Starter Issues in my 84 201

[Speed Merchant]

I have been having an issue starting my bird. Some times you turn the key and all I hear is a clunk that sounds like it is coming from around the starter. I had the starter relay placed and it seemed to work fine for about a month or so. Then the issue returned. I had a mechanic look at it and he determined that one of the connections on the new relay was a little loose. He tightened it and the problem went away for another month. Then it returned. A mechanic suggested I replace the battery. I put an extra cranking amp Concord. The problem went away again for about a month. Tonight I shot a couple of approaches taxied over to the gas pump. Topped it of and turned the key and only got a clunk. All the mechanics who looked at it said SytTec starters never fail. I thinking maybe mine may be the first. I guess it could be the ignition switch or the starter. It only seems to happen when it is hot. Any suggestions are appreciated.

[Bolter]

I had a similar problem with a skytec in a 1983 201.  It WAS the starter.  Something internal that did not work right after heat soak.  Once cooled (about an hour), it worked great.  The problem was also random, but began happening more frequently at some point.  Maybe the starter had to stop at a bad spot and then heat soak for it to occur.  I think it was about 400 hours on the starter.  Beyond warranty, so Skytec was not interested in solving the problem.  So I just replaced it. 

Do not believe that SkyTec does not fail, or at least do not let that lead you to ignoring the possiblity it is bad..  

[LANCECASPER]

4 minutes ago, Speed Merchant said:

I have been having an issue starting my bird. Some times you turn the key and all I hear is a clunk that sounds like it is coming from around the starter. I had the starter relay placed and it seemed to work fine for about a month or so. Then the issue returned. I had a mechanic look at it and he determined that one of the connections on the new relay was a little loose. He tightened it and the problem went away for another month. Then it returned. A mechanic suggested I replace the battery. I put an extra cranking amp Concord. The problem went away again for about a month. Tonight I shot a couple of approaches taxied over to the gas pump. Topped it of and turned the key and only got a clunk. All the mechanics who looked at it said SytTec starters never fail. I thinking maybe mine may be the first. I guess it could be the ignition switch or the starter. It only seems to happen when it is hot. Any suggestions are appreciated.

Whoever told you that SkyTec starters never fail hasn't been around very long. They are disposable starters. If you insist on a SkyTec starter the only one I've seen last a long time on a Lycoming is the 149NLEC (Extended Crank). A much better starter would be the conventional heavier starter, like a MZ-4222

[201Mooniac]

Curt, given you've replaced the battery and the relay it is likely the starter.  If it was the switch you probably wouldn't hear the clunk.  You can check though to make sure that you aren't seeing a voltage drop from the battery to the starter.

[201Mooniac]

8 minutes ago, LANCECASPER said:

Whoever told you that SkyTec starters never fail hasn't been around very long. They are disposable starters. If you insist on a SkyTec starter the only one I've seen last a long time on a Lycoming is the 149NLEC (Extended Crank). A much better starter would be the conventional heavier starter, like a MZ-4222

While I don't disagree with you, I've had a different experience.  I went through 3 MZ-4222 starters in 3 years (1 new, 1 replaced under warranty and one a rebuild by a reasonably good local shop) and then went to a SkyTec 149NL which has worked well for 11 years now.  I do think I'm an outlier though as typically the SkyTec's haven't been robust enough.  When my SkyTec fails, I'm not sure what I'll do next.

Edit: I just checked my logbook and realized it was the MZ-6222, not the MZ-4222 that i had trouble with.  I don't know the difference between the two models but maybe that explains the difference in performance.

[Ragsf15e]

Get ready for a price shock too. New starters are $$.

[Speed Merchant]

My starter has 400 or so hours. Sounds like a new starter is in my future. Before I buy a replacement I would like to confirm that is the issue. Thanks for your post.

29 minutes ago, Bolter said:

I had a similar problem with a skytec in a 1983 201.  It WAS the starter.  Something internal that did not work right after heat soak.  Once cooled (about an hour), it worked great.  The problem was also random, but began happening more frequently at some point.  Maybe the starter had to stop at a bad spot and then heat soak for it to occur.  I think it was about 400 hours on the starter.  Beyond warranty, so Skytec was not interested in solving the problem.  So I just replaced it. 

Do not believe that SkyTec does not fail, or at least do not let that lead you to ignoring the possiblity it is bad..  

 

[Speed Merchant]

25 minutes ago, LANCECASPER said:

Whoever told you that SkyTec starters never fail hasn't been around very long. They are disposable starters. If you insist on a SkyTec starter the only one I've seen last a long time on a Lycoming is the 149NLEC (Extended Crank). A much better starter would be the conventional heavier starter, like a MZ-4222

Thanks I am going to have to stick with a SkyTec. My baffles have been modified to seal tightly around a SkyTec. Thank you for your post.

[Speed Merchant]

27 minutes ago, 201Mooniac said:

Curt, given you've replaced the battery and the relay it is likely the starter.  If it was the switch you probably wouldn't hear the clunk.  You can check though to make sure that you aren't seeing a voltage drop from the battery to the starter.

Thanks we will check the voltage and see what the drop is. Thanks!

[Speed Merchant]

23 minutes ago, 201Mooniac said:

While I don't disagree with you, I've had a different experience.  I went through 3 MZ-4222 starters in 3 years (1 new, 1 replaced under warranty and one a rebuild by a reasonably good local shop) and then went to a SkyTec 149NL which has worked well for 11 years now.  I do think I'm an outlier though as typically the SkyTec's haven't been robust enough.  When my SkyTec fails, I'm not sure what I'll do next.

Edit: I just checked my logbook and realized it was the MZ-6222, not the MZ-4222 that i had trouble with.  I don't know the difference between the two models but maybe that explains the difference in performance.

Thank you for the post. I appreciate it!

[Bolter]

1 hour ago, Speed Merchant said:

My starter has 400 or so hours. Sounds like a new starter is in my future. Before I buy a replacement I would like to confirm that is the issue. Thanks for your post.

 

Eerily similar timing.  Note that because it was almost impossible to replicate the random occurrence, the most I could accomplish was getting the cowling off, and leads on the starter and verifying it was getting voltage.   I flew around with the tools waiting for the reocurrence to happen.  It "helped" that it started happening more often.

[donkaye]

2 hours ago, Ragsf15e said:

Get ready for a price shock too. New starters are $$.

Ho about an ignition switch for $701?

[Speed Merchant]

Well we figured out what was going on with my starter. It turns out that the rear 1/3 or so of the starter has a bolt that holds the back to the front of the starter. It turns out that that bolt was never tightened even though the bolt keeper tabs were completely belt like they should be. There was about an 1/8 gap between the two halves. How that got through their quality control is hard to understand. I replaced the starter contractor, battery's and had three different mechanic look for issues. I spent much more than the cost of a new starter. At least now I know. The new starter arrives Tuesday. Hopefully this will all get done before my planned plan to OSH on the 22nd. Live and learn. Thank you to everyone who sent posts- I appreciate your help.

[Ragsf15e]

44 minutes ago, Speed Merchant said:

Well we figured out what was going on with my starter. It turns out that the rear 1/3 or so of the starter has a bolt that holds the back to the front of the starter. It turns out that that bolt was never tightened even though the bolt keeper tabs were completely belt like they should be. There was about an 1/8 gap between the two halves. How that got through their quality control is hard to understand. I replaced the starter contractor, battery's and had three different mechanic look for issues. I spent much more than the cost of a new starter. At least now I know. The new starter arrives Tuesday. Hopefully this will all get done before my planned plan to OSH on the 22nd. Live and learn. Thank you to everyone who sent posts- I appreciate your help.

Crazy, but I had mine come loose like that too.  My eagle eye IA caught it at my annual and showed me the two halves moving separately.  He had to remove the lower cowl to get at the bolts, but tightened it up before I started having problems.  I have heard a couple other people who had similar issues.

[N201MKTurbo]

49 minutes ago, Speed Merchant said:

Well we figured out what was going on with my starter. It turns out that the rear 1/3 or so of the starter has a bolt that holds the back to the front of the starter. It turns out that that bolt was never tightened even though the bolt keeper tabs were completely belt like they should be. There was about an 1/8 gap between the two halves. How that got through their quality control is hard to understand. I replaced the starter contractor, battery's and had three different mechanic look for issues. I spent much more than the cost of a new starter. At least now I know. The new starter arrives Tuesday. Hopefully this will all get done before my planned plan to OSH on the 22nd. Live and learn. Thank you to everyone who sent posts- I appreciate your help.

Mine did that a few years ago, I tightened everything back up and it has been fine ever since.