New, new and new

[JayMatt]

Hello all,

I'm new here to Mooney space. Just signed up for MAPA too. As of yesterday I'm also the new owner of a Mooney M20J and well I'm new to aircraft ownership. Currently a PP working on my Instrument. I'm based out of the Houston Texas area and would love to meet other Mooney owners in the area. Is there a houston area Mooney group? Also welcome any advice. 

 

[Geoff]

Welcome! You have found the best source of Mooney information on the internet.

I'm based at IWS and there is a Saturday morning pilot crew who meets there if you are seeking other pilots in Houston to socialize with.  There are a few Mooney drivers and former Mooney drivers in the group.

Where are you based?

-Geoff

Edited December 23, 2021 by Geoff

[JayMatt]

I'm at KLVJ for now in the coastal skies hangar. May switch to KGLS or 7XSO depending on a few things. Figured maybe people met up at KLBX for eats and what not. Right now as I learn the plane I'll probably stay out of high traffic areas. 

[TheAv8r]

Welcome! I'm based out of SGR where there are a few Mooneys as well. Always down to meet up at LBX for cheap gas and food, or CXO for the same. 

[McMooney]

Welcome, JM.  I'm envious, those new owner days were amazing 8).

I'm up @KDWH, KLBX and KCLL are my favorite spots.

 

Edited December 23, 2021 by McMooney

[JayMatt]

Thanks guys. How's flying into San Antonio? That's one of the trips my wife and I are looking to do. Figured it's a good weekend trip place. 

[TheAv8r]

19 minutes ago, JayMatt said:

Thanks guys. How's flying into San Antonio? That's one of the trips my wife and I are looking to do. Figured it's a good weekend trip place. 

It's a great trip! I flew into SAT last time, MillionAire fees were $35 (waived with 15gal fuel), and just Ubered around to the Riverwalk, Gardens, or Alamo. I think you can also do Stinson to avoid the fees, you're just a little farther out. I was IFR going into SAT and they fit me in between the line of SWA 737s coming in, asked me to keep my speed up, but otherwise it wasn't a problem getting in.

[redbaron1982]

Welcome JayMatt! I'm also based in Houston, PP working on my instrument. I purchased my first plane this week too. A Mooney M20J 1985. I will have it in SGR while I try to find a cheaper place! Lol. 

I also fly out of KDWH, that's where I did my PPL and where I'm working on for the instrument rating. 

[JayMatt]

So while I have everyone's attention, what toolbox should I be creating for my plane? Do people typically search around for little spots of corrosion and what not and touch them up? Is that a common thing? There is a little on my plane and that's the first thing I'm going to address. Maybe other things tho like cleaning the engine regularly or anything like that? couple quarts of oil on hand. Dust cloth maybe? Just a general kit to have on hand in the car or something to tinker on the plane with things I can do? I know I want to get a G5 installed. Probably figure out where I want to mount a tablet. Maybe consider installing a USB charging port or cigarette port for chargers? 

[TheAv8r]

1 hour ago, redbaron1982 said:

Welcome JayMatt! I'm also based in Houston, PP working on my instrument. I purchased my first plane this week too. A Mooney M20J 1985. I will have it in SGR while I try to find a cheaper place! Lol. 

I also fly out of KDWH, that's where I did my PPL and where I'm working on for the instrument rating. 

Congrats! The instrument will help a lot with insurance. You probably won't find cheaper/better than SGR unless you go to the very outskirts of Houston or as far as LBX. I think TME is a bit cheaper, but that's almost an hour drive for me or more with traffic and just not worth it to me. LVJ has availability issues, IWS is almost $200 more than SGR a month if you can believe it, and DWH has frequent issues with both the quality of the hangars, taxiways, and theft. AXH hangars are total junk, their taxiways from the hangars to the airport are way too narrow and not Mooney friendly with big dips, the runway is pointed the wrong direction, no SS fuel and their FS is the most expensive in the area, and they are only $33 cheaper a month. I've been flying out of SGR for 4 years now and while it's not perfect, in my opinion it's the best you'll get in Houston, clean, nice, spacious hangars, a well kept and maintained airport, towered with approaches, self serve fuel on the field at reasonable rates (not the cheapest in the area but not the most expensive either). 

29 minutes ago, JayMatt said:

So while I have everyone's attention, what toolbox should I be creating for my plane? Do people typically search around for little spots of corrosion and what not and touch them up? Is that a common thing? There is a little on my plane and that's the first thing I'm going to address. Maybe other things tho like cleaning the engine regularly or anything like that? couple quarts of oil on hand. Dust cloth maybe? Just a general kit to have on hand in the car or something to tinker on the plane with things I can do? I know I want to get a G5 installed. Probably figure out where I want to mount a tablet. Maybe consider installing a USB charging port or cigarette port for chargers? 

1. Toolbox... as in what tools should you buy or the toolbox specifically? In no particular order...

• Microfiber towels for cleaning the airplane
• Wash Wax All for cleaning the paint
• Ammonia-free glass cleaner/Plexus/your choice of to clean the windshield/glass
• Mineral Spirits to clean the engine
• Set of spray bottles (I got cheap ones on Amazon) to put the cleaners in
• Trash bucket and trash bags
• Set of 100 mechanic rags for cleaning oil, gunk, etc. off the plane
• A good ratcheting screwdriver, you'll use this a lot tinkering on a Mooney
• Oil funnels 
• LED flashlight
• Safety wire
• Safety wire pliars 
• Needle nose pliars
• Jaw pliars
• A full socket wrench ratchet set with a wide variety of sockets
• Cases of oil
• Oil filters
• Oil draining bucket (I use one you can get for a car that's self-contained)
• Calibrated torque wrench if you want to work on oil changes, cleaning spark plugs, etc. 

Other things to think about are shelves to store things on, a work bench, a minifridge to put waters & such in (you'll want it in the summer!), and buckets to put dirty rags and such in.

2. Corrosion: Treating it as you find it is best, corrosion will spread so best to get it when you see it. Scotch brite + zinc chromate to treat is the common method. I don't think I've gone hunting for corrosion, but if I find some, I usually treat it when I see it. I recommend Corrosion-Xing the plane regularly in the Houston environment to help stave corrosion off.

3. My plane has a Stratus USB charger in it so can't help you there, but I love being able to charge my iPad while I fly.

[redbaron1982]

@jacenbourne, if I may ask, how much are you paying in SGR? The offer they gave me is 587 a month.

I live in Katy, so TME is a good option for me too. I don't recall if they replied me they didn't have availability or they never replied at all. I will follow up that lead also.

I do agree that having a nice airport with instrument approach procedures (SGR has ILS, that's great!) is a plus.

[TheAv8r]

6 minutes ago, redbaron1982 said:

@jacenbourne, if I may ask, how much are you paying in SGR? The offer they gave me is 587 a month.

I live in Katy, so TME is a good option for me too. I don't recall if they replied me they didn't have availability or they never replied at all. I will follow up that lead also.

I do agree that having a nice airport with instrument approach procedures (SGR has ILS, that's great!) is a plus.

So SGR has 3 sizes of hangars, A/B, C/D and E blocks if I remember right. Mooneys fit in A/B, at least mine does, and the J model should be the same size as my E, it just has the aerodynamic improvements. The A/B blocks are $483/mo., the C/D block is the $587 one, you should be able to get an A/B one unless they don't have any available. They just got a new leasing coordinator, Nicole, so if you haven't reached out recently you might check with her. 

[redbaron1982]

I was already in contact with her, actually I am going to see the hangar next Monday. I understood that for the M20J the C/D bank is the one that I need, but I will double check with the wingspan.

[TheAv8r]

9 minutes ago, redbaron1982 said:

I was already in contact with her, actually I am going to see the hangar next Monday. I understood that for the M20J the C/D bank is the one that I need, but I will double check with the wingspan.

It shouldn't be, I have my E in the B block and right across from me is an F in the A block. Your J should be the same size as the F, the wingspan should be the same as my E, just the length of the cabin is different, but it should still fit. We had an Ovation in the B block back in the day.

[redbaron1982]

I will review, would be great to save 100 bucks a month. Looking at the POH, the wingspan is 36ft 5in and banks A/B is 35ft 8in...

Edited December 23, 2021 by redbaron1982

[1980Mooney]

2 hours ago, jacenbourne said:

So SGR has 3 sizes of hangars, A/B, C/D and E blocks if I remember right. Mooneys fit in A/B, at least mine does, and the J model should be the same size as my E, it just has the aerodynamic improvements. The A/B blocks are $483/mo., the C/D block is the $587 one, you should be able to get an A/B one unless they don't have any available. They just got a new leasing coordinator, Nicole, so if you haven't reached out recently you might check with her. 

 

2 hours ago, jacenbourne said:

It shouldn't be, I have my E in the B block and right across from me is an F in the A block. Your J should be the same size as the F, the wingspan should be the same as my E, just the length of the cabin is different, but it should still fit. We had an Ovation in the B block back in the day.

 

1 hour ago, redbaron1982 said:

I will review, would be great to save 100 bucks a month. Looking at the POH, the wingspan is 36ft 5in and banks A/B is 35ft 8in...

The early J's had the box end wings with a 35 ft wingspan.  The later J's, K's, all long body and any Mooney modified with wingtips/winglets are 36 ft. 1 inch.  That ONE FooT bumps you up into the C/D hangars.  They will not yield on this - trust me.

Edited December 23, 2021 by 1980Mooney

[Geoff]

If you are not wedded to your own t hangar, there are common hangar spots at IWS for less than the C/D hangars at SGR.  The airport staff  pulls the plane for you to the terminal and this minimizes hangar rash. 

[1980Mooney]

1 hour ago, Geoff said:

If you are not wedded to your own t hangar, there are common hangar spots at IWS for less than the C/D hangars at SGR.  The airport staff  pulls the plane for you to the terminal and this minimizes hangar rash. 

I was just at KIWS today to meet with a CFII.  He said that West Houston charges you to pull out any plane.  He said he used to have his Baron under the T-Covers at IWS and they charged him $25 every time to pull it out.  He said he got tired of the cost and moved out to Ellington.  IWS seems to charge for everything.  They wanted to charge me a $20 landing fee today when I pulled up to the terminal - and they are not even a towered airport.  They waived the fee if would agree to purchase fuel at $5.54/gal.

Here is a picture of the T-Covers and T-Hangars at IWS in August 2017.  I had my Mooney at IWS under those very T-Covers back in 2004.  Seems like they should offer a discount to keep your plane there......

[Geoff]

6 hours ago, 1980Mooney said:

I was just at KIWS today to meet with a CFII.  He said that West Houston charges you to pull out any plane.  He said he used to have his Baron under the T-Covers at IWS and they charged him $25 every time to pull it out.  He said he got tired of the cost and moved out to Ellington.  IWS seems to charge for everything.  They wanted to charge me a $20 landing fee today when I pulled up to the terminal - and they are not even a towered airport.  They waived the fee if would agree to purchase fuel at $5.54/gal.

Here is a picture of the T-Covers and T-Hangars at IWS in August 2017.  I had my Mooney at IWS under those very T-Covers back in 2004.  Seems like they should offer a discount to keep your plane there......

Bit of a smear job don’t you think?  This is Hurricane Harvey aftermath.  Many airports flooded as well as homes and businesses. It was tragic for many people.  For aircraft owners, and people who watch the weather it was predictable and many had the chance to move their aircraft prior to the storm. Most good insurance policies pay you to do so.

Regarding the pull fee the CFI is partly right and partly wrong.  If you want your plane pulled from your own t hangar or cover from the east side of the airport to the west side terminal they will charge you. However, if you can also just pull your own plane out for free.  

Self service fuel is available and cheaper than the $5.54 for FS you mentioned above.  If you hangar there they offer FS fuel discounts and have weekend FS fuel discounts for everyone.

My comment on hangarage was for privately owned common hangars where a private individual owns the hangar and you rent space from the owner. Many have a deal with the airport where they get a number of free pulls per month and they put that into your lease. 

IWS is not the perfect airport by any means but I have had a plane under a T shade and in a hangar there for 7 years and know the details of what I am sharing first hand should others wish to compare facts. 

[1980Mooney]

1 hour ago, Geoff said:

Bit of a smear job don’t you think?  This is Hurricane Harvey aftermath.  Many airports flooded as well  ....  For aircraft owners, and people who watch the weather it was predictable and many had the chance to move their aircraft prior to the storm. Most good insurance policies pay you to do so.....

...I am sharing first hand should others wish to compare facts. 

Smear job?  KSGR did not flood in the same event.  There was no need to move anything at KSGR including tugs or tools.  But you are right we should compare facts in order to understand why "IWS is almost $200 more than SGR a month if you can believe it," (per @jacenbourne).

The runway at KSGR is more than twice as long as IWS and 25 ft wider, SGR has an ILS (in addition to both RNAV(GPS)) and IWS does not, SGR is Towered and IWS is not, per numerous sites AVGAS 100LL is $0.04 cheaper at SGR vs IWS, Ramp fee at SGR is half the cost of IWS ($10 vs $10 for SEP), SGR is under the 4000 ft Class B layer while IWS is under the 3000 ft layer and north of IWS is almost immediately under the 2000 layer of Class B, all the hangars at SGR have motorized electric bifold doors, the SGR Hangars have their own Pilot's Lounge with showers attached to the hangars, every other hangar building has an airconditioned bathroom at SGR - I know there was nothing at the IWS T-Covers when I was there - no idea about the IWS hangars. And SGR did not flood like it did to the many (most?) at IWS that did not get out ahead of the "weather it was predictable".   

An airport is just a place to take off and land and a hangar or T-cover is just a place to reasonably protect the plane from the elements.  You may say "I don't need all those things at SGR, that runway capability at SGR and I don't want to talk to or deal with a tower".  Fair enough.  Both SGR and IWS are on the west side of the Greater Houston Metropolitan Area and both will support and tie-down/hangar any Mooney but that doesn't explain why IWS costs a premium over SGR.  It should be at a discount. Isn't it just like the cost of Mooney's?...  A J may do the job just fine - you may not need all the added performance/features of an Acclaim.  Just like IWS will do just fine - you may not want all the features or capabilities of SRG. But would you pay a premium for a J? - or would you expect it to be at a discount?

[MikeOH]

Sorry not to be sympathetic, but this is just simple capitalism at work: They get what they get because they can; if they didn't, they would lower prices.  Now, if the airport 'authority' is giving out exclusive rights to just one FBO, then I'd be mad, too.

[ilovecornfields]

Is this the Texas version of “my airport is better than yours?” Whatever it is, it’s quite amusing. Great study break from my AGI written.

[Geoff]

16 hours ago, 1980Mooney said:

Smear job?  KSGR did not flood in the same event.  There was no need to move anything at KSGR including tugs or tools.  But you are right we should compare facts in order to understand why "IWS is almost $200 more than SGR a month if you can believe it," (per @jacenbourne).

The runway at KSGR is more than twice as long as IWS and 25 ft wider, SGR has an ILS (in addition to both RNAV(GPS)) and IWS does not, SGR is Towered and IWS is not, per numerous sites AVGAS 100LL is $0.04 cheaper at SGR vs IWS, Ramp fee at SGR is half the cost of IWS ($10 vs $10 for SEP), SGR is under the 4000 ft Class B layer while IWS is under the 3000 ft layer and north of IWS is almost immediately under the 2000 layer of Class B, all the hangars at SGR have motorized electric bifold doors, the SGR Hangars have their own Pilot's Lounge with showers attached to the hangars, every other hangar building has an airconditioned bathroom at SGR - I know there was nothing at the IWS T-Covers when I was there - no idea about the IWS hangars. And SGR did not flood like it did to the many (most?) at IWS that did not get out ahead of the "weather it was predictable".   

An airport is just a place to take off and land and a hangar or T-cover is just a place to reasonably protect the plane from the elements.  You may say "I don't need all those things at SGR, that runway capability at SGR and I don't want to talk to or deal with a tower".  Fair enough.  Both SGR and IWS are on the west side of the Greater Houston Metropolitan Area and both will support and tie-down/hangar any Mooney but that doesn't explain why IWS costs a premium over SGR.  It should be at a discount. Isn't it just like the cost of Mooney's?...  A J may do the job just fine - you may not need all the added performance/features of an Acclaim.  Just like IWS will do just fine - you may not want all the features or capabilities of SRG. But would you pay a premium for a J? - or would you expect it to be at a discount?

Merry Christmas. I’m grateful we all have as many choices as we do to park our toys. May Santa bring you peace and joy.  

[1980Mooney]

On 12/24/2021 at 3:57 PM, MikeOH said:

Sorry not to be sympathetic, but this is just simple capitalism at work: They get what they get because they can; if they didn't, they would lower prices.  Now, if the airport 'authority' is giving out exclusive rights to just one FBO, then I'd be mad, too.

There is no "airport 'authority'" in Texas. The state is indifferent regarding General Aviation which gives airport operators wide leeway as well as makes it easy for them to sell out to developers without any interference from governing bodies or "airport authorities".  Airport operators give themselves exclusive rights.  And yes there is only one FBO at either IWS or SGR (only one FBO and one fuel vendor at most GA airports in SE Texas - Galveston, Pearland, Gulf Coast Regional, College Station, even the newest western Houston GA airport Houston Executive KTME as well as the majority of GA airports in Texas) so I guess you would be mad being based here.

Edited December 26, 2021 by 1980Mooney

[MikeOH]

2 hours ago, 1980Mooney said:

There is no "airport 'authority'" in Texas. The state is indifferent regarding General Aviation which gives airport operators wide leeway as well as makes it easy for them to sell out to developers without any interference from governing bodies or "airport authorities".  Airport operators give themselves exclusive rights.  And yes there is only one FBO at either IWS or SGR (only one FBO and one fuel vendor at most GA airports in SE Texas - Galveston, Pearland, Gulf Coast Regional, College Station, even the newest western Houston GA airport Houston Executive KTME as well as the majority of GA airports in Texas) so I guess you would be mad being based here.

Based on what you wrote, I would NOT be mad; if the government is NOT involved, then this is capitalism.  Maybe you have an issue with that, but I do not. When people vote with their feet prices will drop.  What is your suggestion? Pass a law controlling prices?  Legislate the profit that YOU think is fair?  Sorry, but I just can't agree with any such approach.