Crossing the desert in August

[AmigOne]

After Oshkosh this year a friend and I are planning to cross the Rockies enroute to Seattle, come south to north of LA hang a left south of Edwards AFB and return east via the desert with stops in Casa Grande, El Paso and maybe somewhere else in between. I guess many of you live in this corridor and I would appreciate your best advice for the trip. I have read the FAA publication on crossing the desert but I would consider very seriously the advice of this group. I have flown this route 3 times before but never in August so I wonder if it is foolish to attempt it during the hottest month of the year. I have flown hundreds of miles over water and jungle (albeit in bigger and newer airplanes) without the same feeling of apprehension that the desert gives me. Pireps on places to stop on this route will also be appreciated.

[1964-M20E]

Four things I recommend even though I have never flown across the desert are water,shelter,food and signaling devices. Probably what the FAA publication says also.<br />Water enough for you and PAX for 4 days 1 gallon per person per day this can add up on you usefull load.<br />Shelter can be anything to keep the sun off of you during the day and cold off you at night. Sitting inside an aluminum can (Mooney) during the day would be brutal. There is probably a long list of things you could have with you but water would top my list on a desert crossing or even anywhere. Most of my flights are over fairly populated areas so I’m not as concerned.<br /><br />We all should keep several bottles of water in the plane just in case. I usually try to grab at least one or two for me and each PAX. I do have some space blankets, and signaling devices I keep in the plane. Oh by the way even if you do not have a cell signal you can use your cell phone as a signal mirror. So it can still communicate when the batteries are dead and you have not signal.<br />

[carqwik]

I fly out of Phoenix Deer Valley...so obviously any flying we do here is out over the desert!  First, it's brutally hot here in the summer...July and August are the worst months.  Best idea is to fly very very early in the morning...like when the sun comes up.  Temps start at 85-90 degrees at sun up and rise rapidly to 110 or higher.  Turbulence from the heat rising off of desert floor often rises to 14,000 and starts as early at 8AM to 9AM...and it's not pleasant to fly through.  Do not try to fly through, land, or takeoff if dust devils are present...they are like mini tornadoes.  Do not fly under any isolated clouds that are producing rain shafts...even if they don't look like a t-storm, I've seen lightning come out of them.  And since July and August are monsoon season here, don't try flying anywhere near the buildups...typically though they grow during the day and explode late in the afternoon.  Of course, density altitude is important....even at Phoenix where we're at 1,400 feet MSL. Do the math at 40C and see what the density altitude is. Preferred altitudes are all above 10k to get any cabin cooling...higher is better.  Bottom line...fly very very early and land early.  

 

Worthwhile stops...Bullhead (IFP) if you want cheap casinos across the river, Sedona (SEZ) for the natural beauty,   Nothing to see at CGZ...just cheaper fuel usually, Tucson (TUS) to see the Pima Air Museum (mostly outdoors so not a great idea in the summer).  And there's not too much between TUS and ELP...

[Bennett]

I've done the southern crossing east to west and west to east several times in August. Two things:

One: Fly early in the day - very early if possible. It is generally cooler then, and the air more stable.

Two: Usually the higher you go, the less the heat and terrain induced turbulence. Winds on this route

are usually westerly, and with a little planning you can really boost ground speeds by picking the most

advantageous altitude. It has been my experience that August is generally clear, and the flight has

excellent ground visibility, even though it seems to take forever to cross Texas. Casa Grande and

El Paso are good stops, but you might consider Tuscon as an alternative to Casa Grande - hotels across

the street from the GA FBOs, and if you have the time, a visit to the Pima aircraft museum - much of it

is outdoors, so again early in the day is preferable. I really like the southern route. By the way, not

much east of El Paso until you reach Fort Stockton, so be sure to have plenty of fuel for this leg.

Enjoy!

[TTaylor]

After Oshkosh this year a friend and I are planning to cross the Rockies enroute to Seattle, come south to north of LA hang a left south of Edwards AFB and return east via the desert with stops in Casa Grande, El Paso and maybe somewhere else in between. I guess many of you live in this corridor and I would appreciate your best advice for the trip. I have read the FAA publication on crossing the desert but I would consider very seriously the advice of this group. I have flown this route 3 times before but never in August so I wonder if it is foolish to attempt it during the hottest month of the year. I have flown hundreds of miles over water and jungle (albeit in bigger and newer airplanes) without the same feeling of apprehension that the desert gives me. Pireps on places to stop on this route will also be appreciated.

Should not be a problem at all.

1. As other have said, fly early. We had to leave late last week at about 12:30 pm and my passengers were not happy.

2. Fly higher as the day goes on and plan to be done by about 1:00.

4. Carry extra water just I case.

5. Carry a coat, blanket or space blanket.

3. Carry a SPOT or other tracker if you are worried. Mine is:

http://share.findmespot.com/shared/faces/viewspots.jsp?glId=0taQlL3JAG6KN4kmWsafqtOp6HJb5Z7rm

Updates every 10 minutes and help text to cell phones and 911 if needed.

[KSMooniac]

Pecos is a great fuel/food stop east of El Paso.  Easy in/out, great service, etc.   Lots of famous aviators have stopped there over the years as you'll see on the walls...

[Dave Marten]

After Oshkosh this year a friend and I are planning to cross the Rockies enroute to Seattle, come south to north of LA hang a left south of Edwards AFB and return east via the desert with stops in Casa Grande, El Paso and maybe somewhere else in between. I guess many of you live in this corridor and I would appreciate your best advice for the trip. I have read the FAA publication on crossing the desert but I would consider very seriously the advice of this group. I have flown this route 3 times before but never in August so I wonder if it is foolish to attempt it during the hottest month of the year. I have flown hundreds of miles over water and jungle (albeit in bigger and newer airplanes) without the same feeling of apprehension that the desert gives me. Pireps on places to stop on this route will also be appreciated.

Amig, 

 

You're heading right for my backyard! Happy to share with you my preferred routing through the SW. Desert is no big deal, but as others have said: Depart early for best WX (heat/turb/convection). When are you arriving/departing OSH? If you'd like to talk routes send me a PM.

[N201MKTurbo]

I have flown a few thousand hours in the Arizona desert.

 

The bumps start getting bad about 11:00 AM and start getting better about 6:00 PM. They are annoying but won't hurt you. The thunderstorms can almost always be circumnavigated. The mountains can be circumnavigated also, but it is usually not necessary. Dust storms will not hurt you, but the vis can get down to 5 mi or so. Don't fear dust devils, they are only bad if you fly right through them at low level. If you miss them by 50 feet you will be OK. If you fly right through them they will thump you pretty good, but it only lasts a second or two. I have done it a few times just to see what it is like.

 

If you park your plane around here don't put your headsets on the glare shield because they will burn your ears when you put them on. Also, put a towel over your yokes if the sun is shining on them.

[OR75]

Unless you decide to stay low,  I don't know if there is any area in the continental US you can really qualify as a desert from an ATC standpoint.

 

Anywhere I flew, including the area you intend to fly to, radar contact lost never last more that 10-15mn, unless you really stay close to the ground, 

 

If you don't want to talk to ATC, just follow I-10.

 

In the Edwards / Mojave area, you will have more ATC attention than you really want !

[jetdriven]

If you stop at Boerne Stage Field, you can get the courtesy car, get down to Rudy's at Leon Springs, and eat some hellaciously good Texas Bar-B-Q.

[Hank]

Forewarning to the uninitiated:

 

• in the South where I was raised, "barbecue" is slow-cooked, smoked pork with sauce [vinegar-, mustard- or tomato-based depending on which state you're in]; barbecue chicken and barbecue beef are available, but 'barbecue' is pork. Barbecue is often chopped, but may be picked [hand-picked off the bone in small pieces], then simmered in sauce. Sometimes available sliced, but like with chicken and beef, it is identified ["sliced barbecue"]; barbecue by itself is little bits of smoked pork cooked in sauce.
• in parts of the North, "barbecue" is a verb meaning "to cook [whatever kind of] food on a grill." This includes hamburgers, bratwurst, chicken, vegetables and sometimes fruit;
• in Tejas, "barbecue" is slow-cooked, smoked until it's dry beef brisket, usually sliced, with spicy sauce poured over it.

I like hot [spicy] food, and the hottest I've ever been served has been down in that desert--Arizona is proud of theirs, but New Mexico has a Hot Pepper Institute at NMU. You've been warned . . . .

 

Enjoy your trip, have lots of fun, and fly carefully!

[BigTex]

Now Hank... Everyone knows that "real" BBQ is a smoked Brisket! Hell, the only pigs allowed in Texas smoke houses walk through the door!

[robert7467]

I was raised in TX and lived in Memphis for 13 years. I love the beef brisket, but ribs are pork. Hate to burst your bubble guys. I was on the Memphis in may championship team "killer hogs"

[robert7467]

Texas=brisket. Memphis= BBQ

[Hank]

Ain't nothing like a good north Georgia smoked barbecue swimming in spicy tomato-based sauce with a side of slaw and some beer-battered Vidalia Onion rings! Now I'm gonna have to fly down and get some, after this here derecho thing blows through!

Hope your trip across the desert goes as well as mine across the mountains!

[AmigOne]

Ok Hank, liked your piece about barbecue, now any other helpful advice about the desert in August. I guess there are a lot of guys from the area that may have contributed if the thread hadn't been hijacked. I need and value the advice of this crowd.

[Jamie]

Sounds like the flying part is covered, more or less. But if you're interested in what to do if you have to land off airport, I can't recommend equipped.com highly enough. It was started to advise pilots on what to carry (and how to use what they carry) to survive an off airport landing. It's NOT a "survivalist" site. You could start by reading the equipment guide: http://equipped.com/toc.htm or register and post on their forums. Great bunch of people.

[kmyfm20s]

What part of the desert gives you apprehension? In addition to the good advice you have received so far I like to bring a couple bottle of water that I freeze the before the flight. As it melts I sip on it and us it to get a handkerchief wet and keep it on my neck. I wear shorts and flipflops so I can be barefoot to keep cool. I have one of the switchbox A/C coolers on order which Im ecited about for this summer. I have not found an altitude in a NA plane that I can get away from the thermals so I leave early. I have accasionally got down low to get away from the thermal when they start bugging me, I mean low on the deck to get out of them before, lots of fun and a great sensation of speed:). I like being in the air by sunrise this makes for a very nice flight and the desert scape are amazing with shadows and colors. Have fun!

[RocketAviator]

I live in El Paso, home base 5T6 Dona Anna County ie Santa Teresa NM 10 miles west of KELP 8000' runway.  Save yourslef some serious $ on fuel at 5T6.  Great World Class War Eagle Museum on Field!  I have flown the route from Phoneix, Tucson and most points in between more times than I can count... i think... during all months of the year... Common Sense and should be a very anti-climatic event..  Simple Fly early or late and high for best ride, if you are heavy DONT FORGET DENSITY ALT... it will kick your tail or worse!   Coming in from the West and headed East there is much to be seen but again beauty is in the eye of the beholder i guess!

Ok back to your point, highly recommend you do not fly low especially crossing the mountain range between Phoenix - Tucson towards El Paso and the same headed East out of El Paso.... again common sense!

There is virtually no part of this lower US route that you will be out of radar at 12 to 15k and in most cases much lower.  The border radar picks most traffic up even down to the ground!  Beware if not on IFR flight plan there is a constant TFR (border radar tethered balloon) just about 70 miles West of El Paso

If you stop by El Paso or 5T6 give me a call and I will take you to what I think is the best BBQ and you can judge for yourself.... You bet it is BEEF, BEEF RIBS, BEEF BRISKET or the Best Mexican Food in all of the World... ok I might be a little biased but not much!

Ditto on Tucson and not CG

PM me for more info or my contact information.

I hope to go to Oshkosh this year but it is not looking good at this point!

Common sense, reasonable preparations (I always like the SPOT) but come on it is not like we are out in the uninhabited Wild

West here.... 

Fly safe, good luck,

[Dave Marten]

Good points Lacee.

 

ABQ center is extremely helpful w/ VFR flight following (USE IT-it gives you someone to talk to) or go IFR. Radar converrage is never really a problem anywhere above 10K in mountainous areas and 8K over flatter terrain. Ditto 5T6 if you're going south around White Sands. If North of White Sands INW, SJN, TCC are easy friendly stops.

 

W/O Oxygen 11.5K MSL will keep you cool, smooth(er), and clear of the rocks on either route (north or south of White Sands).

 

If you're used to flying in the summer haze of the southeast you'll enjoy the SW's crisp clear skies with 70NM+ visibilties (unless the wildfires kick up).

 

Enjoy!

[RocketAviator]

If you stop by 5T6 or El Paso and insist or just want we can also take you for some great pork ribs too.... Heck we can do it all, now just tell me where else in the world can you get such a selection... Best Mexican Food in the World, Best BBQ all kinds, Best place to save $ on fuel, Best Host... (well...) Best.... ok I think you get the point that I am maybe a little more than biased about the food we have available here!  We would welcome you if you decide to come this way and if not and find yourself in need give me a call!

Good luck and fly safe,

Rocket ON!

[AmigOne]

Among all the good advice it had never crossed my mind to fly close to the deck to avoid the thermals. Does anybody else use this technique? , how about the other advice fly high and near a road?. How about ATC, any issues there?.

Some of you maybe familiar with this list of emergency/survival equipment listed on the FAA desert flying guide. Are all these items really necessary?.

As to 5T6, Dave has already suggested to stop at Dona Ana so you are on.

Adhesive tape (waterproof)

Antibiotic ointment (e.g., 3 in 1 First Aid OintmentTM) Antiseptic swabs (8) should contain Iodine Band-Aids

Blood stopper bandages

Electrolyte tabs (20) (rehydration mix)

Gauze pads (10)

Gauze rolls

Heat bar

Insect repellent

Latex tourniquet

Lip balm/Sun screen

Liquid soap

Moleskin

Snake bite kit

Space blanket

Steri-Strip wound closures

Sun screen

Tongue blades

Triangular bandages (2)

Un-AspirinTM (25 pkgs.) (acetaminophen)

VisineTM or equivalent (e.g., Liquid TearsTM)

Water purification tabs

Water container

Waterproof matches

SIGNALING EQUIPMENT—MAF REQUIREMENT

Dye marker

Orange signal flag

Signaling mirror

VHF portable radio, with spare alkaline battery pack Whistle

REQUIRED MISCELLANEOUS ITEMS

Compass

Disposable lighter

First Aid Book

Flashlight

Immediate Action Card

Swiss knife or pocket knife

USAF Survival Manual

NOTE: Some of the above items will have a shelf life.

SURVIVAL EQUIPMENT

Can Openers

Cook Stoves

Compass Crash/Fire/Rescue Book Emergency Blankets

[carqwik]

It's still very hot close to the deck...and there are big soaring birds (hawks, vultures, etc.) riding thermals in the way....

[kmyfm20s]

It's still very hot close to the deck...and there are big soaring birds (hawks, vultures, etc.) riding thermals in the way....

The vultures would be the result of the last guy flying low:) I didn't say I necessarily recommend it for anyone, but it does work. Thermals obviously accelerate as they gain altitude until they dissipate, so the least amount of rising air is down low and up high and of course the worst somewhere in between. I was flying home from Idaho one time and stopped in Ely, NV. I landed to top off with fuel, use the restroom and take a break from the constant turbulence from the thermals. I happen to talk to a guy that just landed before me and commented to him about the bumps. He told me that he flys the area all the time doing wildlife surveys but is doesn't get the bumps too bad because he is low. So I took off and stayed on the deck and no bumps! It was a lot of fun as well but you will get hot. Also if you do it over a field you will get tons of bugs. It is just a trick in the bag that I use sometimes when I get unsettled from hours of turbulence from the thermals.

[BigTex]

I for one would not want to be flying low and fast near the border. When you land, you'll likely be greeted by guys in those tan flight suits!