Joe Larussa Posted September 20, 2018 Report Posted September 20, 2018 Anybody out in Mooneyland replace or repair a muffler lately? Looks like my cones are toast. Rebuild or new?
cliffy Posted September 20, 2018 Report Posted September 20, 2018 I had mine rebuilt by Dawley years ago and it has done me well except that the cones have blown out. Everything else looks fine from the outside and camera on the inside (no loose particles on the inside either). It passes a pressure check every year and has no bulges anywhere. I'm just watching mine year to year (minus the cones) to see how things develop. If I ever have to I'll send it back to Dawley.
xcrmckenna Posted September 20, 2018 Report Posted September 20, 2018 I took my stock one off a week and a half ago if you are interested? Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Joe Larussa Posted September 20, 2018 Author Report Posted September 20, 2018 1 hour ago, cliffy said: I had mine rebuilt by Dawley years ago and it has done me well except that the cones have blown out. Everything else looks fine from the outside and camera on the inside (no loose particles on the inside either). It passes a pressure check every year and has no bulges anywhere. I'm just watching mine year to year (minus the cones) to see how things develop. If I ever have to I'll send it back to Dawley. Don't those cones need to be there?
cliffy Posted September 20, 2018 Report Posted September 20, 2018 One would think that wouldn't they? :-)
Joe Larussa Posted September 20, 2018 Author Report Posted September 20, 2018 Just got a quote for a new muffler and one riser. 1308.00 in parts and 208.00 in labor. Holy crap!
AGL Aviation Posted September 21, 2018 Report Posted September 21, 2018 Dawley is great for overhaul. I would highly recommend them. If you would like new, call a shop and have them order from Aerospace Welding. If you'll send me a message, I'll be glad to give you pricing (our cost) for a regular, ribbed muffler (we just ordered 1 today). It's not much more than an overhauled unit. We're also a PowerFlow dealer, it is costly but it's a complete system. The flight school planes we've installed them on are lasting til TBO. However, the Mooney exhaust system seems to be inherently problematic - we do at least 1 Mooney annual a week and we're replacing approx +25% of the mufflers. They seem to have a service life (in Lynn's opinion) of about 500hrs. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro 1
ArtVandelay Posted September 21, 2018 Report Posted September 21, 2018 I wonder what is the powerflow expected lifetime ?
AGL Aviation Posted September 21, 2018 Report Posted September 21, 2018 Our only benchmark we have for that is a flight school 172 we maintain. The exhaust system has went past the TBO of the engine (2000hrs). It flies roughly 1000hrs a year. We have several new installs (mooneys included), but they're not that old nor fly that much. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
AGL Aviation Posted September 21, 2018 Report Posted September 21, 2018 Another thing, in the giant scheme of things consider this:In our experience, the stock muffler lasts about 500hrs. Parts and labor costs about $1000 to change it. So, in 2000hrs you've spent around $4000 in exhaust maintenance. The PF system costs relatively the same (it'll be a wash financially) BUT... for 2000hrs you get somewhere along the lines of 18more horsepower (more with the airfilter addition). Not trying to sell you though Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro 1
cliffy Posted September 21, 2018 Report Posted September 21, 2018 My only bench mark is my Mooney and I have IIRC (haven't looked in the log book yet) 1400 hrs on my Dawley overhauled one. No signs of failure yet except the aforementioned cones disappearing. I do fly ROP however :-) :-) (here we go again!)
Bob_Belville Posted September 21, 2018 Report Posted September 21, 2018 Mine is one of the Mooneys that Tamara (AGL) referred to. I went with a PFS shortly after buying the plane (M20E). 6 years and going strong. 1
Bartman Posted September 21, 2018 Report Posted September 21, 2018 I have enjoyed about 1200 hours since 2007 of trouble free service from my PF. Apply Antiseize to the slip joints at annual and I'm good. 2
jetdriven Posted September 22, 2018 Report Posted September 22, 2018 On 9/21/2018 at 3:38 AM, AGL Aviation said: Another thing, in the giant scheme of things consider this: In our experience, the stock muffler lasts about 500hrs. Parts and labor costs about $1000 to change it. So, in 2000hrs you've spent around $4000 in exhaust maintenance. The PF system costs relatively the same (it'll be a wash financially) BUT... for 2000hrs you get somewhere along the lines of 18more horsepower (more with the airfilter addition). Not trying to sell you though Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro There’s no way a Mooney muffler only last 500 hours. Mine is several years old and I put 600 hours on it and it still going OK. No flame cones though, nothing in there to obstruct the outlet of the exhaust and make you crash either .
Joe Larussa Posted September 22, 2018 Author Report Posted September 22, 2018 Pulled the trigger yesterday on the PF. It was about 2200.00 more than the stock exhaust. A hard pill to swallow either way, but at least when it’s done I’ll be excited to pick it up, as apposed to, crap that was expensive and it’s still the same. 2
amillet Posted September 22, 2018 Report Posted September 22, 2018 1 hour ago, Joe Larussa said: Pulled the trigger yesterday on the PF. It was about 2200.00 more than the stock exhaust. A hard pill to swallow either way, but at least when it’s done I’ll be excited to pick it up, as apposed to, crap that was expensive and it’s still the same. Let us know if you see any performance change
ArtVandelay Posted September 22, 2018 Report Posted September 22, 2018 Pulled the trigger yesterday on the PF. It was about 2200.00 more than the stock exhaust. A hard pill to swallow either way, but at least when it’s done I’ll be excited to pick it up, as apposed to, crap that was expensive and it’s still the same. Did they have any in stock, what’s the wait time?
Yetti Posted September 22, 2018 Report Posted September 22, 2018 Mouse milk the slip joints every oil change 1
Joe Larussa Posted September 22, 2018 Author Report Posted September 22, 2018 3 hours ago, teejayevans said: Did they have any in stock, what’s the wait time? They had one they could ship on Wednesday.
jetdriven Posted September 22, 2018 Report Posted September 22, 2018 4 hours ago, amillet said: Let us know if you see any performance change O a J model, no. It’s louder though. So it feels faster. And the cabin heat is worse.
xcrmckenna Posted September 22, 2018 Report Posted September 22, 2018 O a J model, no. It’s louder though. So it feels faster. And the cabin heat is worse. That’s why I got the preheat. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
AGL Aviation Posted September 23, 2018 Report Posted September 23, 2018 There’s no way a Mooney muffler only last 500 hours. Mine is several years old and I put 600 hours on it and it still going OK. No flame cones though, nothing in there to obstruct the outlet of the exhaust and make you crash either . Well then I'd say you're very fortunate. There's no way? Please note the 'in our experience' that preluded the 500hr statement. About half the ones we've changed had burned out flame tubes with large sections missing and the other half was due to cracks. Also, the ones replaced were around 500hrs of use (not life of the plane). Once deterioration starts, it doesn't stop when the engine isn't in use. For what it's worth -in our experience- service life of small Piper muffler cans are less. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
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