Another gear-up this afternoon

[Jim Peace]

I do a GUMP even in fixed gear airplanes....always do the same thing over and over....

[affricate]

On 5/30/2021 at 3:30 AM, carusoam said:

First one for the spring flying season?

Lets all do a Gumps check...   

 

1) Gas...

2) Under carriage...

3) Mixture...

4) Prop...

5) Switches...

 

Well....   looks like he got the first one right.

Not enough definition to the pic to tell how bent the prop is...

When idle, prop tips usually get bent back...

If generating power, tips grab the ground and pull forwards... bending the forwards.

 

PP thoughts only...

Best regards,

-a-

Also this was drilled into my head:

1) Gas

2) Under carriage

3) Mixture

4) Prop

5) Flaps

6) Speed

 

 

[A64Pilot]

On 6/6/2021 at 5:10 PM, Jim Peace said:

I do a GUMP even in fixed gear airplanes....always do the same thing over and over....

Same here, substitute parking brake for wheels down

[CoffeeCan]

On 6/6/2021 at 6:18 AM, M20Doc said:

Early gear retraction is a habit I’ve noticed in Mooney pilots.

Clarence

I've trained myself out of that habit, based on a good bit of reading and some discussion on my last BFR... basically, my plan is to keep the gear down until I have run out of usable runway ahead of me. In the event of an engine failure or other emergency immediately after takeoff, I want to be able to use whatever runway I have left without scraping paint. 

The corollary to that is that once my gear is up in my climbout, it stays up. If I have an engine failure under 1000' AGL, I will be landing on whatever flat surface I can find ahead of my wings and NOT attempting the "impossible turn". Unless I can see a good hard surface ahead of me, my plan is to hit the turf with the wheels up to reduce the chance of flipping the aircraft on touchdown. 

Again, my CFI and I did some training on this on my last BFR:  I configured the aircraft as if I was taking off (40' MP, 2650 RPM, 1/2 flaps, and Vy) and then my CFI cut the power. Even when I was expecting the power loss, getting the nose over and establishing best glide speed takes a good 4-5 seconds, and I lost a MINIMUM of 300' of altitude before BG was attained. 

[JohnB]

9 hours ago, CoffeeCan said:

I've trained myself out of that habit, based on a good bit of reading and some discussion on my last BFR... basically, my plan is to keep the gear down until I have run out of usable runway ahead of me. In the event of an engine failure or other emergency immediately after takeoff, I want to be able to use whatever runway I have left without scraping paint. 

The corollary to that is that once my gear is up in my climbout, it stays up. If I have an engine failure under 1000' AGL, I will be landing on whatever flat surface I can find ahead of my wings and NOT attempting the "impossible turn". Unless I can see a good hard surface ahead of me, my plan is to hit the turf with the wheels up to reduce the chance of flipping the aircraft on touchdown. 

Again, my CFI and I did some training on this on my last BFR:  I configured the aircraft as if I was taking off (40' MP, 2650 RPM, 1/2 flaps, and Vy) and then my CFI cut the power. Even when I was expecting the power loss, getting the nose over and establishing best glide speed takes a good 4-5 seconds, and I lost a MINIMUM of 300' of altitude before BG was attained. 

All sorts of ways to do this, and there probably isn't only one answer. I pull my gear up when I know I cant make a normal landing with wheels down. For example if I have 100 feet of runway left and engine quits, I would rather land gear up to decrease the chance of over-running the runway into traffic or whatever lies beyond. (Pertinent for me as I fly out of busy airports surrounded by cars)

 

As for the impossible turn, that's a whole other topic. I tried it in a simulator, and was highly educational.   It is an uncomfortable, acrobatic maneuver that has to be done essentially immediately on noticing engine failure at low altitude. When I first practiced this maneuver,  I was able to successfully get back to the runway environment in the sim 50% of the time at 500 feet, all of the time at 800 feet, and around 70% of the time at 600-800 feet. I got better as I practiced more.  Note I said runway environment not the actual lined up for the reverse runway, as if I can land normally anywhere on the flat airport/ grass/ taxiway in this emergency, that's something you have a better chance of walking away from. Note that this is a sim and I knew it was coming so I didn't spend any time going "WT..." which is a factor. But I think it is a good idea to practice so you know your limitations in case this ever happens. 

 

[irishpilot]

Here's are a few techniques I use and teach:

On takeoff climbout the gear stays down if there have enough runway to land on if the engine quits. Once there is not enough runway available, the gear comes up. 

For short runways, I use "two climbing, good engine, gear." If you verify that your altimeter, VVI and engine stack are all good prior to touching the handle, you'll be safely climbing and high enough to not settle back onto the runway.

For landing, the gear comes down at the same place every time and is checked a minimum of three times before the flare. For VFR patterns, the gear comes down abeam midfield, so that I'm trimmed and onspeed by the perch point. Gear is checked at the perch, halfway around (500'), and again short final. 

For instrument approaches, I configure at the FAF and I confirm configuration prior to descending. This applies for both precision and non-precision approaches. I check configuration again af DH/MDA, and again before I flare. I verbalize the gear down call even if flying solo for times I'm with a pilot and using CRM.