Greg_D Posted August 27 Report Posted August 27 I was just curious what folks are doing these days regarding engine overhauls for IO-550s on Ovations. Air Power shows a price of $69K for a new engine and about $62K for an overhauled unit. Both on back order, of course. Has anyone used them recently, and if so, what was the experience like? Also curious what the overhaul shops are charging and how long that's taking these days. Last, how have costs been to actually get a new engine installed labor wise and for a firewall forward kit (hoses, mounts, etc)?
KSMooniac Posted August 27 Report Posted August 27 Check with Powermasters in Tulsa... experts in the 550's especially. I believe Mitch had their former Ovation engine done there and posted about it here many years ago after I gave that vector. Beechtalk is full of great PIREPs as well, and Bill C even participates there. He'll have a backlog (likely) and be at the mercy of the supply chain, but I bet it will be faster than the factory. One nice touch they do is re-work new factory cylinders and get the valves installed correctly so that they'll run for more than the typical 700-900 hours before they need to come off. For installation, plan for 40 +/- hours of labor. I did mine 100% by myself (Lycoming on my J though) and it was not difficult. Great opportunity for sweat equity! 1
Will.iam Posted August 28 Report Posted August 28 and isn't oklahoma a sales tax free state on aviation parts and installation? that right there is worth a few thousand dollar discount compared to other states. 1
McMooney Posted August 28 Report Posted August 28 13 hours ago, Greg_D said: I was just curious what folks are doing these days regarding engine overhauls for IO-550s on Ovations. Air Power shows a price of $69K for a new engine and about $62K for an overhauled unit. Both on back order, of course. Has anyone used them recently, and if so, what was the experience like? Also curious what the overhaul shops are charging and how long that's taking these days. Last, how have costs been to actually get a new engine installed labor wise and for a firewall forward kit (hoses, mounts, etc)? have Brian call Zephyr, they seemed reasonable when i called a few weeks back 1
Alan Maurer Posted August 28 Report Posted August 28 I recently did a top overhaul on my just over 1000 hour IO550. I was burning oil and adding a quart every three hours. I did manage to buy six factory new cylinders. The work was done well at Sarasota Avionics at KVNC. Running alternating 75 and 65 % power. Straight mineral oil. wanted to start with longer flights so flew from Florida to Pennsylvania. About five hours each way. Running very well. And a few knots faster. No oil leaks and watching CHT's Mostly around 375 degrees at cruise. Still was not cheap. Paid $22.5 for six new cylinders and just over ten more for the work. Did not get the new cylinders re worked. Plan to change oil at 25 hours. will look carefully for and little metal scraps and hopefully not any chunks where I can read a part number. Perhaps now engine will make TBO. In Harrisburg, had ceramic coat paint covering . Had Dan at NuAero do the ceramic coating. Mooney looks new! I ask my Cirrus friends if they are getting bird strikes from the rear Alan Ovation M20R
Greg_D Posted August 28 Author Report Posted August 28 I guess the next logical question is how long to run the engine past TBO. My A&P says he's 100% comfortable signing anything off up to 2500 hours and then past that up to about 3,000 hours based on oil analysis, etc. Does anyone here have experience going past TBO that they can share?
Fly Boomer Posted August 28 Report Posted August 28 21 minutes ago, Greg_D said: I guess the next logical question is how long to run the engine past TBO. Mike says the engine will tell you -- not the tach. Savvy Aviator 04 - Debunking TBO.pdf 2
hammdo Posted August 28 Report Posted August 28 On my C, ~2200 hours, oil analysis showed metal (cam/lifters). I did a Top overhaul and we did a complete IRAN (I didn’t want to wait 6 months for overhaul) on the case - new cam, DLC lifters, lifter plungers, push rod caps, tubes, pushrods, new rod bolts, bearings, seals, gaskets, fuel pump. I had already completed accessories (new SureFly, mag, alternator) upgrades by then. Shop checked case, crank etc before IRAN/Top overhaul… While not an overhaul, the shop did a great job getting it freshen up in 3 WEEKS! Runs great… Until it shows metal, I’d run it and save up… -Don 1
jetdriven Posted August 28 Report Posted August 28 1 hour ago, Greg_D said: I guess the next logical question is how long to run the engine past TBO. My A&P says he's 100% comfortable signing anything off up to 2500 hours and then past that up to about 3,000 hours based on oil analysis, etc. Does anyone here have experience going past TBO that they can share? We have a 1987 M20J here with 2700 hours on it. It's never had a cylinder off. It still looks good on the borescope and the compression test and it doesn't use too much oil so I don't know where the end is, but it's not there yet. 4 1
KSMooniac Posted August 28 Report Posted August 28 9 hours ago, Alan Maurer said: I recently did a top overhaul on my just over 1000 hour IO550. I was burning oil and adding a quart every three hours. I did manage to buy six factory new cylinders. This is exactly why the wise/experienced folks over on Beechtalk recommend fixing factory-new Continental cylinders before putting them into operation. The factory just does not do a great job installing valves! There are lots of PIREPs from Powermaster overhaul customers making full TBO+ runs without doing tops, and of course there are magnitudes more PIREPs of TOH on factory engines in the ~800+/- hour range due to valve degradation. 1
EricJ Posted August 28 Report Posted August 28 3 hours ago, Greg_D said: I guess the next logical question is how long to run the engine past TBO. My A&P says he's 100% comfortable signing anything off up to 2500 hours and then past that up to about 3,000 hours based on oil analysis, etc. Does anyone here have experience going past TBO that they can share? Flight schools do it routinely, and since those airplanes fly a lot they don't have the usual issues associated with engines that sit for a long time. It doesn't seem unusual for flight schools to get 3000 hours out of engines. Mine is currently sneaking up on 2400 hours, but it had an IRAN about a 1000 hours ago that included rehoning the cylinders, replacing a guide, etc. I have one cylinder that is getting a little quirky on compression (comes and goes) and oil consumption is creeping up. None of that means an overhaul is imminent, just that it needs to be monitored. Borescopes and oil analysis are still great, so I'm not too worried. 3
Fly Boomer Posted August 28 Report Posted August 28 1 hour ago, EricJ said: Flight schools do it routinely, and since those airplanes fly a lot they don't have the usual issues associated with engines that sit for a long time. It doesn't seem unusual for flight schools to get 3000 hours out of engines. Talked to a guy at CHD who was swapping an engine on a 172. It was on some kind of leaseback arrangement with a flight school. I asked what kind of problem it had. He said it was perfect, but he just swaps out engines at 3,000 hours regardless. 1
Fly Boomer Posted August 28 Report Posted August 28 @EricJ, you may not know that flight school engines are some of the longest lasting. Apparently, our engines (at least the normally aspirated ones) thrive on daily abuse. 1
EricJ Posted August 28 Report Posted August 28 1 minute ago, Fly Boomer said: @EricJ, you may not know that flight school engines are some of the longest lasting. Apparently, our engines (at least the normally aspirated ones) thrive on daily abuse. Yes, regular 100-hour inspections and nearly constant use helps a lot, apparently.
Tom F Posted Sunday at 10:18 AM Report Posted Sunday at 10:18 AM I paid Zephyr $45,800 to overhaul and upgrade to the IO-550N last May which took 12 lbs off the engine. That included replacing the cam which was $2300. They installed J&J Nickel cylinders. Took 65 days mostly because cylinders were scarce. Fuel flow needed to be tweaked after installation but other than that all is good. Florida is also a no sales tax state on aircraft parts. I’m just past 200 hours and it runs great.
skykrawler Posted Sunday at 11:41 AM Report Posted Sunday at 11:41 AM Of course the cost of the engine is just part of the expense. The OP seems to acknowledge that the engine hoses need to be replaced as well. Other things to consider: The engine mount should be cleaned up inspected and repainted. Usually they need it. Its a good time to have the prop resealed and painted which means the old oil and lead sludge will be cleaned out. The exhaust should be carefully inspected. Often there is something going on there. Repair/replace any bad baffling. It's a good time to clean and paint it. How many hours on the alternator?
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