Best Mooney for under 100k?

[jwilkins]

When I bought my last two planes I called Jimmy Garrison at All American, explained what I thought I was going to be doing for missions and  talked about my budget plans.

Jimmy was a wealth of good information and suggestions. I bought two of my three Mooneys from him and will go back to him when I need another.

He not only knows the market but gave me an honest evaluation of how realistic my goals and budget were.

The last time I was shopping he told me my plans were probably 'doable' but he didn't have anything that fit the profile. After a couple months while I was still looking he came up with an excellent fit for me, which I ended up buying.

 

Give him a call at 830.885.5723  He's not a sales person; he's a Mooney consultant

 

Jim

[benpilot]

Thanks I'm going to check out a few 231 and 252 this weekend. I like the Bravo and Ovation long body but they are 100k more than my budget and the less expensive ones will fit my mission.

[fluffysheap]

Grass ain't something to be afraid of...and most aviation insurance policies don't have restrictions for operations on grass, unless it's been custom built into the policy for past loss History

Go find a CFI and a Cessna to take onto grass and enjoy. Or even better, go get your tailwheel endorsement on a grass runway.

 

I don't really disagree, it's just not what typically happens.  I've flown with four flight schools, all part 61, and the rental agreement for all four specifically said no landings on unpaved surfaces.  When I've asked, I've been told the insurance doesn't permit it.  I didn't push it because I didn't plan to do any soft field landings anyway.  If you're looking specifically for training for unpaved surfaces you could probably find a school that allows it, but my point is that most students earning their PPL today, perhaps with the exception of those in Alaska, have had no useful training in soft field operations.

[benpilot]

 

Well I don't have a critical need to fly out of grass strips most of the time. 

[Hank]

I don't really disagree, it's just not what typically happens.  I've flown with four flight schools, all part 61, and the rental agreement for all four specifically said no landings on unpaved surfaces.  When I've asked, I've been told the insurance doesn't permit it.  I didn't push it because I didn't plan to do any soft field landings anyway.  If you're looking specifically for training for unpaved surfaces you could probably find a school that allows it, but my point is that most students earning their PPL today, perhaps with the exception of those in Alaska, have had no useful training in soft field operations.

 

I finished my PPL in 2007. On my pre-checkride flight with another CFI, I made my first grass strip landing [at an unfamiliar airport], simulated engine out. He pulled the throttle about 30 seconds after I removed the foggles from instrument practice. At the time, I had 45 hours in two Skyhawks. It could have been called a "stage check" at a fancy school where instructors wore uniforms and scheduling was more complicated than me writing the tail number, instructor's name and desired time on a piece of paper on the wall.

 

Now, I visit there occasionally in my Mooney, and I go to another longer grass strip at the beach, because it's 10 minutes away and the nearest paved field is an hours' drive. Never heard away from this board that "insurance doesn't cover landing on unpaved surfaces."

 

Once I get my Mooney down south, I'll be looking for more fun places to visit, paved and grass. No piperpainter-style back country for me, though, and I don't really want to land on the beach--salt water and sand aren't good for moving parts . . . . .

[Amelia]

I didn't set out to buy a turbocharged Mooney. In fact, I didn't set out to buy a slick high-performance retractable at all, but the pretty, sophisticated airplane with three splendid partners was what was available at my flatland airport when I decided to replace my just-sold Skyhawk. Turned out rentals were very limited, and these guys made me an offer I couldn't refuse. The 1980 231 has been a wonderful airplane, not only for crossing tall Western mountains, but for climbing through bumpy, humid, murky southeastern summer air to clear and cool on top. It is great for swiftly climbing over surprise icing conditions to sunshine above, and I really appreciate those 30 to 50 knot eastbound tailwinds at altitude. The fuel burn is generally 11 to 12 gph, and 165 TAS at 12,000. Landing it on a nice grass strip is the smoothest, most forgiving touchdown ever, but I pick my sod fields very carefully. Temperatures stay fairly cool the way I fly it, but you will want an engine monitor, I think. I am spoiled rotten by its stable handling and the nice autopilot. Fly one before you decide on a lesser beast!

[benpilot]

Thanks Amelia,

I may get a 201J if the right deal comes thru. Otherwise, with used aircraft prices dropping, I'll keep looking for a nice 231/252. I had a chance to sit in the newer faster Mooney Bravo and the interior was not any wider or bigger to me than a 201/231/252 and cruising at 150-180kts is plenty fast for me.

[IndyTim]

I may get a 201J if the right deal comes thru. Otherwise, with used aircraft prices dropping, I'll keep looking for a nice 231/252. I had a chance to sit in the newer faster Mooney Bravo and the interior was not any wider or bigger to me than a 201/231/252 and cruising at 150-180kts is plenty fast for me.

 

Ben - you seem to have a similar set of requirements to mine, when I was shopping last year.  I bought a 252/Encore conversion (Parker's plane) about 1 week before I got my PPL, last July.  I've put about 120 hours on the plane since then, with my frequent XCs and a bunch of IFR training.

 

I live on the other side of the Rockies from you, but have the same requirements: long, efficient XC carrying 2 pax, occasionally 3, and safely get over or into interesting places in Colorado, Wyoming, and NM.  

 

I really, really wanted a Bonanza, ideally one that was TC or turbonormalized.  At first.  I spent about 7 months looking for a Bonanza, but there were always issues, not the least of which were the useful load/CG problems.    During that time the insurer I was working with went out of business, and when I went back to get re-quoted, I found that I could not get insurance on a TC or T/N Bonanza with my limited number of hours.  They would do an A36 Bo, for about $7000/year, or an F33A for about $5000/year.  Surprisingly, my quote on my 252 was "only" $3200.  Why would they do a turbo Mooney at pretty good price, but not a turbo Bonanza at any price???  Go figure, but I assume the answer lies in the accident rates.  But how much of that is plane-related vs pilot related, I don't have the data.

 

For $100k there are a bunch of J's and 231's on the market.  At that price you will not get everything you want, so you'll need to prioritize your must-haves.  At that price you can get good paint, a good interior, some newer Garmin avionics, or a newer engine/prop.  But not all five.  Each of those factors can be addressed afterwards, if you feel compelled and have the budget.

 

I love having a turbo plane, but know that a remanufactured SB1 engine for a 252/Encore is $53,000 after the core return.  For a complete overhaul on an existing engine at Custom Airmotive, it's $38,000 and change including the turbo-related accessories.  I don't have prices for a 231, but I assume they are very similar.

 

If I were to get a 231, I would make sure it had the Merlyn wastegate and the intercooler.  And I would want records indicating that they had been installed early in the life of the engine.  That, or I would find one with an engine close to TBO and plan on putting my own engine in.  You never, never know how an engine has been flown so, in my book, whether the engine has 500 hours or 1500 hours SMOH or SFRM is irrelevant.  

 

You mention a budget of $100,000, but I wonder is that purchase price, or is that the figure you expect to have in the airplane after you've owned if for a year?  If I were buying a 231, I would budget at least $15k, probably more, for the various surprises that turn up, and for a nice J I'd try to have $5-8k on hand.

[IndyTim]

Thanks Amelia,

I may get a 201J if the right deal comes thru. Otherwise, with used aircraft prices dropping, I'll keep looking for a nice 231/252. I had a chance to sit in the newer faster Mooney Bravo and the interior was not any wider or bigger to me than a 201/231/252 and cruising at 150-180kts is plenty fast for me.

 

The 201s, 231s, 252s, and Encores all have the same airframe and will be the same on the interior in terms of space, although there are trim and panel differences across the years.

 

The Bravos and Ovations have a stretched airframe.  They are not any wider, but do have about 2" more legroom for rear seat pax and I believe 6" additional baggage space measured from front to back.

 

<corrected>

[KSMooniac]

The Eagle (M20S) is a long body, just like the Bravo and Ovation.

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[urbanti]

If possible you should try to get some flight time in well maintained examples of both brand M and brand B planes.

A nice example of either would probably make you very happy, but they have distinctly different personalities in flight and one might appeal to you more.

I was shopping for a 20J and ended up falling in love with and buying a F33A which has turned out to be a great airplane. The one thing I will say about Bonanzas is that they are very forgiving on approach and landing.

I still love Mooneys, lurk on this forum, and may still buy one someday.

good luck!

Tim