PIREP Seat belts

[Mooney-Shiner]

Hey, guys, I pulled off all the interior for the insulation replacement, so decided to install the shoulder belts as well.

So I just wanted to update on seat belt install options. I found two options. Both three points and both require the replacement of lap and shoulder:

1. Hooker $275 per seat. Manual adjust. Additional $200 per seat if you want the Inertial reel. Also I would have to get the "Minor change kit" from Alpha Aviation for $80 each to attach the shoulder belt to the tubular structure.

2. Alpha Aviation. 

        Option A Manual adjust $690 +$40 for the Minor Change kit: https://alphaaviation.com/mooney-m20-front-fixed-strap-replacement-push-button/ 

        Option B Inertial Reel adjust $750 +$40 for the Minor Change kit: https://alphaaviation.com/mooney-m20-front-inertial-reel-replacement-upgrade-lift-lever/

Looking at these options, I'm keen on going with Hooker's Manual adjust harness and paying for Alpha Aviation Minor Change kits. 

 

[wombat]

I would recommend the inertial reel for at least the front seats.  It's so much more pleasant to put on and wear in the cockpit.

After nearly 2,000 hours of manual adjustments, I smile every time I use my inertial reel seatbelt.

[GeeBee]

Inertial all the way. I flew in a friends airplane a while back with manuals. I dropped a pen on the floor and what a PIA (That is not Pakistan International Airways)

[Pinecone]

Another vote for inertial reels in the front.

I put the Alpha's in about 3 months after picking up my plane.  MUCH nicer

 

[MikeOH]

I went with the Hooker manual belts and Alpha 'kit' immediately after I bought my '70 F (could not believe all previous owners flew with only lap belts!).  No regrets (well, except my wife made me take the "HOOKER" labels off the webbing)

YMMV, but I think the inertia reels are ugly, bulky, and get in the way of backseat passenger ingress/egress. Slipping the the shoulder belt off on the few occasions to switch tanks is just not a big deal.

[Mooney-Shiner]

3 minutes ago, MikeOH said:

I went with the Hooker manual belts and Alpha 'kit' immediately after I bought my '70 F (could not believe all previous owners flew with only lap belts!).  No regrets (well, except my wife made me take the "HOOKER" labels off the webbing)

YMMV, but I think the inertia reels are ugly, bulky, and get in the way of backseat passenger ingress/egress. Slipping the the shoulder belt off on the few occasions to switch tanks is just not a big deal.

Yeah, Mike, I remember laughing while reading your previous post about your wife making you take off the HOOKER patch.  I will tell my wife that I'm commemorating "Fighting Joe" Hooker, Commanding General, Army of Potomac. 

[skydvrboy]

I went with the manual Hooker harnesses and wish I knew a few things then that I know now.  If you use the back seats for passengers any larger than children, go with the manual on the passenger side.  Definitely get the inertia reel for the pilot side.  If you get the manual belts, have them add the pull tabs to make releasing them easier.  They were $2 each when I bought mine, but didn't know about them until the belts arrived.

There are only two minor differences between the Alpha Aviation belts and the Hooker belts.  On the Alpha belts the shoulder strap hooks onto a post coming off the lap belt, whereas the Hooker belts have a slot in the shoulder belt that the lap belt slides through before connecting.  The only other difference is that Alpha has push button release and I don't think Hooker has that as an option.  You could ask if it's important.

Finally, check with your A&P as you may not need the minor change kit.  My A&P just laughed at how much I paid for it as he had all of the hardware needed in his parts stash.

[DCarlton]

6 hours ago, MikeOH said:

I went with the Hooker manual belts and Alpha 'kit' immediately after I bought my '70 F (could not believe all previous owners flew with only lap belts!).  No regrets (well, except my wife made me take the "HOOKER" labels off the webbing)

YMMV, but I think the inertia reels are ugly, bulky, and get in the way of backseat passenger ingress/egress. Slipping the the shoulder belt off on the few occasions to switch tanks is just not a big deal.

Got a link to the Hooker option or a parts list ?  Not obvious on their web site.  Thanks. 

[MikeOH]

26 minutes ago, DCarlton said:

Got a link to the Hooker option or a parts list ?  Not obvious on their web site.  Thanks. 

@DCarlton

Is this what you are after: https://www.hookerharness.com/aviation.html

It'a been six years, but I think I just gave them a call; I think they were around $300.

[Mooney-Shiner]

7 hours ago, DCarlton said:

Got a link to the Hooker option or a parts list ?  Not obvious on their web site.  Thanks. 

DC,

I called Hooker to get all the info. Their website is weak.

Alpha told me that they don't list their Minor Change Kit on the website, but you can call and order.

Based on everything that smart people said, I will go with Hooker systems. Pilot with the reel, Co-pilot with manual. Tabs on. I was thinking about trying to put the Minor change kit out of generic parts, but this thread showed me that the parts unique enough for me to just $160 for two kits instead of trying to find the right match.

  

[Pinecone]

14 hours ago, skydvrboy said:

There are only two minor differences between the Alpha Aviation belts and the Hooker belts.  On the Alpha belts the shoulder strap hooks onto a post coming off the lap belt, whereas the Hooker belts have a slot in the shoulder belt that the lap belt slides through before connecting.  The only other difference is that Alpha has push button release and I don't think Hooker has that as an option.  You could ask if it's important.

For Alpha, the push button release is an option.  They also have the lift buckle type.

[00-Negative]

If I remember correctly from when I called them a couple of months ago, Hooker belts only come in black. 

[Mooney-Shiner]

2 minutes ago, 00-Negative said:

If I remember correctly from when I called them a couple of months ago, Hooker belts only come in black. 

Hooker's belts only come in black when on the reel

[DCarlton]

Anyone having any issues with their shoulders or head hitting the inertial reel?  From the pics, it looks like it could be annoying.  

I was leaning towards the manual (non-inertial) belts; figured I could just keep it loose and tighten if it/when needed.  I've had trouble with aftermarket inertial reels on a classic car.  

[flyboy0681]

39 minutes ago, DCarlton said:

Anyone having any issues with their shoulders or head hitting the inertial reel?  From the pics, it looks like it could be annoying.  

I was leaning towards the manual (non-inertial) belts; figured I could just keep it loose and tighten if it/when needed.  I've had trouble with aftermarket inertial reels on a classic car.  

Oh yea. My wife always complains about hitting the reel with her right shoulder, and there have been many times that I hit it while getting in and out of the plane.

But the pain is worth it.

[DCarlton]

8 hours ago, flyboy0681 said:

Oh yea. My wife always complains about hitting the reel with her right shoulder, and there have been many times that I hit it while getting in and out of the plane.

But the pain is worth it.

Good to know.  I might opt for simplicity.  When things impinge on me in the cockpit it bugs me.  

[Andy95W]

If you have a Johnson bar, you will definitely want the inertial reel and push button release mechanism from Alpha.

[EricJ]

I have the Alpha inertial with the pushbutton release.   I'd +1 that that's a must-have at least on the pilot's side.   

[Pinecone]

I have hit and knocked off the cover for the right side inertial reel.  No interference with the left side reel.

[skydvrboy]

20 hours ago, Andy95W said:

If you have a Johnson bar, you will definitely want the inertial reel and push button release mechanism from Alpha.

I have the Johnson bar with the manual lever style seat belt from Hooker Harness and in six years it's never caused any issue or discomfort in any way.  The only reason I wish I'd installed the inertia reel on the pilot side is for changing the fuel selector lever.  The Hooker Harness seat belts is so adjustable that it simply never gets in the way of moving the gear lever.

[icurnmedic]

Reel for pilot, static for passenger. I felt like backseat entries would hit the reel. 

[Mooney-Shiner]

On 3/15/2024 at 12:21 PM, Mooney-Shiner said:

Hey, guys, I pulled off all the interior for the insulation replacement, so decided to install the shoulder belts as well.

So I just wanted to update on seat belt install options. I found two options. Both three points and both require the replacement of lap and shoulder:

1. Hooker $275 per seat. Manual adjust. Additional $200 per seat if you want the Inertial reel. Also I would have to get the "Minor change kit" from Alpha Aviation for $80 each to attach the shoulder belt to the tubular structure.

2. Alpha Aviation. 

        Option A Manual adjust $690 +$40 for the Minor Change kit: https://alphaaviation.com/mooney-m20-front-fixed-strap-replacement-push-button/ 

        Option B Inertial Reel adjust $750 +$40 for the Minor Change kit: https://alphaaviation.com/mooney-m20-front-inertial-reel-replacement-upgrade-lift-lever/

Looking at these options, I'm keen on going with Hooker's Manual adjust harness and paying for Alpha Aviation Minor Change kits. 

 

OK, bum scoop on my part. The Minor Change Kits are only $40 (as opposed to $80 previously written) each even if you are not getting the Alpha Aviation rigs. 

[MikeOH]

2 hours ago, Mooney-Shiner said:

OK, bum scoop on my part. The Minor Change Kits are only $40 (as opposed to $80 previously written) each even if you are not getting the Alpha Aviation rigs. 

Just make sure that kit is for BOTH pilot and passenger; my memory is a little vague, as it has been over 5 years, but it might be 2 X $40.

[Mooney-Shiner]

42 minutes ago, MikeOH said:

Just make sure that kit is for BOTH pilot and passenger; my memory is a little vague, as it has been over 5 years, but it might be 2 X $40.

You are exactly right. I bought one for passenger and one for pilot.

[MikeOH]

Question for those that have the inertial reels:  Is the orientation of the reel critical?  It seems they function with a pendulous weight and pawl that engages a toothed ring that 'locks' the reel under deceleration.  In photos they always appear to be mounted a bit 'sideways' and I've wondered if they will properly engage when needed in an accident.