Part Problem for Engine Continental TSIO360SB2B

[Stefan Moehringer]

Dear mooney colleagues, 

I have a problem with an ordered new Continental engine and it would be great if you could help my in this case.
I had an engine failure with my mooney in February 2024 and luckily, I could land safely on a field without any damage. The engine has major defects and already more the 2000 hours, which made it not viable to get repaired.
Therefore I ordered a factory new engine TSIO360SB2B at Continental via the dealer Air Power. The delivery time should have been mid of November 2024. Short before delivery, Air Power informed me that Continental has one component missing, so they cannot complete the engine and they want to cancel the order.
I did not agree, because I need a new engine. Since then, we have a long discussion with long waiting time for answers. Basically, the missing part is the throttle body, Continental p/n 646999-3
We still have this throttle body from our old engine, and according to my maintenance company in Germany, the part is in good condition. Therefore I suggested to Continental to use this part and change the order to a factory-rebuild engine instead of a new engine. 
After more the 2 months, I still do not have an answer whether we can do like proposed.

I am grounded since almost 1 year now and I need a solution.

Do you think, using the existing part from the old engine and build it into a factory-rebuild engine is possble?
Do you have any idea how to get this throttle body on the market as a new part?
Do you have any other suggestion for me, how I can get either a new or and overhauled engine TSIO360SB2B.

Thank you for your help and comments,

best regards, Stefan 

 

 

[Fritz1]

Convoluted indeed, you have a core that has at least a good throttle body and want to purchase a rebuilt engine, call another conti dealer, call an overhauler like firewall forward, and last not least call the office of the president of Teledyne Continental, you are a customer and want to buy something, demand to speak to the office manager or chief of staff, get the name of the president, fire off a succinct letter via email and fax, letter to the president can't be swept under the rug, it will trickle down in the organization and you will have an answer in no time

[Fritz1]

Western Skyways in Colorado is another conti overhauler

[MikeOH]

1 hour ago, Fritz1 said:

Convoluted indeed, you have a core that has at least a good throttle body and want to purchase a rebuilt engine, call another conti dealer, call an overhauler like firewall forward, and last not least call the office of the president of Teledyne Continental, you are a customer and want to buy something, demand to speak to the office manager or chief of staff, get the name of the president, fire off a succinct letter via email and fax, letter to the president can't be swept under the rug, it will trickle down in the organization and you will have an answer in no time

Better write that letter in Chinese.

[Aerodon]

My understanding is that if you order a factory reman, then you get an engine for slightly less $$, but may have mostly new parts anyway.  In the past, urban legend has it that some people received new engines.

Perhaps if you offered to pay a 'new engine price' but would accept a 'reman engine', that would allow them to put that used part on?

Or,

I have a mostly complete TSIO360MB1 that could be overhauled.  Or be used to donate parts to have yours overhauled?

Aerodon

 

 

 

 

 

[Stefan Moehringer]

Hi Fritz1, hi Aerodon,

thank you for your comments and help.
I probably need to make more pressure to Continental directly, you are fully right.

For pure repair of the old engine, it will be more economic to let do it in Germany where I am based.
Repair of an old engine with 2200 hours makes not really sense, but if I cannot move forward with Continental to get a solution for the ordered engine, I may not have a better choice. 

Thanks, Stefan 

 

[Aerodon]

You said your engine stopped without any further damage.  If the failure was a fuel related problem, there should be no issues with overhauling a 2200 hour engine.  If it was oil starvation, it does get more complicated - bearings etc.  And if it was more catastrophic than that, you still have a 2200 hour engine, logbook and data-plate.  Any part can be replaced to make you and your overhauler happy.

I have an 1850 hour engine that was removed in running condition.  The engine can be overhauled, or I am willing to part out, starting with the major components.

Don

 

 

[Stefan Moehringer]

Hi Don,

I wanted to say, no further damage to my mooney beside the engine.
The engine has 2 damaged cylinders with following damages...so more catastrophic unfortunately.
That is why I decided to go for a new engine.

This is interesting to hear that you have an 1850 hour engine, removed in running condition.

What would be the costs for a complete overhaul of your engine, including reset of running hours to zero?

[Wingover]

1 hour ago, Stefan Moehringer said:

Hi Don,

I wanted to say, no further damage to my mooney beside the engine.
The engine has 2 damaged cylinders with following damages...so more catastrophic unfortunately.
That is why I decided to go for a new engine.

This is interesting to hear that you have an 1850 hour engine, removed in running condition.

What would be the costs for a complete overhaul of your engine, including reset of running hours to zero?

Why not let PMM in Belgium rebuild it?

[kortopates]

Hi Don,
I wanted to say, no further damage to my mooney beside the engine.
The engine has 2 damaged cylinders with following damages...so more catastrophic unfortunately.
That is why I decided to go for a new engine.
This is interesting to hear that you have an 1850 hour engine, removed in running condition.
What would be the costs for a complete overhaul of your engine, including reset of running hours to zero?

Cylinders are easily replaceable. unless metal contamination damaged the bottom end that does not constitute catastrophic damage and may not have needed a full engine overhaul to repair.


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[Stefan Moehringer]

Thanks, I will get in touch with them

[Stefan Moehringer]

6 hours ago, kortopates said:

Cylinders are easily replaceable. unless metal contamination damaged the bottom end that does not constitute catastrophic damage and may not have needed a full engine overhaul to repair.


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Thanks, but unfortunately, metal contamination damaged the bottom end and there is also a crack which would need to be welded...thats why my maintenance shop recommended to go for a new engine...

[A64Pilot]

Issue I believe is they can’t just take a part off of an old engine and use it, it will have to be overhauled IAW the manufacturers overhaul manual, unless the FAA allows otherwise which I doubt.   

I did build several crop dusters with customer supplied yellow tagged engines and props, but only because the FAA specifically allowed those two items, a customer could have given me a brand new set of wheels and brakes and I couldn’t have used them.

[jlunseth]

I ordered a new TSIO360LB from TCM a couple of years ago. Supposed to take 8 months. More like a year. BTW the new engine costs was only about 7,000 more than the factory reman, and either one was far more expensive than a few years earlier. I finally got my engine and it is a nice one, but the plane was down for more than a year.

[Pinecone]

FYI, the only way to get a zero time engine is to buy one from the factory.  Either a New one or a Factory Remanufactured one.   Anything else is an Overhauled or IRAN and the clock keeps ticking.