C to E engine upgrade

[DXB]

33 minutes ago, M20Doc said:

Check that your carburetor is one of the following per the type certificate"

(Carburetor MA4-5, Flow Setting P/N 10-3878, 10-3878-M, or 10-4164-1). 

Clarence

Clarence (or others)  -   Do you happen to know which of these is the "richest" running of the three, and/or what the differences are?   I tried to figure this out a while back but came up empty.

 

[macosxuser]

The 10-3878-M and the 10-4164-1 should be the same richness. The -M is a 10-3878 that has been field modified to be richer. The 10-4164 left the factory with the richer setting.

I'll have to check into the -1, recently MS has been adding aerating nozzles to their carbs. It did wonders for the O-200 and O-300 small bore Continentals, that is what the -1 indicated on those carbs.

[DXB]

26 minutes ago, macosxuser said:

The 10-3878-M and the 10-4164-1 should be the same richness. The -M is a 10-3878 that has been field modified to be richer. The 10-4164 left the factory with the richer setting.

I'll have to check into the -1, recently MS has been adding aerating nozzles to their carbs. It did wonders for the O-200 and O-300 small bore Continentals, that is what the -1 indicated on those carbs.

Finally an answer.  Thanks!

[StinkBug]

I'm gonna go with the others and say that you should look at the carb before getting crazy with the motor. I can't go lean of peak, but my carb is very consistent and predictable. If there's time I'll let you take her for a spin in Madison and you can see.

[kmyfm20s]

Have you crossed checked your FF with actual fuel used? If your engine runs strong and consistent in flight like you say but your FF dances all over the place I would think its a faulty FF transducer.

[Hank]

2 hours ago, StinkBug said:

I'm gonna go with the others and say that you should look at the carb before getting crazy with the motor. I can't go lean of peak, but my carb is very consistent and predictable.

I agree with this. My C also would not go LOP despite all of the tricks (slightly reduced throttle, partial carb heat). Two annuals ago we finished resurrecting my doghouse (started the previous year, interrupted by relocating 3 Mooney hours away) and rebuilt the carb heat box and installed new carb heat cable. Now, when I'm high enough, I can get almost 25° LOP!

So please, check the carb, look for induction leaks, check baffles and update your doghouse. It really works.

[Conrad]

Sounds like you can do a little better than you are presently. See how much better that is before you make comparisons. I don't think it's worth that kind of money to get the lower fuel flows. After all, that extra fuel is still helping moving the plane forward.

I went the other way on the purchase trade off - decided I definitely wanted the IO at the expense of some panel gadgetry. Result: I have a wing leveler instead of a STEC, a 430 instead of a 530, and my paint has a some areas that aren't 10/10.

[kortopates]

I'd overhaul that carb before changing planes !    My C doesn't run like your's .....

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[kortopates]

I'd overhaul that carb before changing planes !    My C doesn't run like your's .....

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[KvogDEN]

So, what did he do?  Keep or upgrade?  Problem fixed?

I flew some hours in carburated Mooney's. I never even heard of the eradic carb problems described. Well except that one time on my commercial checkride when the float hung up and engine quit shortly after take-off.

I hope it got worked out. 

Edited October 19, 2016 by KvogDEN

[Marcopolo]

Oh, it got worked out...he skipped the IO-360 upgrade, skipped the upgrade to an E model and bought a K model 252.  

[DaV8or]

13 hours ago, Marcopolo said:

Oh, it got worked out...he skipped the IO-360 upgrade, skipped the upgrade to an E model and bought a K model 252.  

Nice! That's a whole lotta skippin'. 

[carusoam]

The C is an excellent tool to assess how well GA fits into your life.  

Try it on until you wear it out. Then select the Mooney that best fits the mission you know so well.

A J, K, or R may be in your future...

Best regards,

-a-

[par]

On 7/8/2016 at 1:07 AM, Hank said:

I agree with this. My C also would not go LOP despite all of the tricks (slightly reduced throttle, partial carb heat). Two annuals ago we finished resurrecting my doghouse (started the previous year, interrupted by relocating 3 Mooney hours away) and rebuilt the carb heat box and installed new carb heat cable. Now, when I'm high enough, I can get almost 25° LOP!

So please, check the carb, look for induction leaks, check baffles and update your doghouse. It really works.

How does one upgrade the doghouse? Is there a kit available somewhere? I don't even know what would indicate the need to upgrade. As far as I can tell, my C has a good doghouse but I def can't keep temps where I would like to in certain phases of flight.

[carusoam]

Most dog house work is replacing all the old seals that it has.  Replacing all the fasteners that have been used. And the last thing is fixing any cracks or holes that have been elongated over the years...

keeping air from sneaking out in a way that was not intended back in the 60’s is as good as it gets.  

The next option is significant cowling mods that are both aerodynamic and better control airflow down and through the cooling fins...

See the cowl mod work that Sabre mechanic is working on for a better idea on how cowl cooling can and should work.

keeping CHTs under 380°F is preferred.  

Cowl flaps, Mixture, AOA and AS also are used to improve cooling.

having a jpi or other is helpful for this task.

Stuff I learned around here...

Best regards,

-a-