A64Pilot

I’m late to this conversation, but years ago the Marshallers were kids and they do as they are told. There was parking in GAC much closer but they wouldn’t let me through in my Maule on 29” tires, which of course it could do easily, but we went with the flow and just got used to the walk. ‘If you look in this Pic, you’ll see a Mooney just behind me, I’m not sure which model you guys would likely know, but the Mooney guys showed up, looked at it and flew it I assume to Kerville for a new prop as it had a prop strike. I assume it was a new aircraft, didn’t talk to the owner. Maybe they are here? ‘But of course your the PIC and responsible for you aircraft, you did right. In crew coordination training we called it the most conservative response, sure you probably could have made it, but the costs of not making it grossly outweigh the benefits of making it. to date the pic, my Son in the pic is 27 now

Have you done a hot air ballon ride? My daughter and I did when I was stationed in Germany,I knew there would be no wind because your drifting with it, but I wasn’t prepared for the silence, you hear everything, people talking, birds chirping etc. Except when the burner lights, that thing isn’t quiet. ‘Set up, tear down etc was a real pain though so I wouldn’t own one. ‘He told me a story of ballooning in Tx, near Austin, he floated over this large house with the long gated driveway etc, there was a guy by the pool drinking coffee, so he said good morning, the guy spilled coffee all over himself, hearing this voice from the sky directly overhead.

I wondered if that was the case, then just wondered how well they do crosswind

That’s what I was expecting to hear, sometimes when steel pieces circulate through the engine, they imbed themselves in the softer bearings, and I’m really surprised to hear that a tappet can be eaten up badly and leave the cam unharmed. I guess the filter caught it all? Good to hear it worked out, Christmas came early this year.

I’m a J model and like to get the gear down early before things get busy, and I prefer to be in the white arc whenever I drop gear as I believe it’s less stressful on the mechanisms, so that’s why I’m at 100 kts or so entering downwind. ‘Like others have said descending 100 ft or so below altitude and then a little climb at low power really bleeds the speed off

Looking at that takes me back. We ran a training mission on night in Tx, went to the FAARP, no truck, so of course we shut down and waited, the Col got on the phone and was giving the LT Hell about where is the truck. Well a couple of hours later the truck show up and starts refueling the aircraft. when he was done we all got in and began starting up to leave, well the Blackhawk had its APU”s shut down in a couple of minutes, all the Apache guys laughed at him and we left. ‘Turned out the truck had been in the motor pool for some work and I guess the procedure is to empty the truck and “purge” it with some kind of purging fluid, and they didn’t get all the fluid out in the rush get the truck back into service, the Blackhawk was fueled first and got a shot of the fluid, all the Aqua glow testing and recirculating fuel etc was skipped because the Col was giving them Hell. So I wonder if anything was growing or was it some kind of contaminant? Ref “bugs” growing in Jet-A and requiring liquid water to grow, first it’s bacteria and not algae etc like you may hear and while it certainly love’s a water / fuel interface it will grow in fuel without liquid water, just not as well. Fuel has water dissolved in it, even gasoline, especially if the gasoline has any alcohol in it, but I was unaware of anything that could grow in gasoline. ‘If any if you are curious, look up APPL jelly, sometimes it’s not just as simple as removing the water.

The valve should be a high pressure valve, that is they usually isolate the tank from everything else, and a leaking tank is very unusual but possible I guess where the valve threads into the tank. Sometimes the tank pressure gauge is before the valve so tank pressure is always displayed, even with the system off. ‘ A leak is easy to find, it’s accessing the system if it’s a built in that may be difficult. ‘Soapy water is likely safe and OK, but I would advise to use the special leak detection fluid for O2 systems, yes it’s just soapy water, but it’s safe soap. My luck if I didn’t I’d find some kind of soap that had oil in it. But usually it’s the tank with a valve connected directly to it, and the regulator connected to that valve, after the reg of course it’s low pressure. If it leaks only when the system is on, then it’s most likely a low pressure leak or the regulator itself of course, maybe they left a fitting to the reg loose?

Most of my just out to fly for fun is done then in any airframe, smooth air is so much more pleasant. ‘I wonder how well they handle cross winds?

I’m not saying it will be smooth or to continue flight, just that it will probably run without tearing any mounts up. ‘A 6 running on five isn’t smooth either, has you pushing the nearest button on the GPS, even my C-85 will run on three, but not smoothly, I had a bad plug and on one mag it was only on three is how I know. ‘But engines are different, blow a jug off of a 985 and it will continue to run, blow a jug on a 1340 and it won’t, so saying a C-85 will run on three doesn’t meant that a Lycoming 360 will, but I believe it will. They will run with a stuck valve or broken rings, just not well. ‘Of course you handle it however you want, just in the C-210 with its IO-520, making it run slobbering rich meant high manifold pressure to maintain level flight, couple that with the lean cylinder running excessively high EGT. After thought it was better to just let the clogged one lean out and quit, but if you don’t like that, push the red knob back in and or turn on the boost pump. ‘On our Lycomings I don’t think turning on the boost richens up the mixture like high boost on an IO-520 anyway, so all you can do is go full rich, the big Continental with high boost, you can make it slobbering rich, like a car with the choke on, so I guess that the difference. I guess the takeaway is if a plugged injector puts a cylinder near peak EGT, be careful of high manifold pressures is all, and if you can’t avoid high manifold pressures and it looks like it may be headed for detonation, let it go so lean that it can’t detonate is a way to deal with a plugged injector.

You’ll get two certificates or three if it takes that. ‘I think if my knees would allow it I’d like to try the backpack motor ones, but the big trikes I don’t understand, but sure why not, I got a sea plane rating just for fun,it’s not likely I’ll ever use it, but it was fun. Report back, I’d like to hear if it’s fun or if it gets boring ‘No, I’ve never flown a PPC

Yeah, keep think your smarter than everybody else and your special. If your basing your numbers on outliers good luck with that, keep thinking averages don’t matter, all those other people are fools, your smarter than all the people on the Cessna twin site, what the Hell do 250 Cessna twin owners know, right? How is it that you guys can think that flying two engines with two props, two of everything only cost just a little more than one? Explain that logic, do engines and props have longer TBO’s or cost less, maybe your getting a break buying two at a time? Using your logic then us single engine guys are stupid, why fly a single when a twin is just a little bit more? Maybe that’s why you see so many twins flying right? I mean they out number the singles don’t they? So what’s stopping you? Go buy a twin, why are you flying that tiny little airplane? ‘Use your brain, if they were so economical, you would see a whole lot more of them, and there woud be a whole lot more in production, but there isn’t, why do you think that is? Why aren’t most new aircraft twins? So which twin do you fly?

Their average was closer to $360, average it out and see. ‘Then you pay $60 an hour for fuel? My last fuel delivery was $3.85 a gl, I burn about 8 gl an hour, often less but use 8. That times 3.85 is just under $31. ‘What do you pay for fuel and or what’s your fuel burn? So anyway based on what I saw in this forum it seems $120 is about what they say, which is almost exactly 1/3 what the Cessna guys say. ‘I don’t know what it cost to fly to be truthful. it costs what it costs. I’m an A&P, own my own hanger etc, etc, plus I don’t put costs down, besides it’s not what it costs me, or you. The point is what does it cost on average. ‘One data point is irrelevant. The Cessna site had I think 250 respondents that they averaged out, and many were A&P/IA’s too and that skews costs for those that aren’t.

You guys are wanting to cheery pick and skew results. Click on the link, read it. No one says anything about pressurized 421’s, it was C-310 specific https://twincessna.org/pdf/What Does it Cost to Own a 310 in 2020.pdf Compare what they say the costs are to the average J model Mooney, I say J as it’s the average, ordinary Mooney, ‘get the average cost of the Mooney off of this site, I’m sure it’s somewhere. Only two conclusions are logical, either the guys on the Cessna site are full of it and are wrong, or it cost three times as much to operate a C-310 than the average J model

Yeah, I read that on their site, as I said it’s amazing how many people will spend their time and money, to make others money, because you know someone is making money from that, how I’m not sure. ‘You do what you can I guess, I’m just astonished it’s legal, so far as I know you can’t do that with automobiles etc.

Yep you guys are right, the guys over there on twincessna.org are doing it all wrong, they don’t know what it cost to own and fly their aircraft.

First time it happened to me on the 210, I went full rich and boost on to try to keep temps on that cyl down. After the first time of doing all of that I didn’t richen up, boost etc, just let that cylinder lean out and die,of course it cooled way off then, and I wasn’t slobbering the others with fuel. Seems to be a better way of dealing with it. ‘Of course that was a 6 cyl, but I believe even a four will run OK smooth on three A handheld IR thermometer will find the bad cylinder instantly for those that may not have an engine monitor, even your hand usually will. ‘Monitors are nice to have, it’s maybe my next purchase, I’ll go with the UBG-16 because the owner is a friend.

I don’t have the tooling like I used to, and I got spoiled working in a aircraft factory where pieces parts and machinists / welders etc was free. ‘I’m also airplane poor at the moment so today I’m going to Lowe’s and buying some pipe and knocking something easy together and use the golf cart, just have to be real careful and I assume I’ll be OK. ‘Both my knees are shot, really years beyond needing replacing and I can’t do Sun-N-Fun because of it, been afraid of the surgery and waiting until the replacements get better and me to be old enough so a set ought to last the rest of my life, so pulling an airplane by hand is way harder on me than it used to be, yesterday I got the Mooney out so I could fly the 140 around and my knees hurt so bad I didn’t sleep well last night, so off to Lowe’s I go. Eventually I may buy Don Muncy’s tow bar once funds free up. I hope it’s Ok to say that, it’s several hundred dollars cheaper than most alternatives and his colors worked out well for me.

Ref C-310 costs per hour to fly, about $350 to $400 an hour? What's it cost to fly a Mooney? https://twincessna.org/pdf/What Does it Cost to Own a 310 in 2020.pdf Go argue with them, cause they clearly are frauds and don’t know what they are talking about. Then use this place as a reference for a J model,

Sure you guys go buy your old twins and fly them on less than it cost to fly a Mooney. See how long it takes that bubble to burst, if you have a six figure fund to cover the gotcha you’ll be fine, maybe. You did defer maintenance as by your own admission you only overhauled one engine in that time, and overflew a TBO, if overflying TBO isn’t deferring maintenance, then please tell me what your definition of deferring maintenance is? Yeah, I’m just an old fat guy in his Mama’s house, I’ve not been a professional pilot and mechanic since 1982, not like you real Pro’s. And no. I’m not posting my personal data just to become some kind of internet celebrity. Like I said, reach out to AOPA or believe that those sources are delusional if you want to, and you can if fact fly a much more expensive airplane for less money, it’s just all the suckers that don’t know that. Anyone can get lucky flipping houses or boats or airplanes, most it eventually catches up to them, some it doesn’t. Some smoke their whole lives and get away with it, you can’t determine trends from one case.

Surely there are good websites that compute cost of ownership? Maybe AOPA does?

Owning an airplane or car or boat for a year or two doesn’t reflect cost of ownership. You’ll of course argue that you didn’t defer maintenance, but you did. ‘Guy I bought my airplane from owned it for a couple of years and flew it a few hundred hours and stated it only cost him the Annuals. ‘So we can infer from that, that owning a M20J if flown 200 hours a year and an Annual cost $2,000 is only $10 an hour. ‘Try to explain that the engine cost alone is more than twice that, to say nothing of the prop etc and he’ll say it’s not true, I did it on only $10 an hour. Normally you’ll take the hit in depreciation on sale, but if your lucky or smart or whatever you ascribe to be, you may buy low and sell high and not take the hit. ‘For instance I met a couple that bought houses and fixed them up while living in them for a year or two and resold them, and always made money on the deal, this was before 2008 though. I wasn’t there but I’d bet lunch that came to a ugly end in 08 though

Looked up the ADSB exchange thing, there are a lot of nuts out there willing to spend their own money and time to make some people they will never meet money I guess. Brave New World I guess

So where do they get the data? Do they have their own receivers? Surely the registration data is FAA? Why do they exist? what’s the purpose? Who funds them?

A way to test if fuel contaminants are biological is to put bleach on it and see if it reacts, changes color. Jet fuel and Diesel trick because they can get asphaltanes and make some think they have “bugs” Does anything grow in Avgas? I don’t think anything does? ‘Fuel truck filter breaking down is the most logical to me, but I cannot explain it being on the wrong side of the screen. Anything that happens to a motor can’t get into the fuel

No one answers the phone anymore, the Dr. office no one, well I guess us old farts do but the rest of the world txts and sends emails. ‘Maybe it’s all of the Spam calls? I guess you need to go there and see them, your going to do that anyway, I’d fly there at least then they know your st least a pilot. The other thing about kids is they are unrealistic, worse than we were as kids, the kid that delivered propane to my house stated he was going to get his helicopter license. In other words it’s real likely 99 out of 100 calls are unrealistic dreamers, after awhile you just quit listening. Fly in in your airplane and you’ll probably get a different response.