Electric Motor Mooney Conversion

[N201MKTurbo]

2 hours ago, clh said:

That would be a game changer.  The next question is: Can the electrical grid handle the load?

They just need to put a big diesel generator out back of the gas station to charge the cars.

[ArtVandelay]

The last operational nuclear reactor built was back in 1996…so where’s all this “free” electricity going to come from?

[GeeBee]

9 hours ago, RobertGary1 said:

I don’t think anyone supposes similar regulation will hit aircraft. The point is that emissions are being used as justification to close airports. Rich guy toys dumping emissions on poor children is how it’s framed. 

The way you combat that is to change the frame. The closing of these airports is because developers are eyeing the land. You tell the developer........look, someday you may have a business airplane too and you won't have a place for it. Then tell all his developer buddies. Their egos will get the better of them....trust me I flew for one for 5 years.  

[A64Pilot]

13 hours ago, RobertGary1 said:

Ford now claims they have tested a charging system that can recharge in the time it takes to pump a tank of gas.  That would be a game changer. 
 

https://www.purdue.edu/newsroom/releases/2021/Q4/electric-vehicles-could-fully-recharge-in-under-5-minutes-with-new-charging-station-cable-design.html

Without even looking that up I can tell you it’s complete nonsense, what it is, is a liquid cooled cable, because if you don’t go to large cables and push huge current through it’s going to get hot. Issue is not the charger, it’s how fast can the batteries be charged, and fast charging damages batteries.

Ref the Grid, according to a Elon Musk to replace private transportation with electric is going to require more than a 100% increase in electrical power generation.

Then to make it worse, everybody wants inefficient SUV’s and PU trucks.

So, no way, no how could the grid possibly support a complete transition. The amount of power an EV uses can easily exceed the amount of current an average house does, depending on the efficiency of the EV and how far it’s driven.

There ain’t no such thing as a free lunch.

[A64Pilot]

2 hours ago, ArtVandelay said:

The last operational nuclear reactor built was back in 1996…so where’s all this “free” electricity going to come from?

In my opinion the only realistic place is Nuclear, what else could it? Solar or wind? Sun doesn’t always shine and the wind doesn’t always blow so how do you get through those periods?

Edited November 19, 2021 by A64Pilot

[N201MKTurbo]

1 hour ago, ArtVandelay said:

The last operational nuclear reactor built was back in 1996…so where’s all this “free” electricity going to come from?

The last new nuclear plant in the USA came on line in 2016 two more are being built in Georgia.

[N201MKTurbo]

If the USA wants to get serious about nuclear, they need to start reprocessing spent fuel and get all the tree hugging electric car driving protesters out of the way of Yucca Mountain.

[PilotX]

On 11/17/2021 at 6:24 AM, N201MKTurbo said:

Putting a 200hp electric motor in a Mooney isn't that much of a technical challenge. 

Managing the extension cord it the challenge!

Everybody complains about the price of gas but have you seen the price of extension cords lately? Make AVGAS seem like a bargain.

[RobertGary1]

1 hour ago, N201MKTurbo said:

If the USA wants to get serious about nuclear, they need to start reprocessing spent fuel and get all the tree hugging electric car driving protesters out of the way of Yucca Mountain.

There actually is a segment of greenies who are pro nuclear. 
It is interesting to me that one of the arguments against nuclear is the spent fuel. We had a nuclear plant in sacramento for a decade. The spent  fuel was stored on site. When they closed it the decade of spent fit on one truck. 
Also if there is so much energy in the spent fuel to make it dangerous I’m sure someday we’ll be digging it up and mining it. 

[A64Pilot]

1 hour ago, N201MKTurbo said:

If the USA wants to get serious about nuclear, they need to start reprocessing spent fuel and get all the tree hugging electric car driving protesters out of the way of Yucca Mountain.

People use to say the same thing about a Prius, I’m no tree hugger, but had a Prius since 2010. It was traded for the Tesla.

Reason for both is simply economics, our Prius more than paid for itself in fuel cost, it was a “free” car and then some.

Assuming you believe JD Power, it cost $3.19  to “fuel” a model 3 Tesla for 100 miles. Now JD Power is I assume a reliable source?

https://www.jdpower.com/cars/shopping-guides/what-is-kwh-per-100-miles

Our Miata just to use it as an example gets 25 MPG, so in 100 miles it will burn 4 gls of fuel, you do the math for what you pay for fuel. In our case it’s about $3.50 for Premium, so it costs $14 to fuel a Miata for 100 miles.

Comparing $3.19 to $14 is a pretty convincing argument. It’s cost us 4.4 times as much to drive our Miata than our Tesla.

Now I believe the JD number is wrong because I think it assumes charging is 100% efficient, and nothing is 100% efficient, but I don’t think it’s far off, so figure it’s only 400% more to drive a Miata.

But compare it to the Average SUV and then the numbers get really convincing

Thsts why I believe the Government should stay out of it, if an electric vehicle can be driven for less then 1/4 the cost of an ICE vehicle, people will buy them, let free enterprise work.

You don’t have to be a greenie to drive an EV, it’s the logical CB car,just as a Mooney is the logical CB airplane.

Oh, and by the way, many EV’s are fast, the fastest production vehicle every made is a Tesla, it took that record away from an over 2 million dollar Bugatti. Originally set by Jay Leno

Our model 3 SR (cheapest Tesla) is slowly by comparison, it’s only as quick as a Ferrari Testarosa.

Edited November 19, 2021 by A64Pilot

[A64Pilot]

Take the highly radioactive waste and shoot it into the Sun, seriously.

[amillet]

I’m hoping the shift to electric results in a glut of crude oil and Avgas prices tank 

[A64Pilot]

I believe the current total of electric cars in the US is 3%.

Its not going to be this huge change over like the current administration and the news media is saying, it won’t likely in my opinion be where more electric cars are sold than ICE for I’d guess maybe 15 or 20 years, unless the Governement gets into it and starts mandating things which would be extremely short sighted as the Grid can’t supply that much power, remember just to replace private transportation will require more then twice the power currently being generated, and that is a massive issue, one that won’t be solved overnight. That’s just private transportation. 

Electric isn’t for everyone, to start with almost all of the Apartment dwellers it’s not viable for them, rapid charging has serious drawbacks and problem's that’s not being talked about.

Heat kills batteries, but a hot battery can accept a charge faster, so if a Tesla has a Supercharger station it’s navigating to, it “preconditions” the battery. That means it’s heating the battery up, plus fast charging  heats it’s further, but a cool battery won’t accept as fast a charge, so to fast charge requires a hot battery, and that reduces the batteries life span significantly.

[N201MKTurbo]

49 minutes ago, A64Pilot said:

People use to say the same thing about a Prius, I’m no tree hugger, but had a Prius since 2010. It was traded for the Tesla.

Reason for both is simply economics, our Prius more than paid for itself in fuel cost, it was a “free” car and then some.

Assuming you believe JD Power, it cost $3.19  to “fuel” a model 3 Tesla for 100 miles. Now JD Power is I assume a reliable source?

https://www.jdpower.com/cars/shopping-guides/what-is-kwh-per-100-miles

Our Miata just to use it as an example gets 25 MPG, so in 100 miles it will burn 4 gls of fuel, you do the math for what you pay for fuel. In our case it’s about $3.50 for Premium, so it costs $14 to fuel a Miata for 100 miles.

Comparing $3.19 to $14 is a pretty convincing argument. It’s cost us 4.4 times as much to drive our Miata than our Tesla.

Now I believe the JD number is wrong because I think it assumes charging is 100% efficient, and nothing is 100% efficient, but I don’t think it’s far off, so figure it’s only 400% more to drive a Miata.

But compare it to the Average SUV and then the numbers get really convincing

Thsts why I believe the Government should stay out of it, if an electric vehicle can be driven for less then 1/4 the cost of an ICE vehicle, people will buy them, let free enterprise work.

You don’t have to be a greenie to drive an EV, it’s the logical CB car,just as a Mooney is the logical CB airplane.

Oh, and by the way, many EV’s are fast, the fastest production vehicle every made is a Tesla, it took that record away from an over 2 million dollar Bugatti. Originally set by Jay Leno

Our model 3 SR (cheapest Tesla) is slowly by comparison, it’s only as quick as a Ferrari Testarosa.

You only meet one of my three criteria, you are not who I was talking about. I assume you have never opposed Yucca Mountain.

[N201MKTurbo]

1 hour ago, RobertGary1 said:

There actually is a segment of greenies who are pro nuclear. 
It is interesting to me that one of the arguments against nuclear is the spent fuel. We had a nuclear plant in sacramento for a decade. The spent  fuel was stored on site. When they closed it the decade of spent fit on one truck. 
Also if there is so much energy in the spent fuel to make it dangerous I’m sure someday we’ll be digging it up and mining it. 

If you are talking Rancho Seco, just like all decommissioned nuclear plants, the spent fuel is still on site. Rancho Seco has 495 fuel rods stored on site. That's the point I was trying to make. There is no place to take them. If we reprocessed them the bulk of the spent fuel would be reused to make new mixed oxide fuel (plutonium and uranium) and the volume of waste would be substantially reduced.

Their license to store the spent fuel was recently extender to 2060.

 

Federal Register Volume 85, Issue 51 (March 16, 2020)

Category

Regulatory Information

Collection

Federal Register

SuDoc Class Number

AE 2.7:
GS 4.107:
AE 2.106:

Publisher

Office of the Federal Register, National Archives and Records Administration

Section

Notices

Action

License renewal; issuance.

Dates

The license referenced in this document is available as of March 9, 2020.

Contact

Kristina Banovac, Office of Nuclear Material Safety and Safeguards, U.S. Nuclear Regulatory Commission, Washington, DC 20555-0001; telephone: 301-415-7116, email: Kristina.Banovac@nrc.gov.

Summary

The U.S. Nuclear Regulatory Commission (NRC) has issued a renewed license to the Sacramento Municipal Utility District for Special Nuclear Materials (SNM) License No. SNM-2510 for the receipt, possession, transfer, and storage of radioactive material from the Rancho Seco Nuclear Generating Station in the Rancho Seco independent spent fuel storage installation (ISFSI). The Rancho Seco ISFSI is located on the Rancho Seco site, in Sacramento County, California. The renewed license authorizes operation of the Rancho Seco ISFSI in accordance with the provisions of the renewed license and its technical specifications. The renewed license expires on June 30, 2060.

Agency Name

NUCLEAR REGULATORY COMMISSION

Page Number Range

14981-14982

Federal Register Citation

85 FR 14981 

Docket Numbers

Docket No. 72-11, NRC-2018-0147

FR Doc Number

2020-05323

Edited November 19, 2021 by N201MKTurbo

[A64Pilot]

20 minutes ago, N201MKTurbo said:

You only meet one of my three criteria, you are not who I was talking about. I assume you have never opposed Yucca Mountain.

I know, but to group EV or Hybrid drivers as tree huggers or greenies or whatever is incorrect.

Many of us, quite a few actually drive them based on simple economics.

The Sticker price of our Prius in 2010 was $24,000, we traded it on the Tesla with 270,000 miles on it.

If you assume 50 MPG ( government rating ) and a $2.50 per gl for fuel it cost $13,500 for fuel.

To drive a 15 MPG SUV would have cost $45,000

To drive a 25 MPG vehicle would be $27,000.

See the Wife at the time was driving nearly 100 miles a day to work, and her CTS-V was breaking me with its requirement for Premium fuel and cost for tires etc.

She has gone back to work, and driving nearly 70 miles a day now, so we bought the Tesla for similar reasons that we bought the Prius, but also as the Tesla is the safest car made today made it an easier choice.

Other than social standing you just can’t make a logical argument for all of the SUV’s on the road, and making them electric doesn’t change efficiency, merely changes the power source is all.

A CB wants efficiency, and currently a Tesla model 3 is the most efficient electric vehicle.

[EricJ]

3 hours ago, N201MKTurbo said:

The last new nuclear plant in the USA came on line in 2016 two more are being built in Georgia.

There's also stuff like this going on, which is fairly promising.    I suspect we're unlikely to see any benefits in our lifetimes, but work is still being done.

https://arstechnica.com/science/2021/11/bill-gates-nuclear-power-company-selects-a-site-for-its-first-reactor

[RobertGary1]

2 hours ago, A64Pilot said:

Take the highly radioactive waste and shoot it into the Sun, seriously.

Our rocketry technology is good but not perfect. Wouldn’t want bits and pieces of that raining down 

[N201MKTurbo]

34 minutes ago, EricJ said:

There's also stuff like this going on, which is fairly promising.    I suspect we're unlikely to see any benefits in our lifetimes, but work is still being done.

https://arstechnica.com/science/2021/11/bill-gates-nuclear-power-company-selects-a-site-for-its-first-reactor

I read about this the other day. A sodium cooled plant. They are inherently safer. I remember seeing pictures of a Japanese sodium cooled plant that had a sodium leak. It made one hell of a mess.

 

[A64Pilot]

32 minutes ago, RobertGary1 said:

Our rocketry technology is good but not perfect. Wouldn’t want bits and pieces of that raining down 

Current containment vessels would easily contain it, or if not one that could could be designed or maybe an escape system

Current Falcon heavy can toss 16 tons to escape velocity and the BFR if it works a whole lot more than that.‘It could be done, not trying to be flippant, but everything to do it, exists.

 

[A64Pilot]

There are several designs of small nuke plants that can’t melt down, but the Government is still stuck in the 1950’s Admiral Rickover designs, you know the same reason we fly behind our Grandfathers engines.

My prediction is they will yield, they will have too, or bring back coal in a big way.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_small_modular_reactor_designs

Edited November 19, 2021 by A64Pilot

[AH-1 Cobra Pilot]

4 hours ago, A64Pilot said:

Take the highly radioactive waste and shoot it into the Sun, seriously.

I presume that is a joke?  Would you be willing to pay $30,000-$50,000 per pound?  Not to mention the possibility of a failed launch?

[AH-1 Cobra Pilot]

3 hours ago, A64Pilot said:

The Sticker price of our Prius in 2010 was $24,000, we traded it on the Tesla with 270,000 miles on it.

If you assume 50 MPG ( government rating ) and a $2.50 per gl for fuel it cost $13,500 for fuel.

I have a VW diesel Jetta that averages 53 mpg.  It cost $27,000 in 2015, and lately diesel has been cheaper than regular gasoline.  Did you have to change the batteries in the Prius?  What did/would that cost?

What I object to is having to subsidize your Prius, and/or Tesla, to the tune of $16,100, (or probably much more), in taxes.

[Schllc]

https://www.rolls-royce.com/media/press-releases/2021/19-11-2021-spirit-of-innovation-stakes-claim-to-be-the-worlds-fastest-all-electric-vehicle.aspx?utm_source=twitter.com&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=sustainability&utm_term=organic&utm_content=image

[RobertGary1]

Just now, AH-1 Cobra Pilot said:

I have a VW diesel Jetta that averages 53 mpg.  It cost $27,000 in 2015, and lately diesel has been cheaper than regular gasoline.  Did you have to change the batteries in the Prius?  What did/would that cost?

What I object to is having to subsidize your Prius, and/or Tesla, to the tune of $16,100, (or probably much more), in taxes.

In Italy I had a diesel CMax and got 50mpg. In the US it was a hybrid and much more expensive and lower mileage.