Anybody have a gear alert system installed?

[DaV8or]

I have been looking to buy an older Mooney and have found that the majority of them for sale have a gear up in it's history. It seems really common and has sold a lot of one peice belly and three blade prop mods! I know the traditional pilot community response is "USE YOUR CHECKLIST" and "DO YOUR GUMPS CHECK", but realisticly, clearly everyone knows these things and yet gear ups still happen. The gear alert systems with voice alerts seem like a really good idea too me. Kind of like having a CFI next to you to slap you when you forget. Anybody here have one of these devices installed? Opinions? Do insurance companies give you credit for them?

Here's a link to what I'm talking about fro those that might not have seen them before.

http://www.magnalabs.com/audiofacts1.htm

[Jeev]

I have one, it was installed by a previous owner or the factory.. It works off MP and will give off a loud BEEP when MP is below 15 and gear is up.... It has been more of an annoyance during slow flight and slowing down in the traffic pattern but i figure one day it may save me

[GeorgePerry]

Gear up accident statistics for Mooney A/C are on par with other SE retracts.  Mooney's pilots are no more or less likely to "forget" the gear than pilots flying other types of planes.  I would be careful with statments such as "the majority of older Mooneys have had a gear up landing."  I don't think this is true...Sure some do and older planes with more TO/L cycles have an increased probability of pilot or mechanical faillure leading to a GU landing.

Apart from that, the biggest "issue" with early mooney gear warning systems is that the gear warning tone is the same as the stall warning indicator.  If a pilot keeps the MP above the level required to initiate the horn, he may or may not ever get a gear up warning until the throttle is completely retarded just prior to touchdown, and at that point might confuse the tone for a stall warning.

The best way to avoid G/U landings are for pilots to use good procedures (ie verify 3 down and locked) prior to landing.  Most pilots don't leave their house without getting dressed first, so remembering to put the gear down prior to landing should be just as routine and fundamental....but I digress

I don't think an aftermarket gear warning system is required or nessesary...and yes I'm knocking on wood as I type

 

 

 

[danb35]

As Jeev mentioned, at least some older models have a gear alert installed from the factory (I know it's included on the '67 F models, but not sure how many years or models include it).  If you have the gear down and throttle back below (supposed to be) 12" MP, the horn goes off.  It sounds a lot like the stall warning, but it's an intermittent buzzer rather than continuous.

[rob]

Previous owner of my plane put in a voice warning gear/stall system. He did so after a gear up. (A little late, huh?).

If you want or need details, I can look it up in the logs...

[jlunseth]

I had an Icarus GPSS installed, which has several audible alerts including "Gear!  Gear!"  Haven't had it go off yet though.  My strategy for landing is to use the gear as a brake to go from 120 to 90, so the gear just always goes down.  If the gear has not gone down by the time I am on final approach, it is pretty much impossible to get to good approach speeds. 

[Magnum]

On my J the gear warning is triggered when the speed gets below 65kts OR the powerlever is retared to idle (below approx. 12inch). With a ANR headset the warning is not very loud. I installed the EI voice anunciator, it is connected to the audio panel and says "check landing gear". It is hard to miss that. I use the voice anunciator for the EDM, low vacuum and stall warning, too.

[Jeff_S]

On my J the gear alarm is also triggered by the position of the throttle (and I think an airspeed switch but I've never noticed that). In fact, the same "click" that marks this position is where my transition CFI said to place the throttle for start-up ops (although now I think this is too much throttle, but I digress). As others have noted, it's an annoyance when trying to drop aggressively in for an approach but it does make a good reminder.

Another trick he gave me which I do religiously is to keep my hand on the gear lever until I've confirmed gear lock on the annunciator AND the floor indicator. That way you don't just flip the switch and forget to confirm.

[Piloto]

I have the ACI Voice Alert http://www.flyingsafer.com/2040.htm and strongly recommends to have one of these devices installed. Under stress you can mistake the gear buzzer for the stall buzzer. Mine is triggered from the same line that trigger the buzzers (throttle position) so installation is very simple and reliable. You can hear the voice warnings in your headsets and over the speaker. Get it, it can save you over $20,000 plus the embarrasment

José  

[DaV8or]

Quote: Jeev

I have one, it was installed by a previous owner or the factory.. It works off MP and will give off a loud BEEP when MP is below 15 and gear is up.... It has been more of an annoyance during slow flight and slowing down in the traffic pattern but i figure one day it may save me

[DonMuncy]

I had the (relatively) inexpensive one installed. It works off the same circuitry as the stall and gear horns, but with the voice alert in the headset. I am extremely pleased with the system. I really believe one would have to be unconscious in order to land with the gear up. That incessant voice won't quit until you put more power back in or lower the gear.

I suppose one could find a way to still lose control due to stalling in an extreme circumstance, but it seems it would be quite difficult.

I have never come close to a gear-up, but I really believe this was a very good investment.

Don

[Piloto]

Quote: DaV8or

What I'm talking about is not the factory gear warning horn. Those work as you discribe and they can be annoying. One odf the systems I'm looking at works independent of the factory system and has nothing to do with airspeed. It is electrically connected to the factory gear light indicators, manifold pressure switch and a microwave transmitter that works like radar. The system is activated only if the gear is up and the throttle is pulled back and your plane is 150 feet or lower AGL. I can't think of a situation where this system would be annoying. Here's the link to the system:

ACI 2037

[HopePilot]

What about the AV-17?

http://www.buy-ei.com/Voice%20Annunciator%20AV-17.htm

Seems to do quite a bit for on $250.  Does anyone have it?

[DaV8or]

Quote: 16LPilot

What about the AV-17?

http://www.buy-ei.com/Voice%20Annunciator%20AV-17.htm

Seems to do quite a bit for on $250.  Does anyone have it?

[hansel]

Quote: DaV8or

Seems like a pretty cool box and at an attractive price. I wonder if it works with the JPI 700?

[Magnum]

Quote: hansel

Seems like a pretty cool box and at an attractive price. I wonder if it works with the JPI 700?

[DaV8or]

Quote: Magnum

Edit: The system won't help if you have a malfunctioning gear down microswitch. I saw it once in a K, the pilot put the gear lever down and got the green gear down indication in the anunciator panel. He did not check the mechanical indication on the floor, as the bulb was burned a long time ago. In the flare he realized that the gear was not down, applied full power and did a go around. After cycling the gear and landing about an inch was missing from his MT-prop and the engine needed a prop strike inspection. Fortunately the belly didn't touch the runway.

[Magnum]

Quote: DaV8or

Wow. Sounds like a great little box for just $250! It seems like there ought to be a way to wire it to include the mechanical gear down indicator on the floor. I don't know Mooney systems all that well, but it seems like the light on the panel isn't that useful and it's the one in the floor that matters, so it seems as though it would be just a matter of running a wire from the floor area to the box instead of using the signal in the panel.

[Stefanovm]

I have a '65 E, probably a conversion, but I do not see it in the docs. I have not found it as a delivered option in the docs, either. Would it have the visual check opening? I have not noticed one. I will go out and look.

[Magnum]

Here is a picture of it.

[Stefanovm]

My fuel selector is between my knees on the E and the area shown in your photo is fully carpeted in my E. Maybe it is time to pull up carpet and check, followed by a carpet knife if a window is under there. The mirrors on the C182RG I flew for a while make me wish for a mechanical visual indication. I hope that it is there.

Thanks.

[scottfromiowa]

Check the MOA website.  In the "back issues" there is an extensive article on gear warning.  This is the radar "ground proximity" type that gives a voice through the headset...

[aviatoreb]

Quote: scottfromiowa

Check the MOA website.  In the "back issues" there is an extensive article on gear warning.  This is the radar "ground proximity" type that gives a voice through the headset...

[Dale]

I had a P2 system installed on my M20K this year.  It is a really good system that gives you a verbal warning over the headsets if the gear is not down when you hit 90 knots.  Even though I always pull my GUMPS check, I was concerned because I could not hear the gear warning horn with my headset on when I pulled the throttle back and I was also concerned because the gear warning horn and the stall warning horn sound exactly alike.  I really got concerned when I saw a beautiful Ovation 3 that had a gear up landing at the airport where I was getting the annual done on my plane.  I spoke with the people there who stated that the pilot said he pulled his GUMPS checks but got distracted by the tower when they ask him to immediately make a turn for spacing while in the pattern.  The pilot heard the warning horn when he got the plane down to the runway but thought it was stall warning horn.

The P2 system is great for peace of mind.  It gives you a verbal warning in a female voice over your headset when you hit 90 knots and the gear is not down.  (this airspeed trigger can be set wherever you want it).  If you hit 90 knots and your gear is down, then a male voice states over your headset that the gear is down for landing.  It also gives you a verbal warning for overspeed and stalls.  Even with the P2 system installed you still have the standard gear warning horn go off if the gear is not down when you pull the throttle back.  Again, I like having the peace of mind of having a verbal warning or confirmation regarding the gear, it is cheaper than the cost of a gear up landing.  If anyone is interested here is the website:  http://www.p2inc.com/audioadvisory.asp

[aviatoreb]

Thanks for the review Dale - just a few days too late!  I already pulled the trigger.   I put my credit card down on Tuesday and the P2 is supposed to arrive tomorrow.  To install in my new-to-me M20K. I promised my wife upon getting a retractible that I would buy myself a Bitchin' Betty.  Should be in by the end of next week when our runway reopens as it is down for work for the next week.