Cris

Many years ago I was a partner in several Mooney's. It always worked out but there was an extensive agreement. One issue that was not addressed and did occur was gear up landings and the resultant loss of value after repair. One partner had the misfortune to have two gear up landings within a year one of which was mechanical but avoidable and one as a result of a porpoised landing. The difference in the value of the aircraft even after repair caused the dissolution of the partnership. Something to consider if you are involved with others even with the best of intentions.

As an owner of a very low time Eagle my experience is that I would do it again. At time of purchase in Feb 2011 the aircraft had 330 hrs TT with an Mattituck overhaul at 47 Hrs due to a prop strike. Contientals have far fewer corrosion issues than Lycomings due in part to cam placement. The Aircraft had spent half its life in Fl but inspection showed no evidence of corrosion any where. My thinking was that cylinders might need to be replaced but that the bottom end should be fine. Since purchase I have had very few maintenance issues and it has been maintained by a Mooney expert. One cylinder was iran'd last year due to a burned exhaust valve. I suspect that since their was no engine analyzer the previous operator may have run the CHT's to high. I did immediately add the analyzer and typically run lean of peak. Also the avionics were all low time and have been flawless. The S-Tec 30 is simple and more than adequate although I do have an S-Tec55x that I am thinking about installing. This Eagle came with the 280hp STC and I upgraded it to the 310HP with Midwest at a cost of 5K. It has a much better useful load than an Ovation 1123 lbs. and performance better than an Ovation 3 since it is a bit lighter. I also added a second color which was relatively inexpensive and now it is hard to tell it is not an Ovation since it had most of the Ovation options like leather seats. metallic stripes dual alternators, vacuum pumps etc. Currently it has 630 hrs and is a pleasure to own. At some point it will be sold but I will not be anywhere close to TBO which will make it easy to sell and I will not have taken the hit on the new engine depreciation that is typical. I'm way to old to get my money out of a new engine. Was I lucky? I don't think so. Just be sure you get a good Pre-Buy and be prepared to walk away. Just my thoughts on a low time purchase from someone who did so. Others have voiced excellent view on the opposite high time approach. In the end buy the best aircraft that you can afford.

At present neither of these systems allows for VOR/ILS integration. Trio has indicated that they need to step up to another level of FAA acceptance in order to integrate with panel mounted systems. Presumably that is their intention but it is a risk to consider. Personally I would not consider an autopilot without both GPS and VOR integration. The Dynon D10A (autopilot function) which is being Certified by the EAA does have this capability but is still a ways away from sale. May be to soon to make a decision without solid specs.

In my Eagle the factory Moritz EGT runs as much as 100 degrees higher than my Insight G2. As others have said it is where the probe sits and perhaps the accuracy of the Moritz. If you run lean of peak you will be able to reduce EGT's much more operating the engine at 60 percent power. Of course that means you need an engine monitor.

No the servo's are the same and the system when designed was intended to be easily upgraded. The problem is that over time the mfg. has forgotten that part and the cost to upgrade is often as much or even more than a brand new 55x system. One of the issues with the experimental autopilots is that they only handle GPS and not ILS/VOR Nav systems. I have read that is one of the issues that TruTrac is addressing but it means that the Vizion will not be the experimental version and probably will be much more expensive.

I have an S-Tec 30 in my 310hp Eagle. It is perfectly adequate and simple to operate and maintain. However it does not do anything near to the 55X. To intercept it must be within 10 degrees of the final approach course and you can't put it in heading mode and have it intercept the final approach course. You can't add vertical speed capture etc. You already know it will not follow the GS. GPSS is included in the 55X and it is an option in the 30. When you look at the hardware cost it is not that much more expensive to add the 55x. I do not know if there is a substantial difference in installation costs although I suspect there is. The resale value will definitely be higher with the 55X. I am considering upgrading to the 55x not because of its capabilities but because of the fact that it is also the turn coordinator. This makes it difficult for a passenger to access and use it in the event of an emergency. The 55x is in the radio stack and easy to use for a passenger. Just something to consider as we age.

Hi I'm considering the same setup. May I ask the installation cost? Thanks

Just registered See you there!

Go onto the Dynon website to read about the capabilities of the D10A AI. The unit available for our Mooney's incorporates the same features as the experimental version. One of those features is the autopilot function. One would need to purchase the servos and the control module in addition to the D10A AI to enable its functionality. The cost appears to be a around an additional $2000. The EAA is working on getting the autopilot functionality approved for certified aircraft. The AI portion plus other features like AOA is already approved. It does not supply inputs to existing autopilots but rather will replace an existing autopilot at substantially reduced costs as opposed to upgrading an existing S-Tec 30 to a 55X. The functionality of the D10A autopilot function when approved may well be similar to the 55X. Hope that helps.

The only significant diffferance is the built in GPSS in the 55X. You could add the S-TEC ST901 GPSS and have the same ability. Chances of the DFC 90 seems to be slim to nil. More likely is the Dynon 10A AI approved for the Mooney and which has autopilot capability. That 10A AI is being further approved by the EAA to use the internal autopilot feature.

That is what I heard at this year's Mooney Homecoming in Oct. Supposedly the delay is also the reason in large part to the change in mgt.

One of the options with the D10A that you can get now is a magnetometer which gives you heading.

Yes but these are very inexpensive on the used market. If you have the BK HSI it could be sold or even better traded to someone like Alan Fox. I'd think the BK system would have more value than the Stec making a trade realistic. I have a couple of spares I've collected " just in case...." BTW the D10A includes an HSI since it is identical to the experimental version. Don't know if you are legally able to use it in a certified A/C. Their is also an external control module to make it easier to use. Might be worth a call to the company.

I too have an S-Tec 30 but with the S-Tec ST 180 HSI. It is all electric. That might be an alternative for you to consider which would allow you to remove your vacuum pump if you add the D10A

I saw a comment posted on Beechtalk about the same problem with a G4. Turns out it is a software bug and needs an update. It stayed in the background until 2017. Possibly the same problem. Contact Insight for info.

The D10A offers a number of features above the G5 like an AOA but one of the more compelling is that the EAA intends to add the Autopilot function of the D10A to the STC. This will allow for a sophisticated autopilot add on for less than $2000 of additional hardware since the autopilot is already part of the D10A. It is only missing servos etc. I had intended to upgrade my Stec 30 with an Stec 55x which I own but now I'm not so sure. Maybe by Sun and Fun an announcement will be forthcoming about the autopilot function.

Beechtalk often has folks selling the KI525A HSI's. One just sold for $500 while the entire compass system inc. the 525 advertised as like new from Charles Larabee sold for $1850. Alan Fox seems to get them on a regular basis also. And then there is always EBay. I purchased an Stec system including the ST 180 HSI to replace a perfectly good working version which is now on my shelf as a backup. The new to me used unit will fly till it dies knowing that I have a perfect original backup.

With so many folks converting their panels to Aspen there are quite a few excellent AI's/HSI's used units available at dirt cheap prices on the market. I have acquired a few spares "just in case". Like you I do not want to move to full glass and am quite happy with my round gauges. I will at some point add the Dynon AI unit because it includes an AOA and other backup instruments for not much more than a good AOA would cost. It also will eventually become a sophisticated autopilot according to the EAA. At present I have a Stec 30 which is more than adequate together with an STEC 55x sitting on the shelf ready for install. I'm now holding off until I see how the Dynon unit works out. First it need an STC from the EAA scheduled in the next few months.

One of the flight activities that I occasionally discuss and teach is "How do you rate yourself after each flight" if you subscribe to the concept that a pilot license is a license to learn then one must consider the metrics associated with a flight. Do you measure yourself? In other words if you take off and land safely does that constitute a perfect flight? Well I do subscribe to the theory that whatever works for you may in fact be best but it does not answer the question of metrics. Yes the flight was safe but was it the best that it could be. In my own case I work to minimize each and every error in the hope that the next flight will be the"perfect flight" and thereby the very safest it can be. I define that by counting the errors that occur during the flight. For instance did I miss an item on the check list prior to takeoff? Did I miss a call from ATC? Did I correctly interpret the weather prior to and during the flight? Did I use a GUMP check on each leg of the landing to avoid the dreaded gear up possibility. Did I give a full preflight brief to my passengers. With two pilots on board did we agree on who would be PIC? In full candor I have on occasion forgotten to to push the prop and/or mixture control but not the gear even with this three time GUMP concept especially on a straight in ILS approach. This means written check lists for all phases of flights need to be used. In conclusion I try to have zero mistakes but seem not to ever meet that goal. How many errors did you make on your last flight? Consider three or less as a goal and you might be interested to see how many you actually had on any given flight. Happy New Year! Fly Safe!

Ah I see your point. You are correct of course. I was thinking of a hold at a VOR whereby there is only one radial on which to hold.

The holding instruction which includes direction is supplemental to the radial and is used as a confirmation of the hold. It's a nice to have but don't overthink the issue. Simply fly the procedure. Same goes for attempting to think thru and set up a non published hold which rarely happens. Go to the hold point and use the DG/HSI. KISS formula.

And just yesterday was this latest announcement from the EAA. https://www.eaa.org/en/eaa/eaa-news-and-aviation-news/news/11-30-2016-new-autopilot-stc-project-follows-eaas-lead I like the last sentence which says The EAA is now working on BOTH the Trutrak AND the Dynon autopilot for certified aircraft.

The EAA is also working on an STC autopilot from Trutrak Vision similar to their efforts with the Dynon D10A EFIS which should be available for our Mooney near term. https://www.eaa.org/en/eaa/eaa-news-and-aviation-news/news/09-22-2016-eaa-announces-trutrak-stc-project. Ideally since the D10A already has a built in autopilot it would be nice if the EAA got that additional capability STC'd. One would only need to add a couple of servo's and maybe the optional button controller for a full featured autopilot including emergency level and 180 degree turn capability. All this for about $2000 in additional cost over the D10A.

Buy it cheap and put it into the experimental class. Change parts as you wish and become your own test pilot. Seriously though that might be a way to upgrade the landing gear and update the avionics at reasonable cost. Worth whatever experimentals are worth on the resale market.

Well there is always a pick up service if you need a ride. BTW the Navworx ADS600 B has an inexpensive option for ARINC 429 output which they show in a block diagram as interfaceing with the Avidyne glass panel so no unlock key required.