting off the grenade.

[GeeBee]

I hear the fuse rate is very inconsistent.

 

[A64Pilot]

On 6/7/2022 at 8:33 AM, GeeBee said:

I hear the fuse rate is very inconsistent.

 

Fuse rate for grenades? they are pretty close, but I’d never cook one off myself, that’s letting the spoon fly, counting to three then throwing it, removes the possibility of it being picked up and thrown away. Rangers will cook grenades sometimes. I think to get them to detonate reliably at a set height would be tough. The timer is literally a burning fuse, it will smoke a little so you know it’s burning.

I’ve seen a few Military explosives go off, in every instance from a grenade to a 500 lb bomb, there was a LOT of very black smoke. You see that well in old films of actual “flack”. I didn’t see the black smoke in that video. I don’t know why the black smoke, dynamite for instance doesn’t have it.

[Pinecone]

The O-1 guys were not looking for air burst.  That is why they put them in Mason jars.  So they would hit the ground, the jar would shatter and the spoon would fly off, igniting the fuse.

 

The standard fuses were 5 seconds, but for this use, they could (and preferred) a shorter time fuse.   I know that there are 0 time fuses for booby trap use.

[A64Pilot]

8 hours ago, Pinecone said:

The O-1 guys were not looking for air burst.  That is why they put them in Mason jars.  So they would hit the ground, the jar would shatter and the spoon would fly off, igniting the fuse.

 

The standard fuses were 5 seconds, but for this use, they could (and preferred) a shorter time fuse.   I know that there are 0 time fuses for booby trap use.

The 0 time delay fuse comes from a smoke grenade, surprisingly they are interchangeable, they just are screwed in hand tight you don’t even need a tool to remove them. If you got a grenade that someone put a smoke grenade fuse into, then it would detonate as soon as you let the spoon fly.

I don’t know if they are still interchangeable, but would hope the smoke grenade fuse head is painted a color or something to make it obvious.

One trick was to nail a C-ration can to a tree, slide a grenade in it with the smoke grenade fuse in it, then attach a trip wire. The instant the grenade was pulled out of the can it detonated.

I liked Claymores though, much mo better. You had a “Clacker” to remote detonate them.

[Yetti]

On 6/10/2022 at 9:37 AM, A64Pilot said:

The 0 time delay fuse comes from a smoke grenade, surprisingly they are interchangeable, they just are screwed in hand tight you don’t even need a tool to remove them. If you got a grenade that someone put a smoke grenade fuse into, then it would detonate as soon as you let the spoon fly.

I don’t know if they are still interchangeable, but would hope the smoke grenade fuse head is painted a color or something to make it obvious.

One trick was to nail a C-ration can to a tree, slide a grenade in it with the smoke grenade fuse in it, then attach a trip wire. The instant the grenade was pulled out of the can it detonated.

I liked Claymores though, much mo better. You had a “Clacker” to remote detonate them.

Here you go the ruskies got a UA drone and documented it.  

[A64Pilot]

44 minutes ago, Yetti said:

Here you go the ruskies got a UA drone and documented it.  

I’m a doubting Thomas, it’s my nature. I don’t recognize that piece of ordinance at all anyone know what it is?

Is it some kind of homemade thing like a piece of plastic pipe with fins on something?

Ordinance that size, if I can determine it’s size is usually awfully heavy, heavier than a drone of that size could lift I’d think, unless it’s something with a lightweight piece of thin plastic pipe with fins on it?

Whats a UA drone?

Just saying there is a whole lot of fake BS on the internet is all, how do you tell what’s real?

[Fly Boomer]

2 hours ago, A64Pilot said:

don’t recognize that piece of ordinance at all anyone know what it is?

Something like this with an aerodynamic tail?

 

[A64Pilot]

No idea, why bother with a tail?

Maybe it’s a shaped charge?

Edited June 13, 2022 by A64Pilot

[EricJ]

31 minutes ago, Fly Boomer said:

Something like this with an aerodynamic tail?

 

Yes, it was published several months ago that they're using Soviet RKG-3 anti-tank grenades (which employ a shaped charge which is still apparently still effective against top armor in many vehicles), and put a 3D-printed aerodynamic stabilizing tail on it, replacing the original parachute.   Pretty clever.

https://militaryleak.com/2022/03/18/ukrainian-forces-showed-their-unmanned-aerial-vehicle-attacks-on-russian-armored-vehicle/

[Yetti]

5 hours ago, A64Pilot said:

I’m a doubting Thomas, it’s my nature. I don’t recognize that piece of ordinance at all anyone know what it is?

Is it some kind of homemade thing like a piece of plastic pipe with fins on something?

Ordinance that size, if I can determine it’s size is usually awfully heavy, heavier than a drone of that size could lift I’d think, unless it’s something with a lightweight piece of thin plastic pipe with fins on it?

Whats a UA drone?

Just saying there is a whole lot of fake BS on the internet is all, how do you tell what’s real?

UA is the kind of standard abbreviation for Ukraine.   Apparently it is a KZ-6 with some fins added.

"The KZ-6 uses 1.8kg of TG-40 HE & can penetrate 215mm of armour- so would easily take out any RU vehicle. This one was made in 1986."

[A64Pilot]

I was curious and Googled UA drone, it’s apparently also some kind of video game drone, (metal gear)? wondered if that had gotten into common language

Like the word drone, used to mean a large autonomous military aerial vehicle, but somehow became to mean little electric “toys” as well, yes I’m aware that there are Commercial ones too. Japan has used RC helicopters to spray rice for years, made by Kawasaki and maybe Yanmar, maybe Yamaha? Now those can lift some weight, might could even drop an artillery shell?

Yeah, I get the grenade, never had heard of a shaped charge hand thrown grenade before though that’s new to me. but it makes sense to drop one of those from a “drone” as if memory serves the standard RPG round weighs in at about 15 lbs, and can a common drone lift that kind of weight? I have no idea but assume weight is a limiting factor.

 

 

[A64Pilot]

70lbs carrying capacity if I do the math right, more I’m sure if you stripped all the spray equipment off, pumps etc, so maybe 80 lbs?

https://global.yamaha-motor.com/news/2016/1011/fazer_r.html