MBDiagMan

Okay, I’ll bite. How do you, as the engine manufacturer, propose solving the corrosion problem in a method other than taking steps to make components less susceptible to corrosion?

Using Florida as an example of a climate with more corrosion than, say Arizona, is not a slam against Florida. Florida is a beautiful state with great people. Coincidentally on average there is much more humidity in Florida than in Arizona. Humidity accelerates corrosion. Nothing against Florida.

Of course location makes a difference. Arizona is a dry climate. Florida would be the opposite.

Jetdriven, have you seen any evidence that the DLC coated lifters are helping this situation?

Although the cam and lifter corrosion problem is probably the Achilles heel of these engines, they are still susceptible to the same wear problems as any other engine. Sure, operating regularly probably eliminates the Achilles heel, but it is still a mechanical device that wears and things happen. Properly cared for and flown regularly I expect that it is as good as anything out there. In my case, since it’s apart anyway, and since the Achilles heel was the cause of the tear down, the DLC lifters seem to be a great improvement. If not for my benefit, maybe the next owner will end up having to let it set for awhile and will be hangaring it in a high humidity area. It might be what keeps him from going through the same thing.

I know that. It was running really nice when it started making metal. It will be a great engine when we’re done.

Well, since the sitting happened before I got it, except for the fact that I bought it anyway, that was out of my hands, but I agree that frequent flying is the best cure. In my defense, at the time of purchase the cylinders had been removed, everything inspected, fresh rings and back together so I thought all was good. BTW, thanks on the correction. I had read “coating.”

I have read and experienced the problem with the high cam Lycoming. With the cam high, if the engine is left unstarted in a humid climate for long enough, the oil can drip off the cam and corrosion will form. If the time comes when there is enough corrosion, a pit will form. Much like a chuckhole in pavement, a small piece will come out when the cam lobe wipes over it. Then another tiny particle and so on which results in metal in the oil filter, and ultimately can wipe the lobe off of the cam. This can also happen in a Continental, but I don’t think it happens nearly as frequently.There are oil additives which keep the oil clinging to the cam and lifter. That helps. If the plane is flown regularly and/or kept in a dry climate this is often not a problem.Roller cam followers help this problem immensely with reduced friction being a side benefit, but retrofitting to rollers at rebuild time is a pricey venture.Lycoming is now manufacturing lifters with what is called: Diamond Like Coating (DLC.)At this point, these lifters are very difficult to find, but fortunately I found a set for my current overhaul. An overhaul that is the result of the cam and lifter corrosion process that I described.I don’t know how long they have been producing the DLC coated lifters, so I don’t know how tried and true they are, but it seems that this could be a major improvement.

Have you cleaned the headset phono plugs with scotch brite?

I hesitate writing this because I no longer have the book where I read it. I “loaned it” to my son in law and haven’t seen it since. In an airplane buyers guide from the the eighties, I read that Dugosh refused to do the pull test on the wood tail. He feared that the pull test could begin a crack and you might never know it until it was too late. He felt very good about the wood wing, but said that he would not put his signature anywhere in the logbook of a Mooney with a wood tail. That led me to believe that being in Kerrville, he had seen a tragedy involving a wood tail. Take it for what it’s worth, but further research might be in order.

Yes.

Works great in my Mooney with a 430W and 345. The 420 in my Cessna is non WAAS and I don’t think it will receive the info from the 345, which is why it has an Apareo ESG instead.

From what I’ve seen with these, if all you want is compliance, they will get you by. I’ve been pleasantly surprised that they have worked. I expect that those who have had trouble have had it with their long in the tooth transponder, not the beacon itself.

Hyper tech had a little nugget buried in his post that I hope you didn’t miss. He spoke about moving from a well sorted plane, whatever it is, to another plane that is an unknown will probably require time and money to sort it out. The first two planes I bought were so well sorted that I took that value for granted. I was just lucky. When I got my F almost three years ago, I began down a road that I still haven’t found the end of. That is not a statement against Mooney’s, it’s just that I was unlucky with this one. If you decide to join us in the wonderful world of Mooney’s, just give thought to the fact that changing to ANY plane could have some frustration involved before you get it in the condition you will want it to be.

I’m sure he’s a good guy and I cant imagine it being anything other than a mistake that I’m sure he feels horrible about. The first thing I wrote was that I have empathy for him, but there has been a rash of Mooney gear ups that’s costing all of us. Let’s try to be careful okay!

It’s very easy to see what business you’re in. I think it’s a bit unfair to say publicly what I think without ever having met me. You made such a judgment based on a few paragraphs that you read on a discussion forum. You know nothing about me. Actually I have given quite a lot of thought to self insuring. If you would not have withheld part of my post from your quote, you would have shown that I was told flat out by my insurance person that due to so many Mooney’s being gear upped of late, the premiums are on the rise. That would have been more fair than blasting me without mention of the fact that I had a source for such information. I have never had a claim, an accident, a violation, a DWI, etc. wouldn’t it be appropriate for those without a problematic history to get a slightly lower improved rate?

I’m sure he feels sick about it and I have empathy, but I just wonder if he understands that he contributed to rising Mooney insurance rates? When I talked to my insurance person about the rapidly rising rates she said that there had been a rising number of gear up landings. Since I am also a Mooney owner I get to share the cost of all the gear ups.

I was told the same thing by them more than 2 1/2 years ago. Don’t get excited and don’t plan on it happening.

Hmm..... I was told the very same thing from these people before they were purchased by King. The difference is that they told me “four weeks” well over 2 1/2 years ago. I would suggest that you don’t hold your breath waiting for it.

I think that it’s a rare case where it can truly be justified. You either want to spend the money and you have it to spend or you don’t. I just got through putting a 420 in a Cessna 140. That couldn’t be “justified” in fifty years. I wanted to do it and I did it. That’s the only justification that can work 90+ % of the time.

Choosing among different models to have the desired features is fine, but no matter what, don’t lose sight of the top three criteria when evaluating ANY used vehicle whether it has wings or not. These top three criteria are: 1. condition 2. Condition 3. CONDITION

I get it! I learned to fly in an Aeronca Champ.

No disrespect meant Lance, but although I hope you’re right, I’ll believe it when I see it.

Don’t know if it originally had the piano keys or not. This is a ‘48 that went through an extensive Restomod in 1980. A 150 was clearly donated to the project. Many components including the O-200A, alternator, vacuum pump, wheel pants, seats,.... came from a 150. At the same time the original panel was removed and this one custom built from scratch. It got all the latest avionics of the time. A week ago Com 1 came out and replaced with the 420. Nav 2 came out and replaced with the indicator. NAV 1 is still a LOC/GS. The ADS-B IN/OUT transponder went in a couple of years ago. The person that did the Retomod in 1980 gave it to his wife for her birthday and she got her instrument rating in it.

I might as well derail this thread since it is getting zero results for the autopilot. A picture of the latest mod to my 140’s panel. I wonder how many 140’s can file Slash Golf?