1966 M20C project for sale $14,500

[Alan Fox]

45 minutes ago, nels said:

Dan, maybe you could work a trade deal with Alan on his 63 model. He is a pretty straight shooter from what I can tell. As long as it would work for both of you that is. I'm probably talking out of turn but maybe not.

I have already turned down the 66 , It has too much engine time for me ...The 63 , is already spoken for...

[tony]

I agree with Paul.  Throw a ferry tank in and get it out of there.  Bring it to someone who actually knows what they are doing and wants to help you.  If this was ten years ago, I'd be all over this.  

Dan I hate to be harsh but you really need to budget at least 5K-10K  of maintenance costs every year if your'e not going to do some of the work yourself.  Some years more, some less.   No matter how much you researched this plane you need to remember its still 50 years old.  Things break all the time.  Rubber things rot, bearing surfaces rust, paint flakes off, plastic parts get brittle.  Things just break.  That's why its called a "mooney pit".  A hanger is almost a necessity and if the airplane sits outside things happen faster.  

You had to know when you bought this airplane that an engine change  is imminent.  You might get another two perhaps three years but that's why you got the airplane for the price you did.  That will cost you another 30K.  If you had a partner or two to share the costs, I think you'd be making different choices.    

I'm sorry your decision is to sell,  but you have to do whats right for you.  The next airplane you own will have different but similar issues.    

Edited February 14, 2017 by tony

[flyhigh603]

Tony 

I did budget $5-10,000 for first annual but the tanks are $10,200 installed from Griggs and at least $11,500-12,000 for my mech to do it.Not including cost to get the plane to wherever for what $$$$ its gonna cost which puts flying it to have tanks stripped and sealed. Closest place is a 5 hr flight. Im already $3,000 onto mid annual. Believe me i don't want to sell her but i don't have an extra $12,000 kicking around. I knew the engine was a factor and was gonna overhaul in 3-4 yrs but wasn't expecting the tank deal now. I owned 2 other planes and didn't have to put a dime into either one except for annual cost. So this is a total blindside. I did a lot more research than you could imagine ...really. 

[ArtVandelay]

The older the plane, the more hands on you have to be, otherwise they are just too expensive, somebody who wants to do the dirty job of stripping the tanks can save themselves big $$$, but then there is the engine...overhauls are not for amateurs. Assuming very basic panel, no GPS or engine monitor...
14+26 o/h + 15 (gps, em, ADSB), so 55 total for a nice C, which in the ballpark for Cs. If you don't do some of work yourself, that's more like 70, you're in F, low J range.

[Alan Fox]

8 hours ago, teejayevans said:

The older the plane, the more hands on you have to be, otherwise they are just too expensive, somebody who wants to do the dirty job of stripping the tanks can save themselves big $$$, but then there is the engine...overhauls are not for amateurs. Assuming very basic panel, no GPS or engine monitor...
14+26 o/h + 15 (gps, em, ADSB), so 55 total for a nice C, which in the ballpark for Cs. If you don't do some of work yourself, that's more like 70, you're in F, low J range.

55K for a C?????? Really ???? Maybe in 2001 , but not these days...

[ArtVandelay]

55K for a C?????? Really ???? Maybe in 2001 , but not these days...

There is 2 on controller in the 50s, you salvage planes, what is a 430 WAAS, ADSB box, engine monitor, and a 0 time O-360 worth as parts alone? This is what I listed as options you would need to install to make it desirable and the 55 is what you would have invested. Of course the controller prices are just asking prices and may not be grounded in reality.

[Guest]

Sadly this one will likely turn into a donor for the rest of the fleet.

Clarence

[Alan Fox]

19 minutes ago, M20Doc said:

Sadly this one will likely turn into a donor for the rest of the fleet.

Clarence

 

1 hour ago, teejayevans said:

There is 2 on controller in the 50s, you salvage planes, what is a 430 WAAS, ADSB box, engine monitor, and a 0 time O-360 worth as parts alone? This is what I listed as options you would need to install to make it desirable and the 55 is what you would have invested. Of course the controller prices are just asking prices and may not be grounded in reality.

I buy , SELL , and Broker flying aircraft ,  advertising aircraft is not selling aircraft..... I watched a gorgeous C modded out to a J sold by an MSC for 40K , there really is not a market for C Mooneys north of 40 K ....  The jump from 40 K to J is too small....

[nels]

1 hour ago, Alan Fox said:

 

I buy , SELL , and Broker flying aircraft ,  advertising aircraft is not selling aircraft..... I watched a gorgeous C modded out to a J sold by an MSC for 40K , there really is not a market for C Mooneys north of 40 K ....  The jump from 40 K to J is too small....

I have to agree.

[tony]

13 hours ago, flyhigh603 said:

Tony 

I did budget $5-10,000 for first annual but the tanks are $10,200 installed from Griggs and at least $11,500-12,000 for my mech to do it.Not including cost to get the plane to wherever for what $$$$ its gonna cost which puts flying it to have tanks stripped and sealed. Closest place is a 5 hr flight. Im already $3,000 onto mid annual. Believe me i don't want to sell her but i don't have an extra $12,000 kicking around. I knew the engine was a factor and was gonna overhaul in 3-4 yrs but wasn't expecting the tank deal now. I owned 2 other planes and didn't have to put a dime into either one except for annual cost. So this is a total blindside. I did a lot more research than you could imagine ...really. 

Brad, all I can say is I'm sorry.  I wish you could find a partner to share the expenses and labor with you. From the pictures you posted, there looks like a lot of potential there.  After the tank seal, the engine, you'll still need to deal with the 2020 mandates.  

[gsxrpilot]

I think the right C can go for $50K, but not more than that. The C's on Controller are not even worth $40K much less $50+

[rpcc]

Seems like selling it is best - perhaps a used engine would help complete the project and still be under market value.

Money is cheap now, how about calling the bank and getting another 30k to put into the plane - in 5 years done right you'll be happy with it.

 

[flyhigh603]

At this point i think i just wanna sell the bird and hit reset. First time in 15 yrs i have absolutely no draw to go flying which bothers me a bit cause i was actually seriously in love with Jane, which is what i named her ( plane Jane ). Gonna be really really hard to fly / rent anything but a Mooney. But anyway here is the spec sheet i have that i got on the brokers site just before i bought her......

                                Thanks again for all the great advice guys , I'm sorry if i seem a little difficult at some advice but this went from Love to complete disappointment. Just for shi$# and giggles guys, go on the NTSB website and you gotta do a little searching but research engine failures and times. O-360 Lycomings with 2600 hrs - 3900 had least amount of mech failures  which includes" catastrophic" which translates to in flight failures. Most mech failures .....0-700. Something to think about........ 

[N6758N]

3 hours ago, flyhigh603 said:

At this point i think i just wanna sell the bird and hit reset. First time in 15 yrs i have absolutely no draw to go flying which bothers me a bit cause i was actually seriously in love with Jane, which is what i named her ( plane Jane ). Gonna be really really hard to fly / rent anything but a Mooney. But anyway here is the spec sheet i have that i got on the brokers site just before i bought her......

                                Thanks again for all the great advice guys , I'm sorry if i seem a little difficult at some advice but this went from Love to complete disappointment. Just for shi$# and giggles guys, go on the NTSB website and you gotta do a little searching but research engine failures and times. O-360 Lycomings with 2600 hrs - 3900 had least amount of mech failures  which includes" catastrophic" which translates to in flight failures. Most mech failures .....0-700. Something to think about........ 

Assuming you paid at least 30k for the plane (since that is what you're asking) you would be better off spending the 7-8k resealing the tanks and flying it for another 1-200hrs. No one is going to pay more than 20k for a C with an original panel and an engine thats 600hrs past major and 50 years old. 

[Alan Fox]

6 hours ago, N6758N said:

Assuming you paid at least 30k for the plane (since that is what you're asking) you would be better off spending the 7-8k resealing the tanks and flying it for another 1-200hrs. No one is going to pay more than 20k for a C with an original panel and an engine thats 600hrs past major and 50 years old. 

I think this was the ad when he bought it , I think he is asking 16 , and he paid a little bit more for it...

[rpcc]

He's asking 14.5k for it in the title of the post.

 

 

[flyhigh603]

Yes I am asking $14,500 .The post is what i saw online from the brokers website 2 weeks before i bought her. The ad was 3-4 weeks old when posted originally from the brokers website.Which is why it says $29,900 on the ad

[Raptor05121]

Whoever bought this would be renaming themselves Alex #2, and might as well follow my thread to a Tee. I spent $5k for tanks and $5k for annual. But now its clean and safe I hope a A&P/IA see's this and buys it as a project. Wouldn't take but mostly labor!

[flyhigh603]

Thanks for the info BlueHighWay and the pics thats great

[Browncbr1]

This is the perfect plane for someone who is willing to put in a little sweat.   paint some polygone gel on and wipe off the polyseal the next day, then reseal the one tank...  .. fly home and do the rest.   If I were retired and had nothing else to do with enough hangar space, I would give it a new life.

[flyhigh603]

I think this is a great deal for an A&P who wants to get into a great flying plane. This bird runs awesome with no internal corrosion at all.....

[Godfather]

I agree about the A&P buyer.  The main issue imo is the 50 year old high time engine.  You need someone that wants to do a field overhaul on it to put some value back into the airframe. 

[tony]

Yes that is the problem.  I had a friend of mine who was ready to throw a ferry tank in it and bring it back to Georgia until he heard the time on the engine.  

[Mark Lenker]

Please call me tomorrow in regards to you plane.  817.938.8068

Mark

[DaV8or]

Everybody keeps assuming this plane needs a rebuilt engine. What's wrong with a good used engine? I'll bet there are engines out there in great shape that are hanging on condemned, corroded airframes. A used engine should cost a lot less than a rebuild, even a field overhaul, no?

Seriously, I think that's this plane's only hope. A used engine, DIY strip and reseal and then enjoy. Otherwise, part it out. It has reached the intersection of cost to repair vs. value that kills most machines of any type. We shouldn't kid ourselves. Any of us flying vintage planes are only one major failure away from having to make this same decision.