Wing fuel dial

[Pinecone]

22 hours ago, Cayman44 said:

The Amazon dial with tabs and % full, 5323S01792 is no longer available on Amazon, but found quite a few on eBay.  Bought one yesterday to test.  However am reaching out to many sources for originals - will let you know.  Cannot see the $100 mark up over eBay for what is virtually the same gauge.

That ones with 1/4. 1/2. etc are still available on Amazon

https://www.amazon.com/Rochester-Gauges-5323S01792-Size-Capsule/dp/B0BR2GPB27

 

[Pinecone]

16 hours ago, LANCECASPER said:

Rochester only sells to Mooney, not Mooney Service Centers. Mooney owns the drawing for that part and Rochester makes it to their specs.

Gone are the days when most shops carry inventory. 

36 people work at the factory, producing parts as needed and keeping the fleet supported in other ways. 

This subject has been discussed ad nauseum on here. You can spend all of your time and energy wishing things were different or you can get in line, place your order, and eventually get the part you need.

And the issue with ordering parts, even if they have enough pre-pair ordered was addressed at Mooney Max.  

Mooney, at that time, was afraid that they might not be open by the time the order comes in.  So no one to receive, unpack, inspect, label, pack and ship out.   This would leave everyone who paid, without funds or parts.

 

[Pinecone]

It seems to me, that the simplest solution is a generic gauge, with a sticker that has the proper gallons and lines around the gauge.   

Just need to get a good picture of each gauge.  And for Monroy owners, have some one for each tank setup do the work of filling their their tanks to certain increments and providing the data to make the label.

[Cayman44]

Well just saw this Aviation Consumer video on the RV-12iS..   The fuel dials we are discussing are on this RV and attached with the tabs in place with screws with what appears to be an RV added overlay on the top of the dial for older RV-12's. Wouldn't it be nice if we could find a common replacement with no screw tabs and a top alignment key?  I'm working on it.   https://www.aviationconsumer.com/flight-trial/light-sport-aircraft-step-downs-rv-12is-flight-trial/?MailingID=&oly_enc_id=6022G2662590E8Z

 

 

[PT20J]

Well @LANCECASPER says Mooney is keeping a back order list. @Pinecone says no. So, now I'm confused. 

[Marc_B]

6 minutes ago, PT20J said:

Well @LANCECASPER says Mooney is keeping a back order list. @Pinecone says no. So, now I'm confused. 

I think what Terry was talking about was that Mooney is apprehensive of having paid orders/deposits taken while awaiting a "lot number" to be filled.  But having MSCs put in orders for parts to reach a quota to turn out a lot "seems" to be happening.  But the higher the minimum order number is, the less likely to have enough MSCs requesting that part and hence to meet that min.

Previously it's been said that Mooney didn't want the liability of owners/shops prepaying for parts (i.e. no back springs) that might take an extended lead time to fill, as the uncertainty of long term plans/viability might be a concern.

With outside vendor parts (i.e. no back spring), Mooney may finally be open to allowing other shops, such as LASAR, to take the deposit and become the middle man between the customer and the vendor.  I suspect there are several parts that may fit this bill, including these fuel sight gauges from Rochester Sensors.

[LANCECASPER]

1 hour ago, PT20J said:

Well @LANCECASPER says Mooney is keeping a back order list. @Pinecone says no. So, now I'm confused. 

They mentioned specifically on the no-back springs, a very expensive part,  that they didn't want to hold that much of other people's money with the uncertainty that existing at that time. Personally I think at the time of MooneyMax they were already working out the deal with LASAR to take that on.

I have a picture, which Im not going to share on here, of the whiteboard in the Mooney office showing the parts, the backorders, the minimum order amount, etc. They are continuing to ship out parts 5 days a week, not all of which they are manufacturing. So they are ordering parts. 

[GeeBee]

Personally, I think the no-back spring business model has worked fine. (I got mine last week) The business model is in hand, it needs to be extended to other parts without delay.

[PT20J]

51 minutes ago, GeeBee said:

Personally, I think the no-back spring business model has worked fine. (I got mine last week) The business model is in hand, it needs to be extended to other parts without delay.

I agree. After Mooney gets it's licensing fee and LASAR gets it's markup, the prices will be high (and CBs will complain) but at least we should be able to get some parts and Mooney can focus its limited resources on manufacturing the parts that it makes.

[Yetti]

On 3/15/2025 at 2:13 PM, Cayman44 said:

That looks like the correct  % dial, for a lot less than separately purchased on ebay, but the assembly is wrong.   This is what the fuel float assembly looks like for the M20M.

If it's cheaper, then throw the sender part away.   It all about saving money.     May be time to bust out the vinyl printer.   The Put a blank white background down and then cut out the black vinyl gallon markings.     I just used some Plastx to shine mine up and they came out good.

[Pinecone]

On 3/16/2025 at 5:53 PM, PT20J said:

Well @LANCECASPER says Mooney is keeping a back order list. @Pinecone says no. So, now I'm confused. 

I didn't say they did not have a back order list.  I repeated what Mr. Pollack said at Mooney Max about PRE-PAID orders.

[PT20J]

1 minute ago, Pinecone said:

I didn't say they did not have a back order list.  I repeated what Mr. Pollack said at Mooney Max about PRE-PAID orders.

That makes sense. The last thing Mooney needs right now is more unsecured creditors  I know of at least one MSC that offered to front the money for Mooney to order the no-back springs, but the offer was declined. The licensing deal makes sense for everyone (well, except perhaps for the cost).

[Pinecone]

Just now, PT20J said:

That makes sense. The last thing Mooney needs right now is more unsecured creditors  I know of at least one MSC that offered to front the money for Mooney to order the no-back springs, but the offer was declined. The licensing deal makes sense for everyone (well, except perhaps for the cost).

Very true.

Yeah, the basic idea works great.  But the markups need to be tweaked.  

[Fix]

Would it be possible to order a "custom" gauge directly from Rochester specified for what we are looking for?
Then we can do a group buy here at MS to get the quantity up.

I would order 2-4pcs depending on price just to have in stock.

[N201MKTurbo]

11 minutes ago, Fix said:

Would it be possible to order a "custom" gauge directly from Rochester specified for what we are looking for?
Then we can do a group buy here at MS to get the quantity up.

I would order 2-4pcs depending on price just to have in stock.

Of course it would. That is how they stay in business. As I stated once before, somebody needs to make a drawing, send it to Rochester with an RFQ. The RFQ should come from somebody with a business license. And if you don’t want to get the FAA on your case, you will need a PMA, or they will be unapproved parts. I learned the other day how serious the FAA is about unapproved parts. They consider people selling unapproved parts as criminals. They intend to send people sellling unapproved parts to jail.

As much as everybody cringes at the thought of getting a PMA. Getting one for these dials should be easy. 
 

When I was restoring my Cessna, I bought gaskets and push rod tubes from Real Gaskets. I spoke to the owner a couple of times. I checked out his company on Google street view. It is in a shabby little strip mall out in the sticks. The whole place is about as big as a 7-11. He has hundreds of PMAs. If he can do it, it can’t be that hard.

https://realgaskets.com

 

 

 

[IvanP]

On 3/16/2025 at 4:49 PM, GeeBee said:

Personally, I think the no-back spring business model has worked fine. (I got mine last week) The business model is in hand, it needs to be extended to other parts without delay.

How much was the spring?

[Cayman44]

1 hour ago, Fix said:

Would it be possible to order a "custom" gauge directly from Rochester specified for what we are looking for?
Then we can do a group buy here at MS to get the quantity up.

I would order 2-4pcs depending on price just to have in stock.

I am working on it.   My preference is the 5-1792 dial with no screw tabs, but with an alignment key at the top.

[Fix]

1 hour ago, N201MKTurbo said:

or they will be unapproved parts

So, we already attach unapproved parts and if we can attach a very similar as the original I personally don't care.
And who says it's for aviation, it could be for my lawn mover and the gauge happens to fit my Mooney.

Of course it would be even better if the part was 100% legal!

Edited Tuesday at 08:30 PM by Fix

[N201MKTurbo]

6 minutes ago, Fix said:

So, we already attach unapproved parts and if we can attach a very similar as the original I personally don't care.
And who says it's for aviation, it could be for my lawn mover and the gauge happens to fit my Mooney.

Of course it would be even better if the part was 100% legal!

The FAA has a website for reporting SUP. They take the reports seriously. If one person wanted to make trouble, they would go after the one selling the unapproved parts. That would be the person who ordered them from Rochester. 
 

https://www.faa.gov/aircraft/safety/programs/sups

Don’t shoot the messenger. I’m just telling you what the FAA told me at the IA refresher symposium two weeks ago.

[GeeBee]

1 hour ago, IvanP said:

How much was the spring?

2500

[IvanP]

57 minutes ago, GeeBee said:

2500

Ouch...If the same markup will be applied to the wing dials we could expect to fork over $5k or more for set of 2 dials.  

Edited Tuesday at 09:55 PM by IvanP

[GeeBee]

1 hour ago, IvanP said:

Ouch...If the same markup will be applied to the wing dials we could expect to fork over $5k or more for set of 2 dials.  

Well I paid 1300 4 years ago for a kit. So given inflation I would say it is in the ball park, a little high. However, I have one on the shelf ready to go. Which is very sweet.

I paid 125 for a fuel gauge. So I suspect using the same business model....250

[ArtVandelay]

IIRC, I think I paid $800 for back spring 10 years ago.

[PT20J]

3 hours ago, GeeBee said:

Well I paid 1300 4 years ago for a kit. So given inflation I would say it is in the ball park, a little high. However, I have one on the shelf ready to go. Which is very sweet.

I paid 125 for a fuel gauge. So I suspect using the same business model....250

Here's the interesting question: what will you do with it? You can't wait until the installed one breaks because then it is too late as they seem to jam the gear when they break. You could replace it at 1000 hrs as recommended. But then there is the maintenance-induced failure risk, and how do you really know that the new spring is better than the perfectly functioning one you replaced? There is the fact that according to Don Maxwell they do wear and begin to chatter, so I guess if that happens you have a spare. But he also told me that he was told that the gear actuator is rated for 20,000 operations. So, they should last a really long time. Maybe it's like insurance and the primary value is a good night's sleep .

[GeeBee]

20 hours ago, PT20J said:

Here's the interesting question: what will you do with it? You can't wait until the installed one breaks because then it is too late as they seem to jam the gear when they break. You could replace it at 1000 hrs as recommended. But then there is the maintenance-induced failure risk, and how do you really know that the new spring is better than the perfectly functioning one you replaced? There is the fact that according to Don Maxwell they do wear and begin to chatter, so I guess if that happens you have a spare. But he also told me that he was told that the gear actuator is rated for 20,000 operations. So, they should last a really long time. Maybe it's like insurance and the primary value is a good night's sleep .

My plan and hope is I never need it. I plan to sell this airplane about 3 years from now and I will likely use it as a sales incentive along with numerous other unobtainable parts. I have sealed these parts in vacuum bags with desiccant in them. My view is given the current state of affairs for Mooney, the more you can assuage a potential buyer, the better.