67 F

[MARZ]

Anyone know this plane?

http://www.controller.com/listingsdetail/aircraft-for-sale/MOONEY-M20F/1967-MOONEY-M20F/1271995.htm

[Skywarrior]

FAA Accident/Incident Information #FAA1 Accident/Incident Occurred on: 2005-06-25 Narrative: (-23) PILOT STATED THAT HE FELT SOMETHING HAPPEN, AIRCRAFT LOST POWER, SWAPPED FUEL TANKS AND MAGNETOS NO HELP, ADJUSTED MIXTURE/THROTTLE NO HELP. ATTEMPTED TO LAND AT AIRLAKE BUT COULD NOT MAINTAIN ALTITUDE. AIRCRAFT LANDED IN BEAN FIELD APPROXIMATELY 3 MILES NORTH OF LAKEVILLE, MN.

[Shadrach]

I think it looks like a nice bird. If it had manual gear, it I'd be a perfect platform to build upon. Interior and avionics to your own specs and you've got 201speed with somewhat better useful load than most Js.

A gear up 45 years ago would be a non issue for me. The off airport landing in 2005 lists the damage as minor. This too would not stop me from investigating further (and negotiating). I would look closely at the logs and the repairs. It looks likes its owned by an ATP based out of Knoxville. Nice looking bird!

[Seanhoya]

Beware of the autopilot issue - expect that you will have to replace it with some variety of STEC for a minumum of $10,000.  I have trouble-shot autopilot issues for years in my 1968 Mooney M20G, with only moderate success.

 

Also beware the comment about IFR-certified.  Without the autopilot, and considering the fact that the factory wing-leveler was probably removed (I forget the name of this airpump-driven system - anyone?), means that you will have to hand-fly everything.  My experience is that everything that has to do with IFR significantly increases the amount of maintenance that you regularly need (maintain two radios, pitot-static, constantly rebuilding directional and turn rate gyros and attitude indicator, etc...)  This all depends, however, on how demanding you are.  An ADF-rebuild cost me a grand a few years back.

 

The plane certainly looks nice, but I I would take a rebuilt panel to a nice paint job and interior any day.  A nice paint job will cost you $10,000-$15,000.  Interior is roughly the same.  A new panel, or at least upgraded radios and maybe a GPS, will start at $15,000 up, and takes a while to make sure all the systems are working up to specifications.

 

Just some thoughts....  FYI - I bought a similar plane years ago and absolutely love it, but just beware that it will end up costing you twice as much as you originally plan for, even if you get a deal on the original purchase!

 

Good luck!

Sean 

[N601RX]

The Brittain autopilot is by for the easiest and cheapest system to keep fixed. Normally a piece of hose or some tape will fix it. Even if the complete system needs overhauling, it is still under 1K.

[Shadrach]

Beware of the autopilot issue - expect that you will have to replace it with some variety of STEC for a minumum of $10,000. I have trouble-shot autopilot issues for years in my 1968 Mooney M20G, with only moderate success.

Also beware the comment about IFR-certified. Without the autopilot, and considering the fact that the factory wing-leveler was probably removed (I forget the name of this airpump-driven system - anyone?), means that you will have to hand-fly everything. My experience is that everything that has to do with IFR significantly increases the amount of maintenance that you regularly need (maintain two radios, pitot-static, constantly rebuilding directional and turn rate gyros and attitude indicator, etc...) This all depends, however, on how demanding you are. An ADF-rebuild cost me a grand a few years back.

The plane certainly looks nice, but I I would take a rebuilt panel to a nice paint job and interior any day. A nice paint job will cost you $10,000-$15,000. Interior is roughly the same. A new panel, or at least upgraded radios and maybe a GPS, will start at $15,000 up, and takes a while to make sure all the systems are working up to specifications.

Just some thoughts.... FYI - I bought a similar plane years ago and absolutely love it, but just beware that it will end up costing you twice as much as you originally plan for, even if you get a deal on the original purchase!

Good luck!

Sean

 

Sean, You need to slow your roll on the assumptions.

1) You don't know if the wing leveler was removed. The Brittain pneumatic system can be anything from a simple wing leveler all the way up to a 3 Axis with nav coupling. It is for all intents and purposes a component system that can be added to.

2) If the advertisement says the system has vac leaks it probable does. I was shocked mine did not after looking at the condition of the hoses behind the panel. I guess they passed annual for years and years because no one wanted to climb under the panel to deal with it. I'm 5'11 and 190lbs and it took me less than 3 hours to change every hose and filter behind the panel that pertained to my Brittain wing leveler. Should be good for another 15 years...

3) Brittain is still in business and will overhaul any unit you need for a very reasonable price. They have not designed new units in decades, but the "old" pneumatic system is known for it reliability and can interface with the latest and greatest in avionics.

4) if this plane came with or has a full Brittain AP, I would consider the new owner lucky as the it could likely be fully refurbished for pennies on the dollar compared to the cost of a new S-tec and could be outfitted to do 90% of what the sweetest S-tec is capable of.

5) This bird has mods that are increasingly difficult to find and have done these days with a nice coat of paint over top of them. If you think that adding a 201 style cowl, windshield and fresh paint can be duplicated for $10K-15K, you're terrible misinformed.

6) The cost of panel and interior work can be significantly reduced by an owner willing to be physically involved in the work. Paint and airframe mods are a far more difficult proposition when it comes to sweat equity.

7) The DG and AI in my AC have needed rebuilt in ~20year intervals...not "constantly"! If something is out of spec, it's out of spec... just because you don't get it certified every 2 years does not mean you want to fly behind it. I've had the altimeter replaced once as well. One of my radios has been trouble free. The other was a pain, but that was largely due to an overheat situation caused by a poor installation. It has been rectified. So I budget about $350 for an IFR cert every 2 years. I don't sweat panel bits because for the most part, everything in the panel has been amortized out and owes me nothing at this point, yet it all works beautifully.

This is a machine that is capable of taking 750lbs+ of cabin payload 500nm with reserves at 150kts+ or it will take 620lbs+ over 900NM with reserves. How does that stack up to your G model?

It also has a lot of hard to find updates for an F with what appears to be solid paint done in 2008...and a recent, low time engine that's been flown 100hrs a year since it was installed. I'm not saying it's perfect, but it has a lot going for it on paper that many do not; at 50K it's has $hitload of capability and potential for less than what many 1970s era 172s are being listed for.

P.S. If you're having issues with the AP in your G, then post about it or send me the link to your post about it. I'm sure your problem is not unique to your airplane.