Another Air Asia plane missing

[RocketAviator]

I believe this is the 3rd Malaysia plane missing or shot down this year!

Prayers for all on board and their families.

Corrected thanks ED R Cruiser for the correction.

[EDNR-Cruiser]

It's the first Air Asia plane... - the other two were Malaysia Airlines... - which doesn't make things better though, just more precise.

This accident looks however weather induced mixed with bad luck and not like the two incidents with Malaysia Airlines where one plane simply disappeared and the other was shot down by "friendly fire" over the Ukraine...

[Piloto]

The onboard weather radar on these planes is pretty good on alerting the pilot of severe weather ahead and possible deviation alternatives. What ever happened appear sudden and catastrophic since there is no transponder data on the descent. But it has similarity with the Malaysian 370 were the transponder suddenly stop transmitting also. Until debris and voice/data recorder are found this could be another mystery like MH 370.

 

José

[DrBill]

If this plane is lost WITHOUT A TRACE then I think it is time to re-think UFO activity in the area !!

[Hector]

The Bermuda Triangle has shifted, probably due to global warming

[DaV8or]

...or there is a plot to steal airliners to be used as weapons later. 

[ryoder]

In that part of the world anything is possible.

[Mooneymite]

Not looking good as of news reports this morning....

[bonal]

So the reports are that they have recovered debris that is confirmed to be from the airliner. A tragedy that could have been avoided, seeing reports of the weather that was in place at the time of the accident IMHO that flight should have been cancelled or delayed. My question is this. Your sitting in a terminal waiting to board a flight and to pass the time your looking at weather sources same as you would as a PIC before making a flight of your own. You see weather like that weather that in no circumstances you would pilot youself, do you board or decide to give your seat up for another flight on a better day.

My thoughts are with the families of the lost.

[1964-M20E]

So the reports are that they have recovered debris that is confirmed to be from the airliner. A tragedy that could have been avoided, seeing reports of the weather that was in place at the time of the accident IMHO that flight should have been cancelled or delayed. My question is this. Your sitting in a terminal waiting to board a flight and to pass the time your looking at weather sources same as you would as a PIC before making a flight of your own. You see weather like that weather that in no circumstances you would pilot youself, do you board or decide to give your seat up for another flight on a better day.

My thoughts are with the families of the lost.

 

 

Interesting I have not really thought about this much.  Years ago I was in Madison WI heading home.  We had flown in on a twin turbo prop form Chicago and it had just begun to snow heavily as I arrived at the airport in Madison.  Over the previous 12 to 18 months they had similar planes go down or have issues in similar conditions.  I was not looking forward to the flight but I was relieved when a B-737 showed up at the gate to fly us out of there.

 

The big guys have better equipment to handle more than we can.  What would some of our professional pilots onboard say when they are flying as passengers on commercial flight?

[flyboy0681]

Floating wreckage located today, bodies and all. At least the families will get some kind of closure on this one.

[fantom]

Several bodies have been recovered also, according to some reports.

A 20,000 hour, former F-16 jock, Captain. Where was his type A mojo? It was reported that six other aircraft were 'in the area.' With WX and traffic avoidance equipment on board, he should have told ATC he was climbing to avoid a serious TB, not just passively fly right into it, IMO.

Too sad and seemingly didn't have to happen. Flying is serious business and being the Captain is a major responsibility.

[Piloto]

Agree with you Fantom. The PIC is the final authority. It was imminent the approaching weather. Under such conditions is the PIC prerogative to take action without ATC approval. I has been in such situation and never had a problem with ATC, but that they like to be kept informed of your actions. Here in Florida you may have to take wild deviations to avoid towering CBs. And CBs grow by the minute.

 

José

[wishboneash]

The actual debris location was 60 miles south east of last known radar location from what I read. Maybe he tried to turn back? I guess the black boxes for both flight and voice data will reveal all soon.

[Bluevalley]

A big part of the decision as a passenger on whether to board or not, would depend on what type of aircraft it is. There is a reason some say " If it ain't Boeing I ain't going".

[ryoder]

Agree with you Fantom. The PIC is the final authority. It was imminent the approaching weather. Under such conditions is the PIC prerogative to take action without ATC approval. I has been in such situation and never had a problem with ATC, but that they like to be kept informed of your actions. Here in Florida you may have to take wild deviations to avoid towering CBs. And CBs grow by the minute.

 

José

Funny you mentioned that because yesterday I diverted from my pleasure cruise to clearer skies because the cumulus base at around five thousand started developing some towers right before my eyes. I flew along the coast on the way back home with flight following and then had to descend way under a 2300 door base to fly back to ZPH in bumpy conditions. It sucked and was a bit unnerving. And that was with no rain and no thunderstorms. I won't fly if I see VCTS on the metars of any local airports.

[flyboy0681]

Funny you mentioned that because yesterday I diverted from my pleasure cruise to clearer skies because the cumulus base at around five thousand started developing some towers right before my eyes. I flew along the coast on the way back home with flight following and then had to descend way under a 2300 door base to fly back to ZPH in bumpy conditions. It sucked and was a bit unnerving. And that was with no rain and no thunderstorms. I won't fly if I see VCTS on the metars of any local airports.

 

Quit bragging about encountering CB at the end of December.

[aviatoreb]

Several bodies have been recovered also, according to some reports.

A 20,000 hour, former F-16 jock, Captain. Where was his type A mojo? It was reported that six other aircraft were 'in the area.' With WX and traffic avoidance equipment on board, he should have told ATC he was climbing to avoid a serious TB, not just passively fly right into it, IMO.

Too sad and seemingly didn't have to happen. Flying is serious business and being the Captain is a major responsibility.

 

I missed where the plane flew into the CB?  I did read there was weather in area.  Where can I read that outcome?

[Jim Peace]

 he should have told ATC he was climbing to avoid a serious TB, not just passively fly right into it, IMO.

Trying to out climb a TS or turbulence is almost always the wrong thing to do........they reported some in the area to tops of FL530...

[bonal]

I was watching the recorded radar returns for the area on the news and the entire region was lit up with yellow the red even some purple and black at the time the flight was in the area they were reporting tops above 50,000 ft. I can't imagine why someone would challenge weather like that for any reason and if I was seeing it on my pad whilst waiting for my flight that was going to head straight into the lions den I would wait for another flight. In my opinion this accident should not could have been avoided.

[Piloto]

Bonal

 

I understand your concerns about the weather but this was not a rooky pilot but a 20,000hr pilot with plenty of hours flying experience in this region.

 

The onboard radar on the A320 is Doppler capable showing areas of turbulence and windshear in much greater detail and faster update rate than any ground radar site.

 

The airframe structure of certified planes is designed to withstand at least 50% more than what they are rated for. The wing will stall before breaking. Hurricane hunters fly into hurricanes every year and they don't break.

 

The fact the transponder suddenly stop transmitting at 32,000ft and did not show a descent would indicate a sudden event.

 

This one puzzles me

 

José

[Alan Fox]

The sea where this went down , is relatively shallow , 200 feet if I read it correctly , this FDR will be recovered , at least the families know the outcome , and don't have to speculate or have false hope....

[aviatoreb]

Bonal

 

I understand your concerns about the weather but this was not a rooky pilot but a 20,000hr pilot with plenty of hours flying experience in this region.

 

The onboard radar on the A320 is Doppler capable showing areas of turbulence and windshear in much greater detail and faster update rate than any ground radar site.

 

The airframe structure of certified planes is designed to withstand at least 50% more than what they are rated for. The wing will stall before breaking. Hurricane hunters fly into hurricanes every year and they don't break.

 

The fact the transponder suddenly stop transmitting at 32,000ft and did not show a descent would indicate a sudden event.

 

This one puzzles me

 

José

 

Yeah - wouldn't the transponder continue to transpond  as it was falling to the sea, even if the airplane broke to pieces in a thunderstorm?

[bonal]

Bonal

 

I understand your concerns about the weather but this was not a rooky pilot but a 20,000hr pilot with plenty of hours flying experience in this region.

 

The onboard radar on the A320 is Doppler capable showing areas of turbulence and windshear in much greater detail and faster update rate than any ground radar site.

 

The airframe structure of certified planes is designed to withstand at least 50% more than what they are rated for. The wing will stall before breaking. Hurricane hunters fly into hurricanes every year and they don't break.

 

The fact the transponder suddenly stop transmitting at 32,000ft and did not show a descent would indicate a sudden event.

 

This one puzzles me

 

José

Point taken but extreme weather don't give a damn how much time a pilot has or how well equipped and aircraft is. The results are in the sea how many accidents due to weather have there been since we took to the sky. And I should think a 20k hour pilot would know better and if he was attempting to get clearance for a higher altitude and ATC was not granting it well he knew it was too extreme and perhaps was attempting to avoid the bad cells but again with all the sophistication available to him well I stick to my opinion this incident should have been avoided.

[carusoam]

We need some verification of the hours that the pilots had.

One place printed numbers that were much lower than the 20k stated here?

Best regards,

-a-