Say Type

[201er]

I heard a bonanaza asking for "six zero thousand" the other day. I guess you can fly VFR again at that altitude but you get flight following from Houston Space Center.

[Bolter]

Quote: CABANABOY

I am a new private pilot, do you say hold short Thirtysix? When ATC tells you to hold short for landing traffic on 36 or hold short tree six?

[201er]

How do you avoid saying "to" though? I find myself saying "Departed one november seven going to three six november." That to is bordering on two....

[jetdriven]

"N201ER off 1N7 for 36N." 

[201er]

436N?

[FAST FLIGHT OPTIONS LLC]

when is said /P i actually meant /"whatever" your equipment code is

[jetdriven]

they know what you mean.   Or you can say "off Blairstown for Somerset".

[M016576]

The legal answer is M20P.

 

But... If you say mooney, they are all pretty much the same VFR (4 place single engine prop going somewhere between 150 and 215 true in cruise, none pressurized, all recips.).  We "split hairs" as owners, but in the ATC system (or the big picture), there is very little difference between an ovation, a 252, a 201 or a ranger when you look at all the other types out there both turbine and prop.  Flame suit on, ready for attacks!

[Ncbosshoss]

Quote: rob

ATC is asking for a type, not a model designation. ATC is aware of M20P and M20T. If you aren't turbocharged, your type is M20P - Regardless of if your model is an A - J.

Using a slant would indicate an equipment code, and I don't think /P is a valid one (or if so, I've never heard of it). I wouldn't say "slant" on the radio unless you were going to specify how you're equipped, and even then I'd so so after identifying your type. For example, I'd be a "Mike two zero papa slant golf"

[Bolter]

Quote: 201er

How do you avoid saying "to" though? I find myself saying "Departed one november seven going to three six november." That to is bordering on two....

[Ncbosshoss]

Quote: CABANABOY

I am a new private pilot, do you say hold short Thirtysix? When ATC tells you to hold short for landing traffic on 36 or hold short tree six?

[jetdriven]

Nope.  Never.  Thats just used for IFR so they can tell your capability (M20P/A)   Of course, I put "VFR GPS" in the remarks of our IFR flight plan, and the first thing they asked off CYAM (Sault Ste. Marie, CAN) was "are you able direct Colehill".    "affirmative.'   

Cleared Direct Colehill" 

Quote: 201er

Do they really care if you're slant whatever if you're strictly VFR?

[PapaPapa]

From what i know of air rules in France (and probably JAR airspace) the ATC enters a "in-air FPL" when you transit in controlled airspace.

For an FPL, you must enter an ICAO aircraft type, so you should reply with an ICAO aircraft type. Dunno what they are for mooney, but from waht i've read i guess M20P and M20T :-)

And as i say "pee ay twenty 28" for a PA28, i'd certainly say  "em twenty pee", although neither are good phraseology

[Hank]

Quote: tomcullen

In my opinion, runways are more serious than aircraft type information.  I will cheat and say "em twenty papa slant golf" but I will always state the runway number clearly in a readback, and that means 36 = "three six".  

But perhaps I am to particular?  I also avoid saying "for" to connect actions to runways.  I will not say "cleared to land for three six", for example.  I will say "cleared to land three six".  And when IFR, I readback, "3 thousand climbing 5 thousand", because my J model won't climb to 45 thousand, no matter how long I climb!

-dan

[jetdriven]

ICAO codes for the PA28 are even more complex than a Mooney.

P28A - All fixed gear PA28's up to 180/181 (the fixed pitch ones)

P28B - Fixed Gear PA28's with a wobbly prop (-235 Dakota etc)

P28R - Arrow 1, 2 & 3

P28T - Arrow 4 Turbo

Quote: PapaPapa

From what i know of air rules in France (and probably JAR airspace) the ATC enters a "in-air FPL" when you transit in controlled airspace.

For an FPL, you must enter an ICAO aircraft type, so you should reply with an ICAO aircraft type. Dunno what they are for mooney, but from waht i've read i guess M20P and M20T :-)

And as i say "pee ay twenty 28" for a PA28, i'd certainly say  "em twenty pee", although neither are good phraseology

[jetdriven]

You can be "out of" 12,000 for 10,000. 

Quote: Hank

In my opinion, runways are more serious than aircraft type information.  I will cheat and say "em twenty papa slant golf" but I will always state the runway number clearly in a readback, and that means 36 = "three six".  

But perhaps I am to particular?  I also avoid saying "for" to connect actions to runways.  I will not say "cleared to land for three six", for example.  I will say "cleared to land three six".  And when IFR, I readback, "3 thousand climbing 5 thousand", because my J model won't climb to 45 thousand, no matter how long I climb!

-dan

[rob]

I use "climbing" or "descending" instead of "leaving" or "out of." It's how I was taught and I figure a little extra description can't hurt.

The difference between an M20T and M20P as far as ATC is concerned is 500fpm climb, 200fpm descent, and a different LAHSO category. See this link: http://www.aopa.org/whatsnew/acdesig.html

[jetdriven]

Sometimes ATC will give a clearance such as "be out of (or cross, or below) FL180 within 3 minutes" or "cross 12,000 30 NE of XYZ.  IN those cases, a "we're out of FL180" call works well.

Quote: rob

I use "climbing" or "descending" instead of "leaving" or "out of." It's how I was taught and I figure a little extra description can't hurt.

The difference between an M20T and M20P as far as ATC is concerned is 500fpm climb, 200fpm descent, and a different LAHSO category. See this link: http://www.aopa.org/whatsnew/acdesig.html

[201er]

Quote: rob

I use "climbing" or "descending" instead of "leaving" or "out of." It's how I was taught and I figure a little extra description can't hurt.

The difference between an M20T and M20P as far as ATC is concerned is 500fpm climb, 200fpm descent, and a different LAHSO category. See this link: http://www.aopa.org/whatsnew/acdesig.html

[rob]

Quote: jetdriven

 

[Parker_Woodruff]

Quote: M016576

The legal answer is M20P.

 

But... If you say mooney, they are all pretty much the same VFR (4 place single engine prop going somewhere between 150 and 215 true in cruise, none pressurized, all recips.).  We "split hairs" as owners, but in the ATC system (or the big picture), there is very little difference between an ovation, a 252, a 201 or a ranger when you look at all the other types out there both turbine and prop.  Flame suit on, ready for attacks!

[carusoam]

Parker,

I think you have made sense out of the distinction.  M20T will very often take part in the flight levels.  M20P, not so much.

Best regards,

-a-

[Shadrach]

Quote: jetdriven

 

[jetdriven]

Too bad VFR GPS doesnt have its own equipment suffix. We can navigate with the KLN-89B to anywhere but cannot do approaches.

[PapaPapa]

Yup...

i know and i usually say or write PA28 instead of P28A, but just wanted to indicate what iknow of thes things :-)

Quote: jetdriven