SilentT Posted November 10 Report Posted November 10 I am in need of an aviation attorney to help me set up a proper dry lease for my corporate structure ownership of my plane. Can anybody recommend an attorney who knows the current regulatory requirements to help protect myself? If it matters it's likely to be owned in an Indiana LLC but stored in Illinois hangar.
Schllc Posted November 10 Report Posted November 10 Not sure you need an attorney for this, you would probably be better served by contacting an aviation tax consultant.
SilentT Posted November 11 Author Report Posted November 11 2 hours ago, Schllc said: Not sure you need an attorney for this, you would probably be better served by contacting an aviation tax consultant. I made a plan with the tax consultant today. But the legal side of the dry lease back to protect against the flight dept trap and other common screwuos is important enough for me to consult with someone who knows how to structure the lease documentation correctly. Tax wise we got a plan. Just need to make it legal
Scott Ashton Posted November 11 Report Posted November 11 Contact Paul Lange, pal@lopal.com; His firm specializes in aviation, transactions, enforcement, litigation, etc. www.lopal.com. I’ve been using him for decades for all of my aviation matters and transactions. Scott
LooneyMooney Posted November 11 Report Posted November 11 Strongly recommend Bart Peters at Business Aviation Law Group. We used him to help create an operating agreement for our co-owned M20F and had a great experience. If you’re an AOPA member, you can use your annual 2 hours of free consultation with him. https://www.businessaviationlawgroup.com
NickG Posted November 11 Report Posted November 11 28 minutes ago, LooneyMooney said: Strongly recommend Bart Peters at Business Aviation Law Group. We used him to help create an operating agreement for our co-owned M20F and had a great experience. If you’re an AOPA member, you can use your annual 2 hours of free consultation with him. https://www.businessaviationlawgroup.com I second that. Bart is a good friend and an excellent attorney.
midlifeflyer Posted November 11 Report Posted November 11 12 hours ago, Paul Thomas said: @midlifeflyer Thanks, Paul. Yes, that was part of my practice, but I’m retired now. I still keep up but that’s mostly for educational things like seminars/webinars and answering general questions. 2
midlifeflyer Posted November 11 Report Posted November 11 12 hours ago, Schllc said: Not sure you need an attorney for this, you would probably be better served by contacting an aviation tax consultant. Yeah he does. There are FAA traps is corporate aircraft use. If he’s talking dry leasing, sounds like @SilentT is planning to separate aircraft ownership from the company (“flight department company” issues) or, if owned by the business, use it for personal purposes as well. Depending on the details it might be a no-brainer or get funky, but legal advice is usually a good idea.
SilentT Posted Tuesday at 12:36 PM Author Report Posted Tuesday at 12:36 PM 1 hour ago, midlifeflyer said: Yeah he does. There are FAA traps is corporate aircraft use. If he’s talking dry leasing, sounds like @SilentT is planning to separate aircraft ownership from the company (“flight department company” issues) or, if owned by the business, use it for personal purposes as well. Depending on the details it might be a no-brainer or get funky, but legal advice is usually a good idea. Fundamentally yes. Corp ownership, personal lease. Multiple llcs at play here so if used for one of the business can invoice the business as necessary. Keeps record keeping lighter (as personal is a majority), while netting important tax benefits. I need someone who understands to avoid the traps and the big bad gubbermint.
NickG Posted Tuesday at 01:47 PM Report Posted Tuesday at 01:47 PM 1 hour ago, SilentT said: Fundamentally yes. Corp ownership, personal lease. Multiple llcs at play here so if used for one of the business can invoice the business as necessary. Keeps record keeping lighter (as personal is a majority), while netting important tax benefits. I need someone who understands to avoid the traps and the big bad gubbermint. @Pembroke Advisoron this forum is also a wealth of knowledge.
midlifeflyer Posted Tuesday at 01:54 PM Report Posted Tuesday at 01:54 PM 1 hour ago, SilentT said: Fundamentally yes. Corp ownership, personal lease. Multiple llcs at play here so if used for one of the business can invoice the business as necessary. Keeps record keeping lighter (as personal is a majority), while netting important tax benefits. I need someone who understands to avoid the traps and the big bad gubbermint. Unfortunately, I don't personally know any of the lawyers who practice in that area in your neck of the woods, so I can't make a recommendation.
Danb Posted Tuesday at 03:43 PM Report Posted Tuesday at 03:43 PM 14 hours ago, SilentT said: I made a plan with the tax consultant today. But the legal side of the dry lease back to protect against the flight dept trap and other common screwuos is important enough for me to consult with someone who knows how to structure the lease documentation correctly. Tax wise we got a plan. Just need to make it legal I doubt you need a tax consultant at this time which I am, your in need of an attorney to prepare the LLC in accordance with Indiana and Illinois. An error in preparation of your initial documents is essential to protect you, your members and property. Ideally they need to investigate your local airports rules and regulations, in addition to various tax rules of both states. DB
Paul Thomas Posted Tuesday at 07:26 PM Report Posted Tuesday at 07:26 PM 7 hours ago, midlifeflyer said: Thanks, Paul. Yes, that was part of my practice, but I’m retired now. I still keep up but that’s mostly for educational things like seminars/webinars and answering general questions. Congratulations on retirement.
Jackk Posted Tuesday at 09:49 PM Report Posted Tuesday at 09:49 PM Ison is the easy button when it comes to the FAA https://thepilotlawyer.com/about-us/our-team/anthony-g-ison/
MikeOH Posted Wednesday at 12:23 AM Report Posted Wednesday at 12:23 AM 3 hours ago, Jackk said: Ison is the easy button when it comes to the FAA https://thepilotlawyer.com/about-us/our-team/anthony-g-ison/ Hmm, from his website: "Anthony G. Ison is an aviation attorney born and raised in Lakeland, Florida, which consequently is home to the annual Sun ‘n Fun International Fly-in and Expo." I'm not sure which of the following is more troubling: 1) That his ego is so big that he believes that Sun 'n Fun is a consequence of his birth. 2) That an attorney doesn't know the difference between coincidences and consequences. 3) That he lacks the attention to detail to bother to notice this error (assuming it's not 1 or 2) Don't think I'll be hitting this 'easy button' YMMV 1 2
Jackk Posted Wednesday at 01:05 AM Report Posted Wednesday at 01:05 AM (edited) 44 minutes ago, MikeOH said: Hmm, from his website: "Anthony G. Ison is an aviation attorney born and raised in Lakeland, Florida, which consequently is home to the annual Sun ‘n Fun International Fly-in and Expo." I'm not sure which of the following is more troubling: 1) That his ego is so big that he believes that Sun 'n Fun is a consequence of his birth. 2) That an attorney doesn't know the difference between coincidences and consequences. 3) That he lacks the attention to detail to bother to notice this error (assuming it's not 1 or 2) Don't think I'll be hitting this 'easy button' YMMV Cool As someone who has used him before, your loss, and as he’s known in the industry I think he’ll survive not having your business Id read his reviews, but you do you Edited Wednesday at 01:07 AM by Jackk
midlifeflyer Posted Wednesday at 02:06 AM Report Posted Wednesday at 02:06 AM 6 hours ago, Paul Thomas said: Congratulations on retirement. Thanks, I guess. I’ve been slowly retiring for the past 13 years Now I’m probably 99.99% retired. 1
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