tomgo2 Posted November 27, 2020 Report Posted November 27, 2020 Just an FYI in case anyone needs a new door seal. Bob Fields Aerocessories is running a sale that ends on Monday. My seal was installed in 1987 and still works great. A true investment that will last for decades! www.aerocessories.aero 1 Quote
carusoam Posted November 27, 2020 Report Posted November 27, 2020 A little life added to tomgo’s link above... https://aerocessories.aero -a- 2 Quote
0TreeLemur Posted November 27, 2020 Report Posted November 27, 2020 I'm interested and hope that so someone will tell me more about this. Since upgrading to the Top Prop, which is much quieter on my a/c the the old prop in cruise, it is now possible to have a conversation with the headphones off. But, the wind noise around the door seems to remain the largest part of the high-frequency noise budget. Any pireps on how much wind noise is reduced? I gather after latching the door, you pump it up and it differentially expands to seal the gap. It will provide noise reduction- how much? It will also stop drafts too I suppose. Before opening the door do you have to deflate it, or will the door open with it inflated? Can it create a safety hazard if you were to fail to deflate it before an off-field landing? BTW thanks to @carusoam for including the link. 2 Quote
tomgo2 Posted November 27, 2020 Author Report Posted November 27, 2020 Hi @0TreeLemur, great questions. Yes, the inflatable door seal eliminates the wind noise originating from the door. We've never used a formal sound level meter, but we would estimate around 5 decibels. There was a recent article in Piper Flyer who also estimated that noise reduction level. You will also notice a warmer cabin in the winter time. The drafts are estimated as well. You simply release the door seal pressure before opening the door. I have forgotten to release the pressure many times over my 10 years of ownership and doesn't cause any damage. Just a little more resistance when you pull the door latch. Check out the link below to see how simple the process is and the noise reduction in real life. 1 Quote
carusoam Posted November 28, 2020 Report Posted November 28, 2020 There are a few pireps by MSers that really like their manual pump door seal... The powered pump had some age related challenges that were not as glowing... but, realistically powered devices vs. all manual... there is always going to be two sides to this coin! The video above does a great job of showing how a single failed seal can cause plenty of wind noise... PP thoughts only, not a mechanic... Best regards, -a- 1 Quote
Danb Posted November 28, 2020 Report Posted November 28, 2020 I have the Bob Fields seal on my Bravo for 5 years or so, it seems to me the noise level drops considerably more than five dec, it’s so dramatic in my plane if I stupidly forget to pump it up I start hearing the air noise as I’m in the middle of my takeoff roll. Recently I took off with brain fade I guess and the noise was so loud I was ready to go back and land then I realized hey stupid pump it up. I also have the remote pump just below the throttle so if it loses any air,once I had a leak, I can pump it up without moving or taking my eyes out of outside. Quote
Graf_Aviator Posted November 28, 2020 Report Posted November 28, 2020 Unfortunately this door seal is not available for M20Rs ...Any hints on a vendor that supplies such a door seal suitable for newer Mooneys?Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Quote
Danb Posted November 28, 2020 Report Posted November 28, 2020 GA, I’ve have the same door as the R, I have an M, the seal fit perfect same door seal. Even though the M R and TN is not listed on the STC my MSC who installed it said M20 is listed same door. 1 Quote
LANCECASPER Posted November 28, 2020 Report Posted November 28, 2020 I just ordered one and it will go on. my M20M. My IA considers it a minor alteration. 2 Quote
Davidv Posted November 28, 2020 Report Posted November 28, 2020 1 minute ago, LANCECASPER said: I just ordered one and it will go on. my M20M. My IA considers it a minor alteration. Which model did you buy if you don't mind me asking? Quote
Davidv Posted November 28, 2020 Report Posted November 28, 2020 10 minutes ago, Danb said: GA, I’ve have the same door as the R, I have an M, the seal fit perfect same door seal. Even though the M R and TN is not listed on the STC my MSC who installed it said M20 is listed same door. Thanks, I may put one in mine, which model do you have? Quote
LANCECASPER Posted November 28, 2020 Report Posted November 28, 2020 Just now, Davidv said: Which model did you buy if you don't mind me asking? The basic one that fits on the door. Quote
Jim Peace Posted November 28, 2020 Report Posted November 28, 2020 would be great if he described the difference between the economy and the deluxe manual seal on his website..... Quote
tomgo2 Posted November 28, 2020 Author Report Posted November 28, 2020 Economy manual installs the squeeze bulb directly on the door panel. Deluxe manual remote locates the bulb underneath the instrument panel next to the pilot along with an optional toggle valve for air pressure release. 1 Quote
Graf_Aviator Posted November 28, 2020 Report Posted November 28, 2020 GA, I’ve have the same door as the R, I have an M, the seal fit perfect same door seal. Even though the M R and TN is not listed on the STC my MSC who installed it said M20 is listed same door.Thanks Danb!I am living in Europe, have to find someone over here to sign off on it. Maybe the MSC can do it when the bird is in for the next annual. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Quote
rotorman Posted November 28, 2020 Report Posted November 28, 2020 Can someone comment on installation time DYI or cost? Quote
tomgo2 Posted November 28, 2020 Author Report Posted November 28, 2020 Completely a DIY project, but keep in mind it is an STC, which means an IA has to sign off and submit a 337 to the feds for their records. Some doors require adjustments to hinges/catches/latches/striker plate and may be a little much for some DIYers. Although sometimes owners do a better job than some heavy handed mechanics. The trick is to take your time, clean the old stuff off really good, follow the drawing and instructions and don't use too much adhesive. In some cases, you may have to carefully remove the seal to adjust after initial installation. Too much adhesive will make installation difficult. If you hire someone, we expect a days' worth of effort. This can mean 4 hours for some and 12 hours for others... 1 Quote
Bolter Posted November 28, 2020 Report Posted November 28, 2020 @tomgo2 The website says: "For those aircraft that are outside and exposed to the elements, inflatable door seals eliminates water intrusion and creates a weather-tight seal for year round exposure." How do you inflate the seal from outside the plane when parked? I am thinking of the manual model, in particular the Deluxe, as I like the idea of keeping this easy for the Pilot to control rather than mostly accessible for the passenger. Quote
tomgo2 Posted November 28, 2020 Author Report Posted November 28, 2020 (edited) All you have to do is open the door, close the air valve, pump a little air into the seal and shut the door. If it is electric, you just switch the power on for a second or two to add some air then switch the power off. Yes, the deluxe is nice because you don't have to reach across the passenger. Sometimes they pop the door open before releasing the air pressure. The deluxe provides the toggle valve near the pilot so you can throw the valve open quickly before they open the door. Remember though, it doesn't necessarily hurt the seal, but over time, it may wear a little quicker or put excess strain on your door latch. Edited November 28, 2020 by tomgo2 Typo 1 Quote
Marauder Posted December 2, 2020 Report Posted December 2, 2020 On 11/28/2020 at 3:29 PM, Bolter said: @tomgo2 The website says: "For those aircraft that are outside and exposed to the elements, inflatable door seals eliminates water intrusion and creates a weather-tight seal for year round exposure." How do you inflate the seal from outside the plane when parked? I am thinking of the manual model, in particular the Deluxe, as I like the idea of keeping this easy for the Pilot to control rather than mostly accessible for the passenger. I was a long time owner of the original Field's door seal. Mine was installed in the late 1980s and was on the plane until it failed a couple of years ago (the seal started cracking in too many places to repair with the recommended RTV). The seal makes a huge difference in air noise around the door in flight. Since removing it, I have yet to find a good mechanical seal that does as good of a job. The downside has been the sealing when you are not flying. I found that when I pumped it up a few pumps (wasn't that a Saturday night live thing "Pump you up!"?) and then closed the door, it would leak down over time. It may have been due to aging of the seal (I don't remember seeing this as a big issue during the 1990s). To work around this, I placed a layer of RTV around the door frame that the Field's seal would rest against without inflating it. 3 Quote
Danb Posted December 2, 2020 Report Posted December 2, 2020 On 11/28/2020 at 9:17 AM, LANCECASPER said: The basic one that fits on the door. Lance be got the deluxe model nice to use with the bulb near your hand, although the regular door mount is easier to install and less prone to leaks Quote
Mcstealth Posted December 3, 2020 Report Posted December 3, 2020 (edited) Is there now a left handed version? The Super Dual Deluxe Ultra version? Edited December 3, 2020 by Mcstealth Quote
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