Advice needed--GPS/PFD install

[par]

Gents,

I am now seriously considering the installation of a GPS and PFD in the 63C so that I can use it reliably for IMC. My budget will be around 20K and the GPS I would like to go with is the GTN-650. Based on my research, it looks like it will set me back right around 14K installed. What I would also like to do is to replace my POS attitude indicator and gyro with a digital capability. I'm not entirely familiar with what I should be looking at to keep my cost under control and I am looking for some guidance from the crowd.

[carusoam]

Since your budget is getting in the way...

Big G is probably going to be your less than preferred supplier...

Fortunately there are others than Big G.  That come in with more functionality and lower prices...

1) Avidyne makes some nice stuff.  Plenty of experience around here...

2) used Garmin 430Ws are still very capable in IMC at deepish discounted prices...

3) primary digital attitude indicators of the lower cost variety are still new to the market.  There are a few around here...

4) An Aspen is a great display with tremendous capability.

5) do a search on these devices around here.  Watch some mooney videos.  Work your budget.

6) iterate several times...

7) let us know what you find and how you feel.  

8) know that it takes a  lot of work to determine what is best for your situation.  Know surprises are coming. Use both eyes when reading quotes.  Ask a lot of questions.

9) don't cut the corners, running out of money before the job is done is like flying on fumes...

I'm not upgrading for a few reasons.  Cash reserve is one of them...

Best regards,

-a-

 

[Marauder]

3 hours ago, par said:

Gents,

I am now seriously considering the installation of a GPS and PFD in the 63C so that I can use it reliably for IMC. My budget will be around 20K and the GPS I would like to go with is the GTN-650. Based on my research, it looks like it will set me back right around 14K installed. What I would also like to do is to replace my POS attitude indicator and gyro with a digital capability. I'm not entirely familiar with what I should be looking at to keep my cost under control and I am looking for some guidance from the crowd.

I would shop around a bit. $14k seems high for a 650. Mine was no where near that price. Check for rebates also. 

[FoxMike]

I am having a 750 installed at this time.  I shopped around some and think a 650 should not cost more than 11K installed unless your airplane has an unusual problem that will make the install difficult.

[par]

Yes, I called a couple of places and both came back with the same price. If my Heading gyro and attitude indicator were not so shitty, I would leave them alone and just go with a GPS. Unfortunately, I will need a plane I can depend on come next year for my work commute and I don't want to find myself in a bad situation over a couple of dollars. 

 

I am also considering simply trading in the C for an E or F that may already have much of what I need/want to include an AP. This may end up being the best course of action because I don't want a $65k C that is only worth $45k.

[ArtVandelay]

I agree with your second option, sell the C. I don't think you need glass, but an HSI/WAAS GPS with an AP that has altitude hold is what you need, IMO.

[pinerunner]

I just spoke with my current favored shop for avionics. They told me to expect just under $20K for installation of both a GTN 650 and the Garmin transponder that would read its WAAS GPS signal from it. He can sell any of the other companies like the King 770 or Avidyne IDF 440 but has found the Garmin installation to be more trouble-free and straightforward. He confided to me that no one has purchased the King and the few Avidynes he has sold and installed had problems out of the box that required a replacement unit to be sent.

He's booked out a half year in advance and considers Garmin to be most trouble free installation. Even though I like much of what I read about the others I'm probably going with Garmin. Glowing testimonials for Avidyne might sway me. If King paid me to be the guinea pig I might give them a try. No one is making what I really want, a WAAS approach capable GPS with minimum footprint, like an updated WASS capable King 89b.  

Edited November 8, 2016 by pinerunner

[KLRDMD]

6 hours ago, pinerunner said:

Glowing testimonials for Avidyne might sway me. 

I believe everyone that has chosen to install an Avidyne on this site would give it a glowing recommendation, me included.

[pinerunner]

OK, for me this is the great debate. Just go Garmin or give Avidyne a good look and consider whether I might really prefer an IFD 440 in my M20E.

In favor of Garmin.   

1. Many people will just go for the Garmin and so resale will be easier if you have Garmin in your plane.
2. Garmin may be easier to install.

In favor of Avidyne

1. They're actually giving us an alternative.
2. The interface may be better designed. They have some knobs (I still like the idea of some knobs) and the interactive graphics might be a little better.

Anything I get will be an upgrade of course, but I only get to do this once. It will probably be a year before I take the plunge and commit. For now I have old fashioned VOR/DME capability so I can do an ILS approach. I'm going for my IFR rating and plan on doing the simplest possible IFR flight plans. I don't have an autopilot and won't get one so I'll have to be very careful not to get myself into situations where fatigue and workload get me into trouble. 

[gsxrpilot]

Hmmm... I wouldn't have a Mooney without an autopilot, and a good one. Of course, I use my Mooney to go far and I believe it's a lot safer to have an autopilot than not.

[M016576]

To all those that got their Avionics units well below retail, and what I would call "reasonable";I think we need to start a thread about actual shops, where they are, and costs you could expect to be quoted.  My experience has been similar to the OP's in the hunt to install an ADSB transponder... if we had a list of reasonable, friendly shops that would certainly help the "hunt around" approach that some of you suggest.

as for installing 20K of Avionics in a 40K airplane.... it would be worth a look at the used E/F and J's to see if you can find one near your budget that has the stuff you want already installed.  I sure wish I had done that with my first J..... would have saved me a bunch of money...

[gsxrpilot]

2 minutes ago, M016576 said:

as for installing 20K of Avionics in a 40K airplane.... it would be worth a look at the used E/F and J's to see if you can find one near your budget that has the stuff you want already installed.  I sure wish I had done that with my first J..... would have saved me a bunch of money...

Well said...  when I was shopping for my first Mooney, my months of research on every C and E available for sale or recently sold, along with talking to several avionics shops and countless hours studying other's experiences here on MooneySpace, told me that for every $1 I spent up front on the airplane with the stuff I wanted, I saved $4 in upgrade costs.

I think its safe to say we all love to spend money on upgrades for our airplanes, but now on my second Mooney, I've always looked for the most expensive items to be already installed. Get the most panel you can afford up front. But also know what things in the panel cost the most to add later. Put that information with the list of items you wouldn't want to fly without, and you'll arrive at your own personal Minimum Equipment List for use while shopping.

For me when shopping for the C/E it was Autopilot with Alt hold, WAAS, and HSI. The first thing I added was an engine monitor but it was only $2500 installed. I also added ADSB Out which is very reasonable if you already started with WAAS.

When shopping for the K/252 it was an autopilot with flight director with altitude pre-select, and GPS with WAAS. I also considered a hot prop and speed brakes to be minimum equipment.