exM20K

True. And the business use case has changed dramatically - SETP's have obsoleted cabin class piston twins for business use, and many industries have consolidated: time was that a manufacturers' rep would be out calling on customers oh behalf of a number of different manufacturers. This was a perfect use case for GA. What with the customers and vendors consolidating into fewer and larger entities, internet catalogs and ordering, and sales automation, this role is significantly diminished.

I agree. The SR2x Cirrus is just a plane; the VK30 was innovative and sucked. The company is a marketing and selling machine. They are energetic and everywhere, and the results speak for themselves. I don't like the way they fly, and I believe that back-to-back flights would yield that same conclusion for most pilots....especially w/o the autopilot. There is a thread almost identical to this one going over at Beechtalk: "Our manufacturer puts no effort into marketing an obsolete product, and we're doomed." Some things to consider in this discussion here (channeling @carusoam): The dense and qualified lead pool for a new Mooney is not on this forum in the form of existing owners. I have sold dozens upon dozens of new Diamond aircraft over the last 12 years, and I don't recall ever selling a new DA40 to a legacy aircraft owner. Why? Because the price delta is way out of line with the performance delta. An $80,000 archer is not only one fifth the performance and capability of a new Diamond. The buyer wants new: new panel, new airframe, new warranty, etc. I'm that way with motorhomes - I know they depreciate like a falling rock, but I want mine new. This forum could definitely support a study of the viability of a factory refurb program as @mike_elliott suggests. That would be a smart move on the part of Mooney International, if they want to be in the worker market rather than the fabrication business. Yes, there is some fabrication of interiors and maybe cowlings, but the heavy lifting is in the existing airframe. Can they build in enough margin to make this work? It's worth study, especially considering my point above: they can sell to a cohort of owners who will not be likely new aircraft buyers. Were Mooney to hire a team of smart social media gir er, people, invest in demo tours, reach out to qualified prospects aggressively and on and on... are they presently equipped to make one plane a week? Do they have the ability to ramp up to 2x or 3x that? If not, then the sales & marketing spend is a waste of resources. M10: It is good they killed it. That plane did little that the well-established DA20/DA40/SR20/C172 doesn't do better. Training market is driven by fleet purchases now, and margins on those suck, so you're competing for what? Yes: everyone at OSH is blown away by their booth presence and energy level. They are everywhere IRL and on social media. ICON has a really boss booth at OSH and a pretty high-profile media position (positive, until recently). How's that going? Does Cirrus get a positive ROI on all the marketing spend? Only they know. Are they profitable? Only they know. Things Mooney can do: Investigate the economics of a refurb and/or CPO program Get the gross weight up without blowing out the runway numbers. Re-worked landing gear and VG's? Find or train CFI's in the type, and promulgate that information to the world. eg: here's a map of all the factory-approved Mooney instructors. Ditto service centers - there aren't enough. The new plane buyer doesn't want to dig deep to find out where he can get trained or get his new plane (under warranty) wrenched on. Create a community - proud owners on this forum, for example, who will evangelize. Make sure the existing owners feel supported. Contribute meaningfully to or acquire MAPA and/or homecoming. That doesn't cost a lot. Craft a marketing message to de-value the BRS. I don't know what that message is. The 'chute is very appealing to the non-flying spouse who tolerates the other's dangerous hobby. I always liked the "Time to lose your training wheels" campaign. It struck a great, cheek tone poking fun at a competitor and its dorky product w/o seeming mean or petty. But that campaign was only in aviation magazines. I think it's a winning message to broadcast widely. Cirrus does have a huge and enthusiastic group of owners, but that makes them not only the incumbent, but also a ripe target for a nimble, guerrilla marketing campaign for a better-performing, cooler product. All the other stuff - ramping up production, hiring a professional marketing firm, aggressively reaching out to qualified buyers, supporting demo tours, etc, is a chicken&egg thing that Mooney must figure out: invest in marketing to build a pipeline, or if selling everything they can make now, invest in productive capacity first? Or continue along as a hobby new-plane business with a viable parts/support core? -dan

Would a bank lend on that number? Don't know, but they do get a little hesitant on >30 or 40 years of airframe age. Lending officers rely on bluebook values to retain their employment when a loan goes bad. Would bluebook/Vref put that high a value on it? I really don't know. Other conversions/refurbs have price history (Jetprop, for example). A good test case would be how much would a bank lend on one of Mike Jones "Lock & key" Navajo's. -dan

also... be sure the quotes are apples:apples, especially with respect to accessories and turbo's/exhaust. Dunno about the TSIO360MB, but for the TSIO550G, the invoice includes new turbos and accessories, and it generally is priced very close to field overhaul when all that is taken into account. -dan

Success! Congrats to the caravan participants for perseverance

Mike,, Thanks very much for posting these updates. -dan

Similar experience here: initially they felt too big and always in the way, but storing them longitudinally like you do is fine, and especially for blocking the sun coming in the side window, I wouldn't be without them now. -dan

I visited with Kelly Aerospace last OSH, and they have an Ovation with their A/C unit installed. Dunno what the status of the STC is, but they list a weight of 49 pounds for their system. That is pretty light if they can do it for a long body Mooney. The unit sits in th hat shelf, which wouldn’t meaningfully change my baggage capacity. http://www.kellyaerospace.com/thermacool-aircraft-air-conditioning.html

Totally agree. A well-insulated hangar, with a massive slab, will stay cool pretty well up here in Chicagoland. Mine is 40x50, stick-built w/ 2x6, R-something fiberglass on the sidewalls, blown cellulose in the attic, rigid foam panels on the Hydro-swing door, which makes a very tight seal, and an insulated foundation. It costs pennies to heat to 50* in the winter, and in the summer, even after a three week string of very hot weather, it's still holding low 70's. I'm just careful about when I open the big door and avoid dumping hot, humid air inside if at all possible. B-Kool is sufficient to handle taxi, takeoff, approach, and landing. YMMV. -dan

Staying hydrated helps greatly with the high altitude fatigue as does a pulse demand oxygen system. -dan

How well does th A/C work in the Mooney’s? A few flights in Diamond twins were underwhelming, but maybe it was a poor charge on the A/C. Edit... timing is everything. I see my question is answered one post above. Thanks @Robert C.

Also available on Flightplan page. Mine ties out almost perfectly with ForeFlight and actual fuel when I refuel. TBM930 I flew had a nice weight/runway calculator built in, too. -dan

Ah.... linden. Was based there for several years. Lots of helicopter traffic, the occasional banner tow operator, all sorts of excitement. glad it all worked out for you, but golly: that ramp in your stills.... somebody buy Dudley a sprayer and some Roundup. Are they really letting the place go? -dan

Nice field with a MSC on site and a great restaurant. Be aware, however, that there is no IAP, there are tall (800' AGL) antennas to the SE, and instrument departures will require a non-trivial amount of patience as the work you into the ORD flow overhead. -dan

@ilovecornfields great stuff. In addition to knowing what fields are reachable via FF glide adviser there is one thing I do religiously before IFR (actual IMC) departures from my home drome: field is short, so if something goes wrong on departure, return to field is a not-great idea. I do put the LPV approach for a field that is a straight-in 10 miles or so from home drome into the G1000 flight plan. I don't activate it, but if needed, it's a couple button presses away from steering me to a big rwy with a great approach. En-route, I delete it from the flight plan and continue normally. loading a departure alternate in a stressful situation is not something I'd want to do. -dan

Look at airspeed indicator: 133KIAS = ~ 158KTAS at 9500'. Sameas Aspen calculates for TAS under the tape.

The missing bits, so far as I'm aware, are: 1) unable to handle approaches without glidepath angle and 2) ADS-B weather won't display. (I believe this to be the case, but I haven't tried yet) (1) is not a big deal as I know of no airports that this would exclude. (2) is not a big deal as I run FF with stratus and have XM weather. -dan

https://www.12news.com/article/news/pilot-in-deer-valley-plane-crash-reported-rough-running-engine-minutes-after-takeoff-report-says/75-dffe37a9-3dea-4b37-a86a-b0cd84c7abab No update on his condition. Rough running engine could be a lot of things. It was very hot that day, and the plane had reportedly sat outside, so fuel vaporization will surely be looked at. -dan

In: Dan and Paul. May be able to help w/ ground logistics again.

This is why I hesitate buying a PA46: I'm spoiled by my 310 HP Acclaim S, which cruise climbs 12-1500 FPM into the mid to high teens. Pressurization and radar are on my wish list, but 40 minute climbs aren't. P46T like yours would be perfect, but without Jet-A on my home field, logistics get goofy. -dan

If you have handicapped credentials, there are many close-in handicapped spots. -dan

Update on pilot's condition: https://www.msn.com/en-us/weather/topstories/pilot-in-deer-valley-plane-crash-still-fighting-for-his-life-wife-says/ar-AAD9iGN?ocid=spartandhp Prayers up for a successful recovery, the challenges of which I cannot imagine.

@gsxrpilot Paul, doesn't the O2D2 get hot sitting above the heat inlet like that? My 231 could toast marshmallows when the heater was on. I'm still trying to find a semi-permanent place for the unit, which is much more difficult with the ceiling-mounted O2 ports. -dan

No handy slot to blast them, unfortunately.

Find someone “upgrading” to a pressurized plane. That’s about the only reason I’d sell mine.